BW LAWS

[denboy]

Hi every one

Sat here on the bank side charging my batteries engine ploding along in gear and ive just had a BW lock keeper tell me i am breaking the law by running my engine in gear while i am tied to the bank is this true if so i think quite a few people are breaking the law

[Paula]

Yeah, I had heard that.....it washes away the banks? Not if it is piled.....

 

I remember reading it somewhere in some BW literature, that is was not allowed, but I'm not sure about breaking the law.

 

Paula XX

[Keeping Up]

Hi every one

Sat here on the bank side charging my batteries engine ploding along in gear and ive just had a BW lock keeper tell me i am breaking the law by running my engine in gear while i am tied to the bank is this true if so i think quite a few people are breaking the law

The lock keeper is probably right, although I'm not sure that it is necessarily breaking the law to disobey your BW licence conditions - no doubt someone on the forum will know the answer to that one. The BW licence conditions (pdf document) state:

 

4. You must not:

 

(a) use any electricity generator, including the Boat's engine, at any

British Waterways' mooring between 8pm and 8am, unless you

are moored in isolation, out of earshot of other people. We do not

intend this Condition to stop you moving the Boat from the mooring.

 

( run the Boat’s engine in gear when it is moored as this can

damage the waterway walls and cause a nuisance to other people.

 

Personally I get most upset with people who moor right next to me and then break rule (a).

 

Allan

Edited March 1, 2006 by Keeping Up

[aread2]

Why do folk run their engines in gear when they are charging batteries? I can't think of a good reason. I can think of a few to do it out of gear: higher revs = greater charge rate, lower load = more fuel economy.

[John Orentas]

Hi Denis.

 

I doubt if there is a 'law' regarding the matter but in some circumstances you could be damaging the bed of the canal also it can be intisocial at times when there are boats passing, I have been pushed into the weeds a time or two.

 

But why in gear anyway, is it to avoid engine sludging, glazed bores etc. All that is very subjective, personally I am very sceptical that being in gear and at tick-over would make any difference at all, apart from adding wear to your transmission system.

[denboy]

i run engine in gear to prevent bore glazing ive been told old engines need to be under strain to prevent this happening

[DHutch]

If your runing you engine to charge the batterys a lot (not saying you), maybe you need to consider geting a generator or windturnbine or somthing?

- Also, as mentioned on here before, its worth checking the revs you run at are spining the alternator fast enough. Many have found a small increase in engine revs ups the charge rate significantly, with negiliable affect on fuel consumption.

 

 

Daniel

[Bernie]

Over the years when boat is left idle over the winter period my OH goes up weekly to run the engine and keep batteries topped up, we have never run it in gear except when cruising and never had any problems.

[colinjw]

Over the years when boat is left idle over the winter period my OH goes up weekly to run the engine and keep batteries topped up, we have never run it in gear except when cruising and never had any problems.

 

Same here Bernie, in fact my boat has been left up tp 3 months and the engine still goes first time of asking.

 

I am a lot further away from my boat than you are but nevertheless, I don't need to run the engine unless I'm actually on the boat and cruising. I just make sure that the engine has had a good run before leaving it even if it means taking the boat out and going to the nearest pub. (A 1 hour trip or a 20 minute slow walk)

 

Apart from anything else, what is wrong with any boat that needs to charge batteries in gear going for a little jolly?

 

To Denis,

Apparently you can get deglazing mixture or something to stop that.

 

And another thing while I am on. The wash from a boat in gear can send your boat across the canal as has happened to me with a fella at Milford Wharf on the Staffs & Worcs on more than one occassion.

 

Colin

[enigma]

I'm a sad git and have a copy of BW's Bye-Laws!

 

"No person shall unless so authorised by the Board turn or caused to be turned the propeller or propellers of any vessel while such vessel is moored alongside any wharf, wall, bank or other work of the Board except as may be necessary for the proper navigation of the vessel."

