Eberspacher Query

[Old Son]

My Eberspacher is about 4 years old but has only run for about 12 hours. The boat has taken a long time to build!!! I ran the system up yesterday. It ran great and the boat was lovely and warm.

 

Today I pressed the start button, the fan ran and I heard the pump ticking but only slowly. The unit seemed to fire on one occassion but the longest it ran was 1 minute. The unit blew out some blue smoke on shut down (not very much though).

 

Can anybody advise of the reason it won't keep running? If its this much agro after 12 hours running, perhaps I should consdier ripping it out???

[Ray T]

We have one in our boat. The boat had stood on brokerage for about 4 years, I doubt the heater was run at all in that period.

 

After we bought the boat the Eberspacher was very temperamental, some occasions it would run others not. After about 2 months it gave up completely.

 

I had it serviced at Carwoods in Coventry, who are Eberspacher agents mainly dealing with lorry cab Eberspachers.

 

Since then I have regularly run it for 1/2 an hour once a week- even in summer and have not had any problems. It was serviced 18 months ago.

 

I think they need running fairly regularly.

 

A good little video on servicing Eberspacher's here:

 

Edited January 30, 2011 by Ray T

[Bimbly1]

Today I pressed the start button, the fan ran and I heard the pump ticking but only slowly. The unit seemed to fire on one occassion but the longest it ran was 1 minute. The unit blew out some blue smoke on shut down (not very much though).

 

After four years it may need servicing. Especially if it has only been run for short periods and has got coked up.

Mine is over four years old and has never liked being left unused for long. Invariably when I fire it up after not using it for a while, it fails after about a minute. I wait for it to stop all activity, (about two - three minutes), and restart it. I get lots of smoke from the exhaust for a minute or so but it usually fires and goes ok. It starts first go if used within the previous 24 hours.

 

Hope this helps.

[Bobbybass]

Not sure what model you have..?

The pump should not run slowly...it has to inject a measured amount of fuel into the heater.

There is nothing else that controls this amount of fuel...it is solely the metering pump.

There could be a blockage of some kind in the injector pipe..?

I will say the following...and state that it is 'only my opinion and I will not be held responsible'

I think...as others say..it may just be coke.??

In order to check if fuel is coming out of the pump into the unit...you need to make sure the glowplug is not running..( because you dont want loose fuel and an ignition source) ...but you still need a load as if the glowplug is there..

Remove the fuel pipe and put into a jar to catch the fuel.

Make yourself a dummy load...I use a 12volt cabin light bulb...and wire it in place of the glowplug...so the wire/bulb is not near the fuel..

You can then start the Eberspacher...you should hear the water pump and fan fire up...there is a delay as the control unit makes sure things are running and that there is a load for the glowplug...the pump will then start to tick...and you should see fuel going into the jar...

You will then see the dummy load..the bulb...click on and off..

If you are ...reasonably adept at these things...you can put a good quality meter across the power lead at the Eberspacher control unit...and read off the voltage..

If you have a good set of scales ( I use my Salter kitchen digitals) you can actually measure the amount of fuel collected...match it to the voltage you read off from the control unit...and compare it to a chart on the Eberspacher site to make sure you have the right amount of fuel.

The whole thing will shut down after about a minute...as it thinks there is fuel and a spark...but it does not see the signal from the sensor that tells it there is a flame.

 

If not run for a while..or you have just serviced it..you will get LOADS of white smoke from the exhaust. This is becyuase it soaks down from the unit and into the insulating 'bandage'..

Do NOT chicken out and stop the heater. You have to burn it off...it will go...but takes a...spectacular while!

 

You need to get to grips with the workings of it...but they are very good if you do so...and do the occasional decoke. Mine is now 14 years old...and well used.

I bought a spare 'centre boiler bitty' on Ebay...and rotate them for decokes..but about every 2 years..

Fire on the button..very happy with it

 

Good luck..

Bob

Edited January 30, 2011 by Bobbybass

[cariad]

i had similar symptoms as you describe, it turned out to be flat battery.

[Old Son]

Thanks for your replies. The unit is a Hydronic 10, 24V version. Battery is fully charged. I dont have any way of measuring the voltage at the control panel. Presumably just disconnecting the fuel line and running the unit as suggested wont do any good? It might clear a blockage?

 

I would like to get to know the insides of the unit but dont know how to check the various bits to check if they are faulty. I suppose I could run the fuel as suggested and retry. If that doesn't work perhaps a service? What parts are included in the service kit and will I need anything else?

 

Thanks again.

[blackrose]

How many and what size radiators was it running? A Hydronic 10 is a big unit that will easily coke itself up if it is under-utilised. The problem is that if it's only running say 4 rads then water will come back to the boiler still hot and the heater will shut itself down and not burn the fuel completely.

 

The other problem is that eberspachers are basically crap and that tends to mean they don't work very well! Sorry, but I had a Hydronic 10 and it packed up too.

