Thames Promenade at Reading

[MtB]

Thames Promenade is the southern bank of the Thames for about a mile immediately upstream of Reading Bridge, the towpath side. The land along there is owned as I understand, by Reading Council who maintain it with a nice wide tarmac path so people can walk, cycle and generally enjoy the river.

 

Does anybody know the legal position regarding mooring there, please? Is there a legal 'right to moor' on Thames Promenade, or in fact any other bit of the public towpath on the Thames? If there is no legal right to moor, who controls mooring on the public towpath?

 

Ok it's a rather specific question but I'd rather not go into the reasons for asking, on a public forum.

 

Thanks in anticipation for any answers.

 

Mike

[Whitewater]

Thames Promenade is the southern bank of the Thames for about a mile immediately upstream of Reading Bridge, the towpath side. The land along there is owned as I understand, by Reading Council who maintain it with a nice wide tarmac path so people can walk, cycle and generally enjoy the river.

 

Does anybody know the legal position regarding mooring there, please? Is there a legal 'right to moor' on Thames Promenade, or in fact any other bit of the public towpath on the Thames? If there is no legal right to moor, who controls mooring on the public towpath?

 

Ok it's a rather specific question but I'd rather not go into the reasons for asking, on a public forum.

 

Thanks in anticipation for any answers.

 

Mike

 

Their is no simple answer. However the rule of thumb is,if it doesn't say no mooring on the towpath side it is generally considered ok to moor there, however the byelaws do state with the owners permission, so you could moor up and still be asked to leave...

 

As for the rest, no their is no legal right to moor up on the towpath...

[blackrose]

I thought it wasn't just about who owned the land you moor against, but also who controls the waterway that you moor on.

 

As such I think the EA specify 24 hours on all public moorings on the Thames. Of course one can stay longer at some out of the way places, or pay for several days at sites that charge a mooring fee, but apart from that I'm not sure if anyone has any other legal "rights to moor" as such?

[grahame r]

We were around Reading about a month ago for a few days and moored ar various places either side of Caversham Lock. Almost everywhere we stopped there was a legal notice saying that the Council had a court order banning one individual + 4 unnamed others from mooring anywhere in that area (there's a map detailing the actual area). I guess the implication is that moving you on is a lengthy and complicated process involving a court and also that if you piss the Council off enough, they are prepared to go through that process.

[bizzard]

We were around Reading about a month ago for a few days and moored ar various places either side of Caversham Lock. Almost everywhere we stopped there was a legal notice saying that the Council had a court order banning one individual + 4 unnamed others from mooring anywhere in that area (there's a map detailing the actual area). I guess the implication is that moving you on is a lengthy and complicated process involving a court and also that if you piss the Council off enough, they are prepared to go through that process.

Caversham,used to be where the old Thames Conservancy HQ was.Is that premises now EA? If so maybe the powers that be are too close for comfort.I sometimes launched or fished out my Mirror dinghy at the ramp there. Move up a bit to Tilehurst,Mapledurham,good train spotting,on the bridge to the Roebuck. bizzard.

[Whitewater]

I thought it wasn't just about who owned the land you moor against, but also who controls the waterway that you moor on.

 

As such I think the EA specify 24 hours on all public moorings on the Thames. Of course one can stay longer at some out of the way places, or pay for several days at sites that charge a mooring fee, but apart from that I'm not sure if anyone has any other legal "rights to moor" as such?

The EA only state 24hr on their moorings. however who ever owns the bank also owns the bed and soil to the centre of the river... so unfort the EA doesn't have much control

[Steilsteven]

As riparian owners, Reading Borough Council ( with the approval of E.A. as suitable ) have the right to allow or dis-allow mooring to their bank.

They also, as owners, have the right to impose a charge if they wish.

 

Not too many years ago there were no mooring signs along the entire length of Caversham Prom.

 

When Reading Festival is on, the organisers don't allow mooring there and with good reason, although one or two boaters ignore this.

 

If you're talking about the stretch between the bridges, I'm not too sure who owns what.

 

Keith

Edited August 1, 2011 by Steilsteven

[MtB]

As riparian owners, Reading Borough Council ( with the approval of E.A. as suitable ) have the right to allow or dis-allow mooring to their bank.

They also, as owners, have the right to impose a charge if they wish.

 

Not too many years ago there were no mooring signs along the entire length of Caversham Prom.

 

When Reading Festival is on, the organisers don't allow mooring there and with good reason, although one or two boaters ignore this.

 

If you're talking about the stretch between the bridges, I'm not too sure who owns what.

