Condensation

[nina]

This has probably been asked already so apologies for asking again. How do you reduce condensation on your boat and does having a.........can't think what it's called........a fan that sits on top of the stove help? I notice that the windows near the stove are dry but towards the rear of the boat, they are very wet. Also, I used a teak oil in preparation for this Winter, on the wood surrounding the windows inside the boat. It's works well but it drank the oil very quickly. Is there any other recommended product that preserves the interior wood of the boat. The heat and condensation must take it's toll.

 

Thankyou for any tips.

[Guest]

One of the biggest sources of condensation will be the crew and your LPG appliances. So if you don't stay on the boat or cook on it you won't get any...just joking...I've always resigned myself to having a fair bit at this time of year especially around cold aluminium parts like the window frames.

 

It goes with the territory.

 

If on shoreline I suppose you could consider a dehumidifier....

 

I have an opinion on 'the fan that shall not be named' but expressing it normally sparks a cassette v pump-out type debate so I'll refrain from saying don't waste your money....

[mrsmelly]

 

 

I have an opinion on 'the fan that shall not be named' but expressing it normally sparks a cassette v pump-out type debate so I'll refrain from saying don't waste your money....

 

DONT WASTE YA MONEY............snake oil.....

[bottle]

Condensation is simply the water vapour in the air, condensing on a cold surface, to eliminate condensation, eliminate cold surfaces.

 

Teak oil is good but regular application is required.

It's works well but it drank the oil very quickly.

to be expected if not been done for some time.

 

The fan on top of the stove (Ecofan) may help to distribute the heat further down the boat, so may help to warm the cold bits and so reduce condensation.

 

Do not forget that ventilation is always required.

 

Doubtful you will completely eradicate condensation, just reduce it.

[nina]

Thankyou for your help. So teak oil is OK for the wood but I need to use it more often, that's great, thankyou.

 

Condensation is just all part of being on a boat so that's fine, can live with this.

 

Eco fan.........does it work? It's quite expensive so has anyone got one and found it works well enough to spend the money? Our boat is 62 feet although I like the bedroom to be cool so it doesn't have to work the whole 62 feet.

 

Thanks again.

[Guest]

Thankyou for your help. So teak oil is OK for the wood but I need to use it more often, that's great, thankyou.

 

Condensation is just all part of being on a boat so that's fine, can live with this.

 

Eco fan.........does it work? It's quite expensive so has anyone got one and found it works well enough to spend the money? Our boat is 62 feet although I like the bedroom to be cool so it doesn't have to work the whole 62 feet.

 

Thanks again.

 

We have found it makes no difference what so ever to the heat distribution and the rear part of our boat needs the Webasto on to warm it up.

 

Others claim they work - my advice would be to borrow one from someone if you can and try it yourself and form your own opinion before spending nigh on £100

[Naughty Cal]

To reduce condensation you need to ensure good air flow though the boat. This neednt mean that the boat is cold however. We keave our windows and hatches cracked open the whole time that we are onboard and the boat doesnt feel cold, the heating compensates and we dont suffer with condenation. Reducing the amoutn of water vapour you create is also worth looking at, For example putting lids on pans whilst cooking on the stove.

[Boaty Jo]

I've sent you some light reading via PM

[jonny]

This has probably been asked already so apologies for asking again. How do you reduce condensation on your boat and does having a.........can't think what it's called........a fan that sits on top of the stove help? I notice that the windows near the stove are dry but towards the rear of the boat, they are very wet. Also, I used a teak oil in preparation for this Winter, on the wood surrounding the windows inside the boat. It's works well but it drank the oil very quickly. Is there any other recommended product that preserves the interior wood of the boat. The heat and condensation must take it's toll.

 

Thankyou for any tips.

The Eco Fans do work and you can prove this by simply checking with a thermometer, the trouble is that you have to have your stove so hot to move the blades quikenough you need to open doors and windows to breathe, plus all that coal!

 

I find that ventilation seems the best solution and enableing air to move easily around the boat should help.

[nina]

Thankyou for your help everyone. And you too Boaty Jo, got your PM. Thankyou:-)

[trackman]

Remember that just burning LPG makes water, because all forms of LPG have hydrogen in them. As the hydrogen burns it creates water, and being created in a hot flame, this appears as water vapour. If the burner is open to the atmosphere, as with a gas hob or oven, this vapour disappears into the air in your boat. Any attempt to get rid of condensation by burning LPG on an open burner (rather than a room sealed device like an Alde boiler) will worsen the condensation problem not cure it. All hydrocarbon fuels are similar in this respect, including diesel and petrol, but the others are not usually burnt in open flames on boats like LPG.