Edited January 30, 2011 by blackrose

[steelaway]

Thanks for your replies. The unit is a Hydronic 10, 24V version. Battery is fully charged. I dont have any way of measuring the voltage at the control panel. Presumably just disconnecting the fuel line and running the unit as suggested wont do any good? It might clear a blockage?

 

I would like to get to know the insides of the unit but dont know how to check the various bits to check if they are faulty. I suppose I could run the fuel as suggested and retry. If that doesn't work perhaps a service? What parts are included in the service kit and will I need anything else?

 

Thanks again.

 

 

Hi

 

Try it by starting the engine first, they take a large current and need maximum voltage at startup.

Ignore the smoke it will settle down after about 10 minutes.

They do need servicing about every two years but are pretty simple once you understand the principle.

Check that the air intake filter is clear and the exhaust is not blocked - they need alot of air through to work properly, also check the tiny fuel filter inside the fuel pump inlet.

 

Alex

[Old Son]

It is running 4 large radiators and a towel rail. I have a 64' boat.

 

Surely 'crap'is a bit hard. There seem to be more people who have good things to say than bad.

 

I run mine on white diesel by the way.

[Gibbo]

Surely 'crap'is a bit hard.

 

I've got a Mikuni, which is basically the same thing. I think the word "crap" is perfectly apt.

 

There seem to be more people who have good things to say than bad.

 

I beg to differ

[Doorman]

My Eberspacher is about 4 years old but has only run for about 12 hours. The boat has taken a long time to build!!! I ran the system up yesterday. It ran great and the boat was lovely and warm.

 

Today I pressed the start button, the fan ran and I heard the pump ticking but only slowly. The unit seemed to fire on one occasion but the longest it ran was 1 minute. The unit blew out some blue smoke on shut down (not very much though).

 

Can anybody advise of the reason it won't keep running? If its this much agro after 12 hours running, perhaps I should consider ripping it out???

 

I installed an 'Eberspacher Hydronic 4' diesel heater on our first boat and followed the installation instructions to the word. I also serviced the heater annually.

 

After leaving the boat for two months last winter, I found that I had to coax the heater into action, allowing it 3 attempts to start itself, then, if it failed on the third go, I'd leave it for thirty minutes before re-starting. Once it fired up, I'd leave it running for two hours minimum, just to burn any residual coke from around the glow plug or flame detection device. After that, it would fire up as normal.

 

One point that often gets overlooked by boaters, is that the heaters need to operate at a minimum of one hour, in order for them to reach optimum running temperature and not coke-up.

A good tip that I've heard from our local engineer, is to use oven cleaner to decoke the combustion chamber when servicing the heater.

 

Our current boat has a Mikuni M40 diesel heater that is much quieter than the Eberspacher and touch wood, appears to be more reliable

 

Mike

[nb Innisfree]

Whether red or white diesel I think sulphur is the enemy of these kinds of heaters. Our Mikuni was crap for 4 years smoking and refusing to start and after tearing my hair out and replacing everything with no improvement it then started behaving itself, the only thing that can have changed is low sulphur diesel coming onto the market.

[Old Son]

Well at least 7 responders 'appear' to be satisfied with their heaters. 2 have provided negative comments.

 

What else is available? It seems very strange to me that something that costs so much to purchase can cause so much hassle to keep running. I am hoping this is a blip and, subject to me using the right fuel and servicing regularly and running for at least an hour on a monthly basis the unit will perform as designed.

[steelaway]

Well at least 7 responders 'appear' to be satisfied with their heaters. 2 have provided negative comments.

 

What else is available? It seems very strange to me that something that costs so much to purchase can cause so much hassle to keep running. I am hoping this is a blip and, subject to me using the right fuel and servicing regularly and running for at least an hour on a monthly basis the unit will perform as designed.

 

 

Hi

 

Most people hate these because they dont understand how they work and that you have to service them - Its a sophisticated bit of kit - a solid fuel stove takes no maintaining.

They can be frustrating but since I understood how they work it has been touble free.

The cost of parts and serviceing can be horrendous but I think thats its the auto electricians taking advantage of peoples ignorance.

I can strip and rebuild mine inside 1 hour.

Mine is not used at all during the winter months, but I use it at both ends of the season without much problem.

It might just need a de-coke.

 

Alex

[bottle]

I also run a Hydronic 10 (not very often) always run for a minimum of an hour, just push one button on the controller.

 

Not had any problems yet. (fingers crossed )

 

Cannot advise on solution but as said before have your engine running (above tickover) when attempting to start it, this should eliminate a battery problem (I know you said it was fully charged).

 

When you have it running, ensure that your radiators and towel rail are 'balanced', a 10ºC drop in temperature across the inlet and outlet,

[Tim]

I am happy with my D5.

[Bobbybass]

Me again...!!

 

All good stuff here....

Someone did say..check the filter...and I forgot about that.

On the inlet..or is it outlet..?..of the metering pump is the world smallest fuel filter..

It is where the pipes attach to the unit...worth checking that for blockage.

Remove the pump and do that on a work surface....its a pig to find if you drop it into the bilge !!

 

Funny old things Eberspachers...like Marmite..you love them or hate them...