 

Keith

 

Really? By what authority can the festival organisers choose to allow or disallow mooring on the Thames? Surely that is under control of Reading Council if they are riparian owners from what you say.

 

I was talking about the long stretch of open greenfield bank upstream of Reading bridge but downstream of the festival site. This stretch is called "Thames Promenade" Looks as though Reading Council and/or the EA probably control mooring along there then.

[mayalld]

Really? By what authority can the festival organisers choose to allow or disallow mooring on the Thames? Surely that is under control of Reading Council if they are riparian owners from what you say.

 

Presumably by delegated authority from Reading Council

[MtB]

We were around Reading about a month ago for a few days and moored ar various places either side of Caversham Lock. Almost everywhere we stopped there was a legal notice saying that the Council had a court order banning one individual + 4 unnamed others from mooring anywhere in that area (there's a map detailing the actual area). I guess the implication is that moving you on is a lengthy and complicated process involving a court and also that if you piss the Council off enough, they are prepared to go through that process.

 

This document?

 

[grahame r]

This document?

 

 

That's the boy, although it was vertical when I saw it last. This is an Order for Posession, granted by a court to Reading Council. I would imagine that it's reasonable to assume that Reading Council have the authority to grant or refuse mooring approval. I'd be interested to know if the No Mooring signs outside the new(ish) flats have any validity.

Edited August 2, 2011 by Lady Muck
bandwidth, please don't quote big images - LM

[Steilsteven]

This document?

 

Edited to remove linked image - LM

 

Ah! now I know what you're talking about.

This has been going on for about two years and now I see, from this document, that there's been a court ruling enabling the council to evict the persons mentioned and others who chose not to appear.

 

The area referred to, unless I'm very much mistaken, is the public park known as Hills Meadow which stretches from Reading bridge almost to Pipers Island on the Caversham side. This is definately the property of Reading Borough Council and, as I said above, as riparian owners they are entitled to impose a charge if they wish.

 

The ( basic ) history of this case is that a number of people decided that they would moor their boats permanently along this stretch and live on them. RBC tried to encourage them to move on by placing mooring fee signs along there, I don't know if anyone was sent to collect the fees, but I do know that the people concerned decided to put two fingers up to the council and ignore the signs. This attitude continued throughout this ridiculous fiasco. This attitude and complaints from local residents, forced the council to take action.

 

There are a number of other boaters, who live on their boats on this part of the Thames, who are not involved in this and refused to be part of it. They have always had the good sense to move on when told to do so. They don't have to travel far because just downstream of Kennet mouth comes under Wokingham District Council.

 

It was pure arrogance that caused this situation which could have been easily avoided.

 

Keith

Edited August 2, 2011 by Lady Muck
removal of large image file link

[Lady Muck]

Can we not quote images as large as this one? For boaters using dongles it means the pages take an awful long time to load. Thank you

[MtB]

Can we not quote images as large as this one? For boaters using dongles it means the pages take an awful long time to load. Thank you

 

 

My apologies for posting the large image in the first place. It has to be large so the text is legible but I agree, including the image in replies is plain daft.

 

Anyway this thread is getting dragged off topic. I do NOT mean Hills Meadow, I mean the mile-long stretch of river upstream of both Reading and Caversham bridges along towards the festival site and overlooked by the enormous posh houses in Caversham Heights on the north bank. The is called Thames Promenade.

 

I'm intrigued because last year at festival time I moored there and a group of festival security staff turned up on bicycles and instructed me to leave. They were clearly not going to take 'no' for an answer so for a quiet life I gave up and left.

 

It irritated me though and I think it is public mooring and festival time approaches again, hence my question.

[mayalld]

My apologies for posting the large image in the first place. It has to be large so the text is legible but I agree, including the image in replies is plain daft.

 

Anyway this thread is getting dragged off topic. I do NOT mean Hills Meadow, I mean the mile-long stretch of river upstream of both Reading and Caversham bridges along towards the festival site and overlooked by the enormous posh houses in Caversham Heights on the north bank. The is called Thames Promenade.

 

I'm intrigued because last year at festival time I moored there and a group of festival security staff turned up on bicycles and instructed me to leave. They were clearly not going to take 'no' for an answer so for a quiet life I gave up and left.

 

It irritated me though and I think it is public mooring and festival time approaches again, hence my question.

 

I suspect that the answer is that the term "public mooring" is something of a misnomer.

 

AFAIK, all Thames moorings belong to the riparian landowner, who is at liberty to charge or not and to allow or disallow mooring as he sees fit.