 

Other Bye-Laws say: Your cannot commit a nuisance. Throw or discharge into the canal. No abusive, offensive, or threatening language.

 

The list covers all anti social behaviour.

 

BW will send you a copy if you ask for one.

 

Enigma

[bottle]

I'm a sad git and have a copy of BW's Bye-Laws!

 

"No person shall unless so authorised by the Board turn or caused to be turned the propeller or propellers of any vessel while such vessel is moored alongside any wharf, wall, bank or other work of the Board except as may be necessary for the proper navigation of the vessel."

 

Other Bye-Laws say: Your cannot commit a nuisance. Throw or discharge into the canal. No abusive, offensive, or threatening language.

 

The list covers all anti social behaviour.

 

BW will send you a copy if you ask for one.

 

Enigma

 

Nothing sad in that seems a very simple and sensible thing to do, perhaps if more 'boaters' did this a lot of problems would not arise.

 

Well done Enigma (perhaps you are )

[GUMPY]

 

Apparently you can get deglazing mixture or something to stop that.

 

Indeed you can and it works but its NOT cheap and its very difficult to get as they will only supply largish quantities.

Its called Ambesta Glazebuster by Morris Lubricants.

http://www.morrislubricants.co.uk/producti...?v06c41q7p6=FMH

 

The one time I have used it I ended up buying it off the local rep who got it on his company account as none of my local Morris oil stockists were interested.

I will say that it does work and has cleaned the 6cyl ford in the barge no end.

 

J

[denboy]

running my egine is far quieter than a generator whining away at the side of the banki would probably need a 5.5.kva gen to charge my btys 6 x 135 amps

[John Orentas]

running my egine is far quieter than a generator whining away at the side of the banki would probably need a 5.5.kva gen to charge my btys 6 x 135 amps

 

 

I think the idea is you should't do either, someone could probably find a bye-law prohibiting the use of noisy generators on the bank. Why not do what Colin suggests and take a short cruise every week or so.

 

It is not just the banks that may suffer damage, the puddling on the bed of the channel can be washed away.

Edited March 1, 2006 by John Orentas

[denboy]

we live on our boat and go out every weekend river permiting

[tony collins]

i run engine in gear to prevent bore glazing ive been told old engines need to be under strain to prevent this happening

 

 

I seem to remember this subject being raised in one of the forums/waterway mags and both Beta and Isuzu said that running in gear was not necessary. can't speak for Bollys and National etc... though

 

Tony

Edited March 1, 2006 by tony collins

[Hairy-Neil]

....... someone could probably find a bye-law prohibiting the use of noisy generators on the bank.

 

Most of these I've seen are non compliant with the Boat Safety Certificate rules anyway.....

 

 

 

And another thing while I am on. The wash from a boat in gear can send your boat across the canal as has happened to me with a fella at Milford Wharf on the Staffs & Worcs on more than one occassion.

 

Colin

 

I got a right ear'oling once when the butty was drawn across by the wash of a boat in gear and rattled against his boat, yet it was his prop running when tied up that caused the problem. An empty butty at slow speed past moorings has little enough steerage as it is.

[DHutch]

...i would probably need a 5.5.kva gen to charge my btys 6 x 135 amps

Five and a half KVA!! What alternator have you got man!

 

 

- even 120 amp alternator is is only what, less than 1.5KVA

 

 

We have a 1kva genny which will happy run a industry hoover, and 700watt drill and near on full load, and the 25amp (24v) battery charger... ...and probberbly some more...

 

but whatever

[Clarissa]

The common knowledge says to run a diesel under load, because running out of gear at low revs will glaze the cylinder bore. It is certain that diesel engines are designed to be run under load. For example my Beta thirteen and a half hp is basically an industrial freezer power unit and is designed to be run at nearly full throttle. I am almost over powered because the boat feels too pressed at nearly full throttle and perfect at two thirds, so I might have been happy with the Beta ten hp which would spend more time at closer to full throttle. Six knots is a bit tense... . (grin)

[denboy]

Five and a half KVA!! What alternator have you got man!

