Difference between Owatrol and Waxoyl?

[luctor et emergo]

I'm looking at both Waxoyl and Owatrol, to treat the inside of the hull. Owatrol is more expensive than Waxoyl, but is it better? Is the penetration and rust convertion of Owatrol as good as they say on the website? Owatrol say 'not' to remove existing rust, other than loose rust, will it indeed 'cure' the existing rust?

 

I know waxoyl does not harden, but is it suitable for applicication in/under the living quarters?

 

I favour the Waxoyl, and it can be applied with a sprayer. But if the Owatrol is better at dealing with rust, I'll go for the greater expense.

 

Thanks

[WotEver]

I'll allow someone else to voice their opinion on which is better, but they are somewhat different in function.

 

Waxoyl is a viscous wax. In hot weather it's much more fluid than in cold weather, and it functions as a rust preventatve by smothering the metal and thereby excluding oxygen and moisture. I'd imagine that it will creep into all corners and crannies 'eventually' but I don't know how long 'eventually' would be. It remains a sticky viscous coating for its lifetime. Waxoyl will not stop rust immediately because it only covers the steel; it does not displace any moisture.

 

Owatrol Oil is very thin and will run into any corners and crevices easily. It sets into a flexible coating and does not remain as a fluid. It excludes rust in the same way as Waxoyl (by excluding water and air), but Owatrol will stop rust immediately because it displaces any moisture present on the surface of the steel.

 

I guess I've shown above (having firstly said that I wouldn't) that I favour Owatrol, but I remain open to arguments in favour of Waxoyl if any are forthcoming.

 

Tony

[boots]

.... It sets into a flexible coating and does not remain as a fluid.............

 

Tony

 

 

Just wondering - do you 'have' to paint over Owatrol - , if you painted inside gas lockers etc. how long would it last before the rust returned.....

[WotEver]

Just wondering - do you 'have' to paint over Owatrol...

Nope. http://www.owatrol.com/pdf/product-en-rustol-owatrol.pdf

 

Tony

[paulcatchpole]

... but I remain open to arguments in favour of Waxoyl if any are forthcoming.

 

Tony

 

 

You won't get any from me. I think Waxoyl is a better class of snake oil. I tried it on my Rangie, inside the box sections, and the black variant on the outside underbody and the enormous holes I had to let in new metal into two years later, didn't impress me. The second time around, I used a commercial body-shop alternative which worked *much* better over a similar time period.

 

I must confess to being sceptical of this love of the Owatrol stuff, but that's coming from not having tried it, so I'll reserve judgement....

 

PC

[soldthehouse]

It was brought to my attention recently in a conversation on waxoyl that what I thought of as waxoyl, while still available, is not the only waxoyl product. There seems to be an underseal like product that is black like oldfashioned underseal but has waxoyl in it. This may be the product that people use. I have to admit I think of waxoyl as a thin vaseline type product that smells like parafin, it probably is parafin wax i suppose, but this other product is probably a development. This is why some peoples opinions may vary as they may be talking about a different product to the next person.

[paulcatchpole]

It was brought to my attention recently in a conversation on waxoyl that what I thought of as waxoyl, while still available, is not the only waxoyl product. There seems to be an underseal like product that is black like oldfashioned underseal but has waxoyl in it. This may be the product that people use. I have to admit I think of waxoyl as a thin vaseline type product that smells like parafin, it probably is parafin wax i suppose, but this other product is probably a development. This is why some peoples opinions may vary as they may be talking about a different product to the next person.

 

 

Aye, that's why I mentioned both...

 

The clear stuff inside things, and the black stuff on the outside of things. I reckon both are old-hat-rubbish.

 

PC

[RLWP]

Aye, that's why I mentioned both...

 

The clear stuff inside things, and the black stuff on the outside of things. I reckon both are old-hat-rubbish.

 

PC

 

I disagree with you Paul. Having had to redo some sill work on my Midget, it was very noticeable which bits I managed to get the Waxoyl on as they were still intact. That's Waxoyl on top of two coats of red Hammerite primer.