 

The fact that a local authority owns a mooring does not make it a "public mooring" that the public has an unalianable right to use, any more than the fact that a local authority owns a car park gives you a right to park there.

 

As far as I can see, Reading Council is the riparian landowner, and they choose to allow mooring part of the timem and to disallow it at other times, in conjunction with permissions that they have given for other uses of their land (such as the festival).

[Lady Muck]

I don't think they ever allow boaters to moor there at festival time, it's probably a requirement of their license that there are no boats there.

 

We moored there for three of four days this year, can't see any signs, no one came to collect money. There seems to be a mixture of cruising boats and liveaboards using those moorings.

 

There is plenty of riparian owned land (mostly farmland) on the Thames where fees are not collected but is often used by boaters.

Edited August 2, 2011 by Lady Muck

[Lady Muck]

Interesting article here, from 2005 , sheds some light on who owns parts of the bankside.

 

When this was written mooring was not permitted. If it isn't permitted now, it isn't enforced and there aren't any signs.

 

http://ww2.reading.gov.uk/documents/cultural-leisure/Thames_Parks_Plan_March05.pdf

[MtB]

Interesting article here, from 2005 , sheds some light on who owns parts of the bankside.

 

When this was written mooring was not permitted. If it isn't permitted now, it isn't enforced and there aren't any signs.

 

http://ww2.reading.gov.uk/documents/cultural-leisure/Thames_Parks_Plan_March05.pdf

 

 

Facinating document, thank you! I now see why my Council tax is so high.

 

Interesting sentence on Page 19 about mooring on Thames Promenade:

 

"There is, however, no mooring permitted on this stretch of the riverbank, except during the two annual festivals."

 

I take this to mean mooring IS allowed during the two festivals.

[Lady Muck]

Womad isn't held there anymore and Reading no longer includes the riverside in the festival.

 

Don't blame them, one of our relatives has been a freelance paramedic at that festival and describes it as a 'complete nightmare'

[Jim Batty]

Thames Promenade is the southern bank of the Thames for about a mile immediately upstream of Reading Bridge, the towpath side. The land along there is owned as I understand, by Reading Council who maintain it with a nice wide tarmac path so people can walk, cycle and generally enjoy the river.

 

Does anybody know the legal position regarding mooring there, please? Is there a legal 'right to moor' on Thames Promenade, or in fact any other bit of the public towpath on the Thames?

 

Thanks in anticipation for any answers.

 

Mike

We moored along there a few years back in a hire boat before returning the it to Caversham Island. No probs then.

 

Tangential comment: I've often wondered why Reading has sort of 'turned its back' on the Thames. The city centre and the river are so disjointed and not really very welcoming to boaters. Whereas Abingdon, for example, really welcomes us and I've met many boaters who spend a few extra days there (shopping, restaurant eating, etc.) because of their enlightened attitude. New moorings at Wallingford do the same. It wouldn't take a huge effort to tart up a walking route in from the towpath to the west end of Reading centre, attract a little 'cafe business' to the route and such.

[Max Sinclair]

Reading has for a long time had a nasty attitude to boaters which has lost the townsfolk a lot of business. This used to be the case in Droitwich but now the Council has seen the light and the result is wonderful.

[Tim]

There was an opportunity when the Oracle shopping centre was built, could have made it something like Banbury, but no, one way traffic, lets get the nasty boats out of the way as quickly as possible.

[MtB]

There was an opportunity when the Oracle shopping centre was built, could have made it something like Banbury, but no, one way traffic, lets get the nasty boats out of the way as quickly as possible.

 

 

Hmmm one way traffic is obviously rubbish or the K&A would either be jammed full of boats which couldn't get out, or completely empty

 

But I agree with your sentiment. Provision of mooring in the centre of the Oracle development would not have been difficult at the construction stage and would have added substantially to the image and utility of Reading for boaters. Most disappointing.

[Lady Muck]

It is such a schelp into town where ever you moor, that's for sure.

[MtB]

It is such a schelp into town where ever you moor, that's for sure.

 

You obviously haven't noticed the town centre mooring just downstream of High Bridge, bang opposite the traffic light where you wait to go upstream through the Oracle then, byt the back entrance to Queen's Road car park. Must be all of 60 yards from the town centre!

 

No-one notices it as they are all busy concentrating on the traffic light when going upstream, and still busy congratulating themselves for not hitting High Bridge when going downstream. Even we didn't notice it until last year despite walking past it hundreds of times when we've used the car park. DOH!

Edited August 2, 2011 by Mike the Boilerman