- even 120 amp alternator is is only what, less than 1.5KVA

We have a 1kva genny which will happy run a industry hoover, and 700watt drill and near on full load, and the 25amp (24v) battery charger... ...and probberbly some more...

 

but whatever

i have a 160 amp american alternator monsterous thingrunning of tw0 18 in pulleys when it clicks in the engine knows and a adverc 40 amp charger that won t run on any generator under 3.5 k

[khaffra]

i have a 160 amp american alternator monsterous thingrunning of tw0 18 in pulleys when it clicks in the engine knows and a adverc 40 amp charger that won t run on any generator under 3.5 k

 

 

Surely this would mean your engine would be running under a fairly large load even out of gear?

[TimYoung]

I seem to remember this subject being raised in one of the forums/waterway mags and both Beta and Isuzu said that running in gear was not necessary. can't speak for Bollys and National etc... though

 

Tony

 

Tony, I can only speak for Bolinders on this point. A Bolinder does not like to idle for any length of time off load. The general idea is you put the lamp on for 7 odd minutes, kick it off, they generally start and idle best in reverse, turn off the lamp, pull out your mooring pins, shove off, jump on, reverse into forwards, shove in the clutch and go.

 

You should still have some of the heat from the lamp in the hotbulb keeping ignition going until things warm up.

 

If you try to idle one off load, particularly if it hasn't been running long, the smoke starts to go white and the running gets very erratic and the engine goes out. Not recommended as it will by now be too cold to kick off and will need the lamp on again.

 

Tim

[gralyn]

i run engine in gear to prevent bore glazing ive been told old engines need to be under strain to prevent this happening

 

The laod of your altenator is enough!

[Glennbrown]

I now dont really run my big thorneycroft 155-noisy-heavy diesel consuption!

 

I have a Honda eu 3000i (on my mooring) feeding a sterling 3000w combi unit The genny is wisper quiet 49db with an eco throttle that matches revs to load. The way i see it seems little point in running a £9000 engine for battery charging and the £2k genny even is cheaper on fuel

[GRPCruiserman]

I was once moored in Skipton some years ago when I had my Norman 20 when at 10.30pm, the Narrow Boat who was moored up behind me decided he would start his engine and run it in gear.

 

Moorings were limited so I was pretty much up to his stern.

 

I was just nodding off to sleep having had a long day and was very tired. He filled my boat with smelly diesel fumes and the boat felt like it was on the north sea with the current. My ropes were straining on the rings.

 

It was so noisy that the people in the flat next to the towpath came out on their balcony and after getting dressed we had quite a chat. Apparently he had done this for the previous two nights and kept them awake as well.

 

He hadn't even opened his back doors to see what was happening, and had started his (trad stern) engine from the inside. He also did not respond to any knocking on the outside of his boat.

 

My current engine doesn't even charge my battery and I manage with lights, water pump, TV, etc for at least three days on an 85Ah battery which I take home and charge. (I have two).

 

They required charging on my holiday in August but marinas are usually willing to do this for a small fee.

 

If you need a lot of electricity, buy more batteries, and a larger alternator to top them up when you cruise.

 

If the guy in Skipton had discovered his electricity issue the night before, then why not go for a trip during the day?

 

I quite applaud the rule about not running an engine in gear when tied up. You should try driving past in a 16 foot GRP with Niagra falls blasting across the canal. People used to wonder why I needed a 20HP engine!!

 

A quiet generator, I have NO problem with, or a run of an engine during the day for an hour or so, NO problem (out of gear), but blasting the canal when tied up or running an engine at 10.30pm, well, that's just not on, especially when done at the same time.

 

As for coking up, you should try running a two stroke slowly most of the time!!

Edited March 6, 2006 by GRPCruiserman