 

None of them are going to protect against areas with standing water in my opinion

 

Richard

[nb Innisfree]

Thinning Waxoyl down with white spirit for the first application will improve it's 'creep'. I always understood it displaces moisture, similar to WD40. It can also be mixed with bitumen which then goes off without the stickiness.

[RobinJ]

Waxoyl is a viscous wax. In hot weather it's much more fluid than in cold weather, and it functions as a rust preventatve by smothering the metal and thereby excluding oxygen and moisture. I'd imagine that it will creep into all corners and crannies 'eventually' but I don't know how long 'eventually' would be. It remains a sticky viscous coating for its lifetime. Waxoyl will not stop rust immediately because it only covers the steel; it does not displace any moisture.

 

Owatrol Oil is very thin and will run into any corners and crevices easily. It sets into a flexible coating and does not remain as a fluid. It excludes rust in the same way as Waxoyl (by excluding water and air), but Owatrol will stop rust immediately because it displaces any moisture present on the surface of the steel.

I'll go along with that!

We have Waxoyl on the inside under the ballast and owatrol on the outside under the paint.

Waxoyl does move when its gets warm, but its taken about ten years to move six feet!

Owatrol normally dries like a varnish, I use it neat on new or exposed metal and mix it with the paint when patching up.

I have to say I'm happy with both.

We never have any sign of rust inside the boat (apart from the burst its always dry).

For the 18 months it took for the insurance to sort out repairs, the area was only protected by Owatrol, and the guy who repaired it could not believe it had been left that long.

[smileypete]

I'm looking at both Waxoyl and Owatrol, to treat the inside of the hull. Owatrol is more expensive than Waxoyl, but is it better? Is the penetration and rust convertion of Owatrol as good as they say on the website? Owatrol say 'not' to remove existing rust, other than loose rust, will it indeed 'cure' the existing rust?

 

I know waxoyl does not harden, but is it suitable for applicication in/under the living quarters?

 

I favour the Waxoyl, and it can be applied with a sprayer. But if the Owatrol is better at dealing with rust, I'll go for the greater expense.

How about red oxide paint? How much rust is there?

 

I'm not sure Owatrol is a rust converter as such.

 

cheers,

Pete.

[WotEver]

I'm not sure Owatrol is a rust converter as such.

Indeed not. For rust conversion where I can get at it I use Vactan. For rust prevention (or stopping) especially in inaccessible corners I use Owatrol.

 

Tony

[AlanH]

I'm looking at both Waxoyl and Owatrol, to treat the inside of the hull. Owatrol is more expensive than Waxoyl, but is it better? Is the penetration and rust convertion of Owatrol as good as they say on the website? Owatrol say 'not' to remove existing rust, other than loose rust, will it indeed 'cure' the existing rust?

 

I know waxoyl does not harden, but is it suitable for applicication in/under the living quarters?

 

I favour the Waxoyl, and it can be applied with a sprayer. But if the Owatrol is better at dealing with rust, I'll go for the greater expense.

 

Thanks

Waxoyl leaves a coat of wax on the surface of the steel whereas Owatrol hardens eventually to a sort of varnish. The wax from Waxoyl could cause problems if the area treated needs to be welded at any time particularly if it is covering the inside of a hull.

I've just done my engine bilge with Owatrol and it seems to be working. I chose Owatrol for the reason above and the fact that I often tread on the base plate in the bilge and I didn't want it slippery with wax.

[luctor et emergo]

I will use red oxide on the hull sides where the Kingspan will go back in, but I'm looking for a more resiliant solution for the floor, and hold. I'm going to use black for the sides of the (open)hold, because it will be more resiliant against moisture than red oxide, and can be easily touched up (and I have about 10 liters of it left ).

 

I have already cleaned the floors of loose rust and scale, and I suppose I could simply paint it with red oxide, but I would have to cover it with something else, and the red oxide does not prevent rust as wel as the other options. I like the fact that Owatrol readily creeps into all the awkward nooks and corners, because it is difficult to get right in and under the bearers and floor supports.

