Part identity help

[MarkCC]

Hi

BMC 1.5 

 

(note this isnt my engine image in this message but rather a general one as I couldn't get a decent one of mine in situ)  

The part circled I need help with. 

It provides part of the support for the alternator. 

Its unfortunately broken off, having looked carefully today it looks like it's part of a piece- rather than the engine block itself - probably do do with the coolant loop but also has the pulley for the alternator belt. 

Checked my manual and can't see it on there. 

if anyone knows what it's called and if it's a sourcable replacable part I'd be glad to hear the details. 

 

thank you 

 

Mark 

 

[David Mack]

Looks like it's part of the water pump.

https://www.jskautomotive.com/water-pump-for-bmc-15-1500-diesel-marine-engine-t

[MarkCC]

Thank you so much.

 

Probably saved me hours of looking. 

Instead I shall spend hours thinking about wether it's a DIY job or not. 

Then attempting it- it going wrong - and then spending weeks finding someone with the right skills. 

 

All good stuff!

 

Thanks again. 

 

[Tracy D'arth]

It is as you say, the water pump.  You need a new one or a good aluminium welder who can weld the piece back on.

 

I would be more concerned as to how it came to be broken off.

Be advised that there are 2 common designs of this pump and another very rare one. They are not interchangeable.

I would advise good photos of yours when you go to get a new one. Or better take the old one off first. The impeller inside can be the difference.

Its not a difficult item to replace.

4 screws to take the pulley off and 3 bolts into the engine block. There is a gasket which needs to fit back on a clean block face with either grease or gasket glue (Hylomar best) onto the pulley first then on the block.

[MarkCC]

Thank you for the confirmation. 

 

Not sure how or why I have put it down to old age - it was a fairly clean break. 

 

Mark

 

[David Schweizer]

Definitely the water pump, there were four different versions fitted over the years and some of the earlier ones were made of cast iron rather than aluminium. The cast iron ones are apparently more robust,  and are still available if you search. The engineer fitted one when he reconditioned the engine in Helvetia.

[Tracy D'arth]

1 hour ago, MarkCC said:

Thank you for the confirmation. 

 

Not sure how or why I have put it down to old age - it was a fairly clean break. 

 

Mark

 

I have never seen one broken. Was the alternator properly secured at all three points?

[David Schweizer]

44 minutes ago, Tracy D'arth said:

I have never seen one broken. Was the alternator properly secured at all three points?

 

In an earlier thread, the OP stated that he was changing the alternator, and showed a picture of it removed, is he  avoiding telling us that he broke it himself?

[Tracy D'arth]

27 minutes ago, David Schweizer said:

 

In an earlier thread, the OP stated that he was changing the alternator, and showed a picture of it removed, is he  avoiding telling us that he broke it himself?

The OP has said it was not a pix of his engine in the original post.

[Tony Brooks]

1 hour ago, Tracy D'arth said:

I have never seen one broken. Was the alternator properly secured at all three points?

 

That is the question, and also if the rear bracket on the block is the alternator one and not the dynamo one, that is, in effect further back, so an alternator can't be properly supported without distance pieces etc.  A photo of the alternator and whole area would help to see if it is likely to repeat the fault

[David Schweizer]

1 hour ago, Tracy D'arth said:

The OP has said it was not a pix of his engine in the original post.

 

I am aware of that. I was drawing attention to this earlier thread by MarkCC :-

I am not sure what it has got to do with me saying that there are four versions of water pump? It was you who suggested it was alumininium, and I pointed out that some were made from Cast Iron.

 

 

Edited December 31, 2023 by David Schweizer

[MarkCC]

That other thread was about my other boat. 

Different alternator different boat. 

 

The alternator on the bmc is the a127 lucas (copy). That's pretty common. 

 

No idea how it broke, boat is over 40 years old - these things happen. Maybe some damage hairline fracture some vibes!

As well as the 2 top supports there's the 3rd lower post - which has the 4th adjustable part via a bracket. 

 

The below image is before it broke - its the piece below the water temp with the red wire).