 

This is why carbon fuelled stoves create dryer heat than open gas fired devices. Of course, room sealed gas boilers are OK because they exhaust outside the boat and so get rid of the water vapour harmlessly. On my boat it's really noticeable how boiling the kettle on the gas stove really steams up windows that were clear before I lit the gas, doing so well before any steam could have come from the water in the kettle. Cooking with the oven can be even worse. Once the gas is off, the dry heat from the boatman's stove will gradually dry things out again unless the weather is really damp.

 

I'll support the pro Ecofan lobby. Ours made a real difference to the amount of heat getting through to the front of our cabin from our boatman's stove in the rear, and continues to do so each winter some 4 years after we bought it. It's a 57 foot trad boat so the cabin is about 40ft long.

 

 

[nina]

Remember that just burning LPG makes water, because all forms of LPG have hydrogen in them. As the hydrogen burns it creates water, and being created in a hot flame, this appears as water vapour. If the burner is open to the atmosphere, as with a gas hob or oven, this vapour disappears into the air in your boat. Any attempt to get rid of condensation by burning LPG on an open burner (rather than a room sealed device like an Alde boiler) will worsen the condensation problem not cure it. All hydrocarbon fuels are similar in this respect, including diesel and petrol, but the others are not usually burnt in open flames on boats like LPG.

 

This is why carbon fuelled stoves create dryer heat than open gas fired devices. Of course, room sealed gas boilers are OK because they exhaust outside the boat and so get rid of the water vapour harmlessly. On my boat it's really noticeable how boiling the kettle on the gas stove really steams up windows that were clear before I lit the gas, doing so well before any steam could have come from the water in the kettle. Cooking with the oven can be even worse. Once the gas is off, the dry heat from the boatman's stove will gradually dry things out again unless the weather is really damp.

 

I'll support the pro Ecofan lobby. Ours made a real difference to the amount of heat getting through to the front of our cabin from our boatman's stove in the rear, and continues to do so each winter some 4 years after we bought it. It's a 57 foot trad boat so the cabin is about 40ft long.

 

 

Thankyou. I do cook using gas like most. It's interesting because the cooker is next to the side hatch and I prefer to open it, winter or not, while I'm cooking to let the steam escape. My husband closes it saying it makes the boat cold (sigh!). But I knew I was doing the right thing keeping it open for the duration of cooking.

The condensation isn't too bad. I clean the windows most mornings. I'm still researching the ecofan.

[NB Alnwick]

Thankyou. I do cook using gas like most. It's interesting because the cooker is next to the side hatch and I prefer to open it, winter or not, while I'm cooking to let the steam escape. My husband closes it saying it makes the boat cold (sigh!). But I knew I was doing the right thing keeping it open for the duration of cooking.

The condensation isn't too bad. I clean the windows most mornings. I'm still researching the ecofan.

 

Keep the boat at a constant and comfortable temperature - we try to do that and we get no discernible condensation. Condensation only occurs when naturally moist and warmish air comes into contact with cold surfaces.

Edited December 16, 2011 by NB Alnwick

[ditchcrawler]

We have an ecofan and I think it spreads the heat in the lounge but it doesn't and I would not expect it to, warm the back end of the boat down the corridor. I don't think it would help with the condensation.

[Dominic M]

DONT WASTE YA MONEY............snake oil.....

One thing I love about freedom of speech is the right for people to be completely wrong, and act so publicly. This is a shining example.

[Guest]

One thing I love about freedom of speech is the right for people to be completely wrong, and act so publicly. This is a shining example.

 

Indeed...I love it too.

[Roger Gunkel]

Hi Nina,

Have a read of this thread, Condensation it may help you to understand a little more about condensation

 

Roger

[jelunga]

My hat is just thrown in the ring.

We have brass portholes only, a Houdini hatch in the forrard saloon, two side hatches and two pigeon boxes. The Houdini and 1 pigeon box has a wood shutter that fits in the hole designed to exclude light. We wrap bubble wrap over it. This reduces condensation in the pigeon box/Houdini by 90%. The side hatches have a bubble wrap outer curtain with a thick inner curtain velcroed on. This reduces cond and draught a lot. Our portholes have thick bungs that go in the hole with inner curtains. This helps retain heat. BUT the metal inside of the porthole still forms condensation like a lot.

