Wot no weed hatch?

[Neil2]

In my quest to find another boat I came across a very well maintained trad recently, a number of factors put me off though, one of which was the lack of a weed hatch. At first I thought I was just being dull but sure enough there was no provision for clearing the prop.

 

The boat apparently dates from 1980 (though it has been so well looked after it could pass for a ten year old boat) and was built by Water Travel, I believe a well respected company in their day. I'm therefore puzzled as to why there is no weed hatch - I've never seen a NB without one.

 

Does anyone have a boat without a hatch? Any ideas why anyone would build or specify such a boat?

[Guest]

A weedhatch is not essential on a canal boat. You can get stuff off the prop by other means, worst case climb in.

 

I wouldn't buy a boat without one if I boated on shallow canals.

Edited October 26, 2013 by The Dog House

[junior]

Hmmm, I have a boat that has almost impossible access to the weed hatch. It was built "in the style of an old working boat" and aparently they didn't have them? I've been told that if I need to clear it I use the pole that has the hook on the end or I lay on the back and reach my arms under.

 

My boat was also built by a well respected boat builder back in the 70's.

[thorne lass]

Water Travel was an exceptionally well respected builder of narrow boats for (wealthy) connoisseurs, and it is entirely possible that a client specified no weed hatch on the basis of knowing that it might be difficult to access on atraditional design, that it might represent a security risk (i.e. risk of water ingress) and that it was not necessary for an experienced boater. When all said and done no commercial narrowboat (to my knowledge) ever had a weed hatch. On a Water Travel hull the stern post was almost certainly deeper than most more mundane hulls, making the propeller deeper in the water and thus harder to reach through a hatch, and easier to reach with a cabin shaft, which is what the professional boatmen would do.

 

Our last narrow boat was built with a weed hatch but in 5 years of quite extensive cruising it was only ever used three times. Once to ensure that the propeller was completely clear before a tug-o-war contest, once when a piece of wood jammed up under the counter in Smethwick locks, when the weed hatch proved useless and we had to drain the pound to clear the wood, and once (but only once!) when it was useful. There are various tricks to minimise prop fouling such as slacking off as the stern passes under a bridge in urban areas where rubbish may be present.

 

Having said all that it may not be difficult or too expensive to fit one should you wish. Shame to miss a good boat if that is the main shortcoming that you perceive.

[Guest]

Water Travel was an exceptionally well respected builder of narrow boats for (wealthy) connoisseurs, and it is entirely possible that a client specified no weed hatch on the basis of knowing that it might be difficult to access on atraditional design, that it might represent a security risk (i.e. risk of water ingress) and that it was not necessary for an experienced boater. When all said and done no commercial narrowboat (to my knowledge) ever had a weed hatch. On a Water Travel hull the stern post was almost certainly deeper than most more mundane hulls, making the propeller deeper in the water and thus harder to reach through a hatch, and easier to reach with a cabin shaft, which is what the professional boatmen would do.

 

Our last narrow boat was built with a weed hatch but in 5 years of quite extensive cruising it was only ever used three times. Once to ensure that the propeller was completely clear before a tug-o-war contest, once when a piece of wood jammed up under the counter in Smethwick locks, when the weed hatch proved useless and we had to drain the pound to clear the wood, and once (but only once!) when it was useful. There are various tricks to minimise prop fouling such as slacking off as the stern passes under a bridge in urban areas where rubbish may be present.

 

Having said all that it may not be difficult or too expensive to fit one should you wish. Shame to miss a good boat if that is the main shortcoming that you perceive.

Surely it depends where you do the majority of your boating.

 

We have been down ours multiple times, and we have been as hire boaters too. From memory not all of these were in bridge holes even.

 

We have picked stuff up in varied locations.

 

We haven't since we moved onto deeper waters but that is to be expected really.

 

If you boat on your average canal it makes sense to have a weed hatch.

Edited October 26, 2013 by The Dog House

[thorne lass]

Surely it depends where you do the majority of your boating.

 

We have been down ours multiple times, and we have been as hire boaters too. From memory not all of these were in bridge holes even.

 

We have picked stuff up in varied locations.

 

We haven't since we moved onto deeper waters but that is to be expected really.

 

If you boat on your average canal it makes sense to have a weed hatch.

 

I wouldn't disagree with that summary, but if you choose to have a traditionally styled boat, perhaps something approaching a "replica" working boat, then you are likely to have a shallow counter (i.e. difficult physical weed hatch access) and a deeper sternpost (to swing a bigger prop. on a slow running engine). this combination may or may not make access through a weed hatch impracticable, and all I would reiterate is that plenty of boats manage perfectly well without, possibly given a small set of additional skills. Perhaps this should continue on the Heritage section and then we would see what the real enthusiasts say.