I love mine....and as someone else said here...I attached it to the bulkhead by wingnuts..and can remove...strip and rebuild in about an hour...

I found a guy on Ebay....something like 4by4Andy ?? or 4x4Andy..?

He does secondhand bits and is great...knows his stuff...

I bought a whole decoked body from him for £35 and when my air fan went..I had one (secondhand) next day for £40. Eberspacher charge about £240 for one you have to modify..

 

If I find his name on Ebay..I'llpost again..

 

Yup...here he is..Andy : 07 84 355 61 07

 

There is a big fault..that is not the case here...and that is the main fuse holder for the glowplug. Becuase it carries a large current...16amp..the springs on each end of the fuse heat up..and over time cease to be springy.

You can keep bending them..but they will work loose again. I fitted 2 thick cables and put them into an external fuseholder..that hangs outside of the control box. This has made an amazing difference in reliabilty and funny shutdowns and is also easy to replace the fuse if it goes..although mine doesn't now I have made this 'mod'

 

Bob

Edited January 31, 2011 by Bobbybass

[Neil TNC]

I've got a Mikuni, which is basically the same thing. I think the word "crap" is perfectly apt.

 

 

 

I beg to differ

 

Yeah...it's Mrs TNC's crap problem now!

Me, I have great hopes for my SH £120 Haworth Heating 24v pressure jet diesel boiler...just the 12Kw

Here it is running full chat...smokey..NOT!

(appologies for non BSS compliant fuel delivery system)

[Bricksh]

I have the hydronic 10, and that went wrong when we first got the boat. Sounds similar circumstance to others, ie it had been stood for quite a time in brokerage, ran when tested, then failed soon after. The most annoying thing for me, apart from trying to access the thing, is that when it does fail to run up it triggers a fault code, which you are not able to see without a diagnostics box. Some faults lock the thing up and will then not allow it to start. You can't seem to borrow one of these boxes and have to rely on auto alectricians. By the time mine was sorted out, it had cost me more than a new unit and relations between the auto electricans and myself were strained to say the least (it took them 5 months!). One of the things they did throw in, again mentioned previously, was that the hydronic 10 is too big for most narrow boats and that this was part of the problem.

 

Since eventually getting it working, we have run it regularly without any issues. I dread pulling the thing out to service it though, I think it was the first thing on the boat before the inverter, electrical panel, cupboards etc.

[Old Son]

Thanks for all the tips. Very useful to know and understand what issues others have had. I have noted Andy's contact details. Thank you Bob. These units are definately not fit and forget but if you are aware of that and you understand how they work maybe, just maybe these diesel heaters will perform with some reliability.

 

Lets hope I don't have to eat my words.

[Gibbo]

Just a quick addition.

 

People often say "Oh it's the installation that's critical" without ever actually saying what has be done what way.

 

I had my installation checked twice. No problems found.

 

In 3 years it ate more than twice its own value in spares.

 

3 water pumps - 100 quid each.

 

Two air motors, nearly 200 quid each.

 

Plus a whole host of other bits and pieces.

 

Normal brushed motors (which these are) have a life expectancy of 700 hours for a normal motor or 3000 hours for absolutely top quality, low power, long life ones. These are just bog standard motors.

 

700 hours. That's one month if you leave it on permanently. Though I doubt one of these heaters could last that long before something else broke.

 

Would you tolerate that in your central heating pump at home?

[Tony@Brighton]

I've had the hot-water version of the Eberspacher, the blown-air version and a blown-air Mikuni.

 

The hydronic was a nightmare: its control system seemed overcomplicated and needed resetting with the special adapter from time to time.

 

The blown-air version has been stable this winter thank goodness but frustratingly unreliable for the previous two.

 

As for the Mikuni, it just ate glow-plugs for breakfast!

 

The best boat heater I ever had was the Morso solid-fuel one: 100% reliable and warm as toast.

 

T o n y

[Old Son]

But the problem is you have to physically light the thing and then wait for ages for it to warm the boat. OK if you can keep it going in the cold months but not a lot of good for those cold mornings which turn into mild mid mornings and warm afternoons.

 

I suppose compromise is the answer.

[Neil TNC]

 

Normal brushed motors (which these are) have a life expectancy of 700 hours for a normal motor or 3000 hours for absolutely top quality, low power, long life ones. These are just bog standard motors.

 

 

 

How do you rate these brushed motors?

Parvalux Linky

[Doorman]

I've had the hot-water version of the Eberspacher, the blown-air version and a blown-air Mikuni.

 

The hydronic was a nightmare: its control system seemed overcomplicated and needed resetting with the special adapter from time to time.

 

The blown-air version has been stable this winter thank goodness but frustratingly unreliable for the previous two.

 

As for the Mikuni, it just ate glow-plugs for breakfast!

 

The best boat heater I ever had was the Morso solid-fuel one: 100% reliable and warm as toast.

T o n y

 

Agreed..!

 

There's a fellow moorer close to us, who's Mikuni also enjoys a glow-plug starter

 

Mike

Edited February 3, 2011 by Doorman