Our main problem is the inside of the boat below and just above the water line in cupboards and behind sofas and mattresses. There we have discovered serious condensation and mould.

So a dehumidifier was obtained from Argos and now runs alternating between cabins. Costs 220watts to run. Luckily were are on a land line power supply otherwise it would be a non starter.

We also have a regular airing session to check for mould now.

But in conclusion, I feel you cannot win. Either you are warm with condensation or you are chilly with lots of ventilation and minimal condensation.

Or you have a boat made of a wonder material where the sides allow moisture and water to exit the boat and not return

[blackrose]

 

Do not forget that ventilation is always required.

 

 

Not having a dig at you bottle, but everytime condensation comes up "ventilation" always seems to be the response from the forum. However, we all know that our boats (are supposed to) have an adequate area of fixed non-closeable vents. So assuming they have, is anyone seriously suggesting we also leave windows open all night at this time of year?

Edited December 17, 2011 by blackrose

[nina]

Thankyou again to everyone for all their helpful posts & comments. It was minus 3 outside this morning so the last thing on my mind was condensation! :-) Getting the kettle on was the top priority.

[bottle]

Not having a dig at you bottle, but everytime condensation comes up "ventilation" always seems to be the response from the forum. However, we all know that our boats (are supposed to) have an adequate area of fixed non-closeable vents. So assuming they have, is anyone seriously suggesting we also leave windows open all night at this time of year?

 

 

I know.

 

Yes, we have at least one porthole open at all times in the bedroom and another in the engine/ back cabin area.

 

The boat is warm and the only condensation this morning was on the metal surround on the kitchen roof hatch, this has now gone.

[Albert Smith]

Using an eco fan on the woodburner in my cottage does circulate the heat, with stairs in the lounge the eco fan certainly warms the upstairs. Takes very little heat to get it going and it's still rotating in the morning. Not sure how efficient it would be in a narrow boat? Depends upon the layout and if it's open plan or has bulkheads. Yes, it is expensive but the benefits far outweigh the cost (in my case).

 

Albert.

[Roger Gunkel]

I know I sound like a cracked record repeating the same old things every time condensation threads start, BUT warm moist air and cold surfaces do not mix without producing condensation. No ammount of eco fans or increased heat is going to eliminate condensation as long as there are cold surfaces for it to appear on. When it comes to boats, people seem to ignore all the lessons learned and taken for granted over years of housing development.

 

It's all basic physics which is why modern housing has insulated cavity wall construction, double glazed windows and thick roof insulation. That keeps the warm air in the house away from the cold outside and stops heat and cold transfer.

 

If you live in a tin or grp tube with no barrier between inside and outside surfaces, then you will loose your heat and have severe condensation problems. If you heavily insulate ALL surfaces of your boat that have contact with the outside and double glaze all your windows then you eliminate nearly all condensation and retain your heat. You also need to reduce moisture production and maintain normal ventilation levels to allow fresh air to enter the boat. The ventilation will help drier air enter and also stop you suffocating

 

Don't under estimate the ammount of moisture produced on a boat from breathing, washing, drying clothes, cooking etc. A given volume of air can only absorb a certain ammount of moisture before it becomes saturated, and the volume of air in any boat will be a small percentage of that in a house for a similar moisture production. So the air in the boat will become saturated much sooner and any cold surface remaining will precipitate condensation.

 

Because cupboards and under bed areas are usually poorly insulated and ventilated on boats, they are usually major areas of condensation and mould build up so also need properly ventilating.

 

Finally, poor window, cabin wall and roof insulation will allow the warm air to rise and transfer out of the boat, while colder air from window glass, and colder surfaces will always descend being heavier, given constant cold draughts and air movement, most noticeable around your shoulders, back and legs when sitting near windows.

 

Roger

[mrsmelly]

One thing I love about freedom of speech is the right for people to be completely wrong, and act so publicly. This is a shining example.

 

:P

[bizzard]

I use a pressure cooker a lot during the winter too,a big saving on gas,and if you keep it just below blowing off pressure not much water vapor escapes and as long as you take the thing outside when opening it.

I also boil up my socks in.