[Guest]

Ah right I didn't realise this was just a discussion purely for 'real' enthusiasts.

[BlueStringPudding]

In 6 years of boating all over the West Midlands, Northwest and GU, I've used the weedhatch twice. Both times to check for something wrapped round the prop causing propshaft symptoms... and both times it turned out to be the gearbox at fault, not something wrapped round the propshaft.

 

I certainly wouldn't rule out a nice boat because it didn't have a weedhatch.

[thorne lass]

Ah right I didn't realise this was just a discussion purely for 'real' enthusiasts.

 

Apologies , that was badly worded. Perhaps I should have said "owners of ex-commercial boats," although these would be the people perhaps condemned to a cold dirty dunk in the canal if the prop got fouled, not having a weed hatch, so perhaps they are indeed "real enthusiasts."

[Guest]

In 6 years of boating all over the West Midlands, Northwest and GU, I've used the weedhatch twice. Both times to check for something wrapped round the prop causing propshaft symptoms... and both times it turned out to be the gearbox at fault, not something wrapped round the propshaft.

 

I certainly wouldn't rule out a nice boat because it didn't have a weedhatch.

Then you have been very fortunate I would say.

 

Let me put it this way, if it was a choice between two very nice boats and the only differential factor was the presence of a weedhatch I would go with the boat that had one over the boat that did not.

Apologies , that was badly worded. Perhaps I should have said "owners of ex-commercial boats," although these would be the people perhaps condemned to a cold dirty dunk in the canal if the prop got fouled, not having a weed hatch, so perhaps they are indeed "real enthusiasts."

No problem.

[FadeToScarlet]

My boat's not had one for 78 years.

 

Most things can be pulled off with the cabin shaft from the bank. There's a knack to it, but it's not impossible.

 

The vast majority of old ex working boats don't have them.

 

If I got something awful on the blade, like a mattress or a trolley, I'd bow haul it to the next lock and cill it so I could stand alongside and get whatever it was off, or I'd put the wetsuit on.

[Trento]

I had a new Water Travel boat built in the late 70's.. Not only was there a weed hatch,, it was large enough for me to remove and replace the propellor.

 

For sure, they were a well founded boat of considerable strength. Unlike todays vessels.

Edited October 27, 2013 by Trento

[Dave_P]

This thread seems to demonstrate was I've long suspected. Some boats just don't need their prop clearing as often. Possibly due to the shape of the hull directly debris away, possibly slow turning big props aren't as affected as egg whisks.

 

I know my boat needs a weed hatch since, if I'm traveling somewhere for a week, the chance of not needing to clear my prop is pretty slight, even if it's just carrier bags wrapped around it.

 

My neighbour's boat doesn't have a weedhatch and just doesn't seem to get prop fouls. It's a deep draughted ex-working boat with a big slow prop.

[blackrose]

I agree with Dawg House. I can only see the advantages of a weedhatch and can't really see any disadvantages. Therefore it's something I'd want on a canal boat because it makes life a bit easier when it does happen (and it will happen on any boat at some point).

This thread seems to demonstrate was I've long suspected. Some boats just don't need their prop clearing as often. Possibly due to the shape of the hull directly debris away, possibly slow turning big props aren't as affected as egg whisks.

 

I know my boat needs a weed hatch since, if I'm traveling somewhere for a week, the chance of not needing to clear my prop is pretty slight, even if it's just carrier bags wrapped around it.

 

My neighbour's boat doesn't have a weedhatch and just doesn't seem to get prop fouls. It's a deep draughted ex-working boat with a big slow prop.

 

Perhaps your neighbour gets carrier bags wrapped around his prop too but he doesn't bother to clear them because he doesn't notice them on his big prop.

 

So another factor is the perception and skill of the steerer. Some people don't seem to see rubbish floating in the water, others see it but don't consider it might foul their prop so they carry on regardless, while the wise ones take their engine out of gear and use the boat's momentum to carry them through, only putting it back into gear for short periods to provide some steering. The same is true for putting the stern into the bank and reversing - there are methods to minimise prop fouling for the rubbish you can't see too.

Edited October 27, 2013 by blackrose

[junior]

My propeller is fitted with what I can only describe as 'toothed arms' behind the propeller blades, is this common? There are three of them and I guess they are there to chop up things before they get to the prop?