 

The top (as you look at it) bolt goes through a bolted on 90degree bracket - which is the engine diagram in my manual part 64 "bracket for alternator". 

 

Theres a load of washers needed to help things line up. This alternator is a fair bit bigger than the original - though has been place 4 years plus.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Tony Brooks]

This may only be camera angle but:

 

Look at the washers at the front mount and the lands on the alternator bracket and water pump. It looks to me as if the bolt is in at an angle, so may be oversized hole/holes or undersized bolt.

 

Also, it looks as if the belt and pulley are not aligned. The whole alternator might be twisted anticlockwise, or it might be mounted too far back.

 

I can't see part 64, but the sliding bush in the alternator back bracket implies it is NOT a dynamo mount.

 

I don't think that is an A127 clone, but happy to be corrected.

[Tracy D'arth]

1 hour ago, Tony Brooks said:

This may only be camera angle but:

 

Look at the washers at the front mount and the lands on the alternator bracket and water pump. It looks to me as if the bolt is in at an angle, so may be oversized hole/holes or undersized bolt.

 

Also, it looks as if the belt and pulley are not aligned. The whole alternator might be twisted anticlockwise, or it might be mounted too far back.

 

I can't see part 64, but the sliding bush in the alternator back bracket implies it is NOT a dynamo mount.

 

I don't think that is an A127 clone, but happy to be corrected.

The rear mount with the sliding sleeve looks all wrong as though the sleeve is not in the alternator. I doubt it is an A127 too as the fan is internal.  The stack of washers is a bodge for a proper solid spacer.

[john.k]

OP s pic is obviously in a junkyard......but what is the gearbox to the left of pic with the torched off shaft?....looks like an air cylinder is part of it?

[Tony Brooks]

6 hours ago, Tracy D'arth said:

The rear mount with the sliding sleeve looks all wrong as though the sleeve is not in the alternator. I doubt it is an A127 too as the fan is internal.  The stack of washers is a bodge for a proper solid spacer.

 

I agree it is not an A127, but I think that I can see a gap between the nut and rear end bracket that is taken up by the spacer. Unfortunately, the glow plug boss obscures the actual engine bracket, but it looks as if there may be a bit of spacer sticking out at the back.

[BEngo]

The alternator looks like it might be the Ford Pinto one, which has the same mounts as an A127. Comes iln either LH or RH Puts out 85 to 100 A  and has two internal fans. 

 

Sold in race trim by WOS Performance.

 

Google LMA 237 alternator.

 

N

Edited January 1 by BEngo

[David Schweizer]

12 hours ago, Tony Brooks said:

This may only be camera angle but:

 

Look at the washers at the front mount and the lands on the alternator bracket and water pump. It looks to me as if the bolt is in at an angle, so may be oversized hole/holes or undersized bolt.

 

Also, it looks as if the belt and pulley are not aligned. The whole alternator might be twisted anticlockwise, or it might be mounted too far back.

 

I can't see part 64, but the sliding bush in the alternator back bracket implies it is NOT a dynamo mount.

 

I don't think that is an A127 clone, but happy to be corrected.

 

You are correct Tony , but  you already knew that!  This is a Lucas A127

 

                              

 

 

 

Edited January 1 by David Schweizer

[StephenA]

19 hours ago, Tracy D'arth said:

I have never seen one broken. Was the alternator properly secured at all three points?

 

I have - usually caused by the spacer between the Alternator and the water pump arm not being the right size (it seems to be a set of washers here) so when you tighten the bolt up the alternator cant move because of the solid bracket on the engine block so the water pump bracket bends and shears off.

Edited January 1 by StephenA

[Tracy D'arth]

22 minutes ago, StephenA said:

 

I have - usually caused by the spacer between the Alternator and the water pump arm not being the right size (it seems to be a set of washers here) so when you tighten the bolt up the alternator cant move because of the solid bracket on the engine block so the water pump bracket bends and shears off.

Sure you are right but the sliding sleeve on the rear swivel mounting on the engine block bracket is supposed to avoid this. The arrangement on the rear mounting looks all wrong though, possibly the case of the fracture.