 

I did consider vactan, but as there is hardly any rust left that would need to be 'converted', I would prever to go for something more penetrating, to ensure it protects the areas that I can not easily get at.

[RLWP]

I will use red oxide on the hull sides where the Kingspan will go back in, but I'm looking for a more resiliant solution for the floor, and hold. I'm going to use black for the sides of the (open)hold, because it will be more resiliant against moisture than red oxide, and can be easily touched up (and I have about 10 liters of it left ).

 

I have already cleaned the floors of loose rust and scale, and I suppose I could simply paint it with red oxide, but I would have to cover it with something else, and the red oxide does not prevent rust as wel as the other options. I like the fact that Owatrol readily creeps into all the awkward nooks and corners, because it is difficult to get right in and under the bearers and floor supports.

 

I did consider vactan, but as there is hardly any rust left that would need to be 'converted', I would prever to go for something more penetrating, to ensure it protects the areas that I can not easily get at.

 

Recently we had a discussion about red oxide, and one of the varieties does not need overcoating with topcoat to prevent rust. Dunno which one mind.

 

If it were my boat, I'd get as much rust out as possible (including using a chipping hammer), treat the remaining rust with my favourite curative of the day, then give it a couple of coats of red oxide. Nice and clean, nothing to rub off on your clothes, simple colour that will show any defects.

 

If it were my boat

 

Richard

[Chertsey]

Recently we had a discussion about red oxide, and one of the varieties does not need overcoating with topcoat to prevent rust. Dunno which one mind.

 

If it were my boat, I'd get as much rust out as possible (including using a chipping hammer), treat the remaining rust with my favourite curative of the day, then give it a couple of coats of red oxide. Nice and clean, nothing to rub off on your clothes, simple colour that will show any defects.

 

If it were my boat

 

Richard

We've used Leyland zinc phosphate (red oxide effect) on Chertsey. It's sold as suitable for use as a primer with some rust-inhibiting qualities and as a finishing coat. It also comes in gloss finish which I think we might get for a final coat or two in the hold. It's reasonably priced (about £30/5l) and brushes on easily. It is very quick drying though, as we found out in the hot weather.

 

Someone said to us the other day, you know you should put more than one coat on, don't you... I replied that we've got six in the hold, and eight from the footings down.

[luctor et emergo]

Recently we had a discussion about red oxide, and one of the varieties does not need overcoating with topcoat to prevent rust. Dunno which one mind.

 

If it were my boat, I'd get as much rust out as possible (including using a chipping hammer) done that, treat the remaining rust with my favourite curative of the day, that's what I'm trying to do then give it a couple of coats of red oxide. This is what I'm trying to avoid, in a way. Not as a short cut, but why spend more money on extra layers of paint, if you can avoid it. If I can cover the floor in something that does not need to be over coated, I can simply keep an eye on it, and touch up as and when. With the hold being open, I will be checking, and maintianing it on a almost daily basis. The hold is going to have some water in it at times, but regular pumping, combined with it being open to the air, should mean that there will be very little 'standing' water. Nice and clean, nothing to rub off on your clothes, simple colour that will show any defects.

 

If it were my boat

 

Richard

[RLWP]

And that's fair enough. My experience of these things is nothing really works on it's own, and more is always better. I'm highly sceptical* that Owatrol will treat rusty metal and hold it in that state, even when it gets wet.

 

But it's your boat, and if it doesn't work all you have to do is empty the hold, wire brush the rust off and do it all again. No big deal really

 

Richard

 

*I'm highly sceptical about any single coat cure-all products

[luctor et emergo]

And that's fair enough. My experience of these things is nothing really works on it's own, and more is always better. I'm highly sceptical* that Owatrol will treat rusty metal and hold it in that state, even when it gets wet.