[furnessvale]

 

I wouldn't disagree with that summary, but if you choose to have a traditionally styled boat, perhaps something approaching a "replica" working boat, then you are likely to have a shallow counter (i.e. difficult physical weed hatch access) and a deeper sternpost (to swing a bigger prop. on a slow running engine). this combination may or may not make access through a weed hatch impracticable, and all I would reiterate is that plenty of boats manage perfectly well without, possibly given a small set of additional skills. Perhaps this should continue on the Heritage section and then we would see what the real enthusiasts say.

My ex LMS tug SANDBACH had a very shallow counter indeed but, in restoration, a weedhatch was fitted which accessed through the counter top. Because it came out well above water line, It wasn't even bolted down and could be lifted in seconds, the obstruction cleared, and the lid put down again without even losing way.

 

Very handy!

 

George ex nb Alton retired

[blackrose]

My propeller is fitted with what I can only describe as 'toothed arms' behind the propeller blades, is this common? There are three of them and I guess they are there to chop up things before they get to the prop?

 

There are a couple of different types of cutting attachments for props but I've never heard of one behind the prop - they are usually located in front of the prop (between the stern tube and prop).

 

If you don't have a weedhatch then I guess they are a good idea, but for anyone sticking their hands down into murky water to clear a prop sharp objects are a hazard.

Edited October 27, 2013 by blackrose

[junior]

There are a couple of different types of cutting attachments for props but I've never heard of one behind the prop - they are usually located in front of the prop (between the stern tube and prop).

 

If you don't have a weedhatch then I guess they are a good idea, but for anyone sticking their hands down into murky water to clear a prop sharp objects are a hazard.

Apologies, i meant behind when looking at the prop from the rear of the boat. They are as you say between the blades and the engine.

[blackrose]

My ex LMS tug SANDBACH had a very shallow counter indeed but, in restoration, a weedhatch was fitted which accessed through the counter top. Because it came out well above water line, It wasn't even bolted down and could be lifted in seconds, the obstruction cleared, and the lid put down again without even losing way.

 

Very handy!

 

George ex nb Alton retired

 

I can only imagine you mean that someone put their hand down the weedhatch with the engine running? Or perhaps they used a hook instead? Anyway for those who don't know always switch your engine off first just incase someone puts it into gear. A weedhatch isn't handy if you end up losing one!

Edited October 27, 2013 by blackrose

[Guest]

 

I can only imagine you mean that someone put their hand down the weedhatch with the engine running? I would never do that. A weedhatch isn't handy if you end up losing one!

 

I'm trying to read it another way but yes that is my take too.

 

I never go down ours with out the boat stopped, in neutral, engine off, and keys out the ignition - overkill? perhaps but I value my limbs.

[furnessvale]

 

I'm trying to read it another way but yes that is my take too.

 

I never go down ours with out the boat stopped, in neutral, engine off, and keys out the ignition - overkill? perhaps but I value my limbs.

Oh dear! It is perfectly possible to put it in neutral, stop the engine, lift the weedhatch, clear a simple obstruction, put the weedhatch back, and restart the engine, at the end of which the boat is still making way. The benefits of a quick release weedhatch are self apparent.

 

Incidentally, how do you stop your boat with a fouled blade before running into trouble? (although I will concede you can do that in some cases but not all).

 

George ex nb Alton retired

[Laurie Booth]

 

 

 

I never go down ours with out the boat stopped, in neutral, engine off, and keys out the ignition - overkill? perhaps but I value my limbs.

I do the same and if I'm helping another boater I insist they do as well.

I would never have a boat without a weed hatch as I use it almost every day.

[Jerra]

I never go down ours with out the boat stopped, in neutral, engine off, and keys out the ignition - overkill? perhaps but I value my limbs.

I like the keys in my pocket - that way I know where they are!

[furnessvale]

Oh dear! It is perfectly possible to put it in neutral, stop the engine, lift the weedhatch, clear a simple obstruction, put the weedhatch back, and restart the engine, at the end of which the boat is still making way. The benefits of a quick release weedhatch are self apparent.

 

Also, 9 times out of 10, clearance was obtained by the trusty shunting pole, another advantage of having a hatch in the top of the counter.

 

Incidentally, how do you stop your boat with a fouled blade before running into trouble? (although I will concede you can do that in some cases but not all).

 

George ex nb Alton retired

[Laurie Booth]

I like the keys in my pocket - that way I know where they are!

I never thought of that, I'll do that next time.