 

But it's your boat, and if it doesn't work all you have to do is empty the hold, wire brush the rust off and do it all again. No big deal really

 

Richard

 

*I'm highly sceptical about any single coat cure-all products

 

 

You are right. I'm not looking for a miracle solution, to be applied quickly, covered with a bespoke fit-out, and to be forgotten about for the next 20 years...

The maintanance of the hull will be an ongoing effort, which is in part why I don't really want to go and cover everything in multiple layers of paint. I will probably end up getting both, and see which works best in different applications...

 

So much for hoping to get a difinitive answer... :lol:

 

 

Thanks everybody.

[RLWP]

You are right. I'm not looking for a miracle solution, to be applied quickly, covered with a bespoke fit-out, and to be forgotten about for the next 20 years...

The maintanance of the hull will be an ongoing effort, which is in part why I don't really want to go and cover everything in multiple layers of paint. I will probably end up getting both, and see which works best in different applications...

 

So much for hoping to get a difinitive answer... :lol:

 

 

Thanks everybody.

 

As a dedicated fan of Waxoyl myself, I wouldn't use it for this job. You'll end up with the stuff wiped onto your clothing for ever. If you really want to do this, use the Owatrol as long as it hardens off

 

Richard

 

Although, as engineers have stopped metal rusting by painting it ever since Stephenson was a lad, I'm surprised you want to do something different

Edited July 6, 2010 by RLWP

[luctor et emergo]

As a dedicated fan of Waxoyl myself, I wouldn't use it for this job. You'll end up with the stuff wiped onto your clothing for ever. If you really want to do this, use the Owatrol as long as it hardens off

 

Richard

 

Although, as engineers have stopped metal rusting by painting it ever since Stephenson was a lad, I'm surprised you want to do something different

 

 

The waxoyl would only go on the floor, under the deck boards. I do not intent to roll on that floor (not sober anyway.. )

The reason I'm looking at Owatrol or Waxoylk is because it 'creeps' into those hard to get at places, which are hard to get at with ordinairy paint.

 

The hull sides are not really a problem, as the have only the knees to work around. No cross bearers or floor supports to get in the way. The sides will be painted with black.

[RLWP]

<snip>

 

The reason I'm looking at Owatrol or Waxoylk is because it 'creeps' into those hard to get at places, which are hard to get at with ordinairy paint.

 

<snip>

 

Again, as an experienced Waxoyl fan, I don't think it's going to creep into cracks quite as much as you think it will. I can believe if you mix it with a lot of white spirit, the white spirit will get in the gaps...

 

To give you some idea, if you drip the white waxoyl on the floor, it sits in big blobs. It doesn't spread out into an increasingly thin layer. I know this because every time I knock over the old mug with the paintbrush in that I have handy when putting old cars back together, I can scraped the waxoyl back into the mug with a scraper

 

Richard

[Chertsey]

The waxoyl would only go on the floor, under the deck boards. I do not intent to roll on that floor (not sober anyway.. )

The reason I'm looking at Owatrol or Waxoylk is because it 'creeps' into those hard to get at places, which are hard to get at with ordinairy paint.

 

The hull sides are not really a problem, as the have only the knees to work around. No cross bearers or floor supports to get in the way. The sides will be painted with black.

Paint can be poured behind knees etc. Or sprayed.

[RLWP]

Right, I've done a hexperiment for you.

 

One tin of clear Waxoyl:

 

 

A drop dropped (?!) onto a rusty lawnmower box:

 

 

And a side view of the drop of waxoyl:

 

 

In the second picture you can see the white spirit starting to creep, but I don't think it's going to go far. The more dilute it is, the further it will go, but the raw material doesn't flow far, you can see this from the third picture.

 

Diluting with white spirit and spraying is great for covering areas or for coating the inside of chassis members. I wouldn't choose it for flowing between knees and plates on a canal boat hull.

 

Richard

Edited July 6, 2010 by RLWP

[Guest]

I find that paint with plenty of Owatrol mixed in creeps a lot, especially behind masking tape. Might be worth trying in these areas?