Fuel consumption

[Narrowboat Communicator]

Can anyone give a guess how much diesel a lister ha2 or a similar engine would consume per hour? Only a rough idea. I was told around a gallon per hour......

[by'eck]

A gallon an hour sound a little high. Lister quote 0.44 pints/HP/hr for JP's if that's any help.

 

My daytank of around 5 gallons runs a JP2 for over 12 hours.

[George94]

It all depends how fast you go, of course, but most NBs with a good two-pot Lister should use not much more than a pint an hour at normal canal speeds.

[bargemast]

Can anyone give a guess how much diesel a lister ha2 or a similar engine would consume per hour? Only a rough idea. I was told around a gallon per hour......

 

 

One gallon an hour would be right for a 25Hp engine that's working hard and delivering it's 25Hp, but on a canalboat (for leisure use) you will probably never ever need all the available Hp's to work, and use only about a third, to half of what's available, and maybe even less, so I think that you will rarely even get to as much as half a gallon an hour.

 

Peter.

[Proper Job]

Once moving, it only takes about 5hp to keep an average NB going at canal speeds.

 

That's why, irrespective of the size of the engine, most NB's do between 1 - 1.5 litres an hour

[Narrowboat Communicator]

as little as 1 to 1.5 litres per hour. Thats surprised me. I wish i had i day tank. I've got a year tank under my floor :-) i only know its empty when my fire goes out! I've put in 70 gallon so far in my tank and its still not full. But from what you said I've got lots of cruising hours in there.

[Nickhlx]

as little as 1 to 1.5 litres per hour. Thats surprised me. I wish i had i day tank. I've got a year tank under my floor :-) i only know its empty when my fire goes out! I've put in 70 gallon so far in my tank and its still not full. But from what you said I've got lots of cruising hours in there.

 

....and lots of time for the new improved hygroscopic red to develop diesel bug....

 

I have had a small week tank made up, giving a much faster turnover of diesel and it's removeable, so I can shake the last drips of water out should I need to... and it means there's far less value for anyone to steal.

 

If we ever mange to spend a month or three on board, I could switch the main tank back into life, but its not likely in the forseeable future

 

Nick

Edited July 11, 2012 by Nickhlx

[alan_fincher]

It all depends how fast you go, of course, but most NBs with a good two-pot Lister should use not much more than a pint an hour at normal canal speeds.

A pint an hour ?

 

Really ?

 

I'd be surprised if many come in much under 2 pints an hour, and I'd expect realistically to be more than that.

 

A rule of thumb for a "not that modern" narrow boat engine seems to be around1.5 litres an hour, which I make over 2.5 pints an hour). I cannot believe 1 pint an hour - sorry!

[Tam & Di]

One gallon an hour would be right for a 25Hp engine that's working hard and delivering it's 25Hp, but on a canalboat (for leisure use) you will probably never ever need all the available Hp's to work, and use only about a third, to half of what's available, and maybe even less, so I think that you will rarely even get to as much as half a gallon an hour.

 

Peter.

 

 

As answer to the title of the question I guess it could be 1 lock per gallon for the time some people seem to need to go through locks

 

I use my 120hp Gardner 6LW quite hard when we are on rivers here in France, but we are also on canals and ticking over in locks for some of the time. We also have diesel fired central heating and auxilliary generator. With all of that, if I've done 500 engine hours I know I need pretty close to 500 gallons to refill the tanks, so the motor itself uses under a gallon. Your 25HP used on UK canals has got to be just a fraction of this. My rough guide is that for every 20HP actually used you will burn about 1 gallon (4.5Ltr), and you won't need anything like 20HP to push you along.

Edited July 11, 2012 by Tam & Di

[Timleech]

A pint an hour ?

 

Really ?

 

I'd be surprised if many come in much under 2 pints an hour, and I'd expect realistically to be more than that.

 

A rule of thumb for a "not that modern" narrow boat engine seems to be around1.5 litres an hour, which I make over 2.5 pints an hour). I cannot believe 1 pint an hour - sorry!

 

A decently efficient diesel engine will use something under .5 pints/bhp/hour. A good engine might use under 0.4, but that'll be at it's maximum thermal efficiency which is not usually in pottering mode.

Pottering along a narrow canal ought only to use a couple of horsepower, so yes 1 pint could be possible. Of course if you have a heavy charging load, or are pushing along a bit faster & using energy making waves etc, it'll rise substantially.

 

Tim

[mattlad]

When Dad was running RN Diesels (18hp, 2 cylinder) we used to reckon on about 1 litre an hour under normal canal cruising conditions. We based this figure on dyno testing, our own experience and feedback from The Russell Newbery Register.

 

For those that prefer proper units that works out at (approximately) a gallon in the morning and a gallon in the afternoon.

[Burgiesburnin]

A decently efficient diesel engine will use something under .5 pints/bhp/hour. A good engine might use under 0.4, but that'll be at it's maximum thermal efficiency which is not usually in pottering mode.

Pottering along a narrow canal ought only to use a couple of horsepower, so yes 1 pint could be possible. Of course if you have a heavy charging load, or are pushing along a bit faster & using energy making waves etc, it'll rise substantially.

 

Tim

 

 

I worked at a Ford Main Dealer in St Helens, early 70,s while a student.

I remember a bet between two mechanics that a Ford Transit Diesel would idle all day on tickover using less than a gallon of fuel.

This it did from 8.00am [may have been 9.00am] till 5.00pm. Not sure how much was left but there was some left.

[bargemast]

There is a fairly good calculation, depending on engine-type, about the liters per Hp, per hour of fuel consumption.

 

For a slow-reving engine (max. about 1100n), it's between 0,193 and 0.257 liters/Hp/hour, so for 20Hp between 3,86 and 5,14 liter/h

 

For faster reving engines (around 2000n) , it's between 0,175 and 0,233 liters/Hp/hour, so for 20Hp between 3,5 and 4,66 liter/h

 

For even faster reving ones (around max.4000n) it's between 0,157 and 0,209 liters/Hp/hour, so for 20Hp between 3,14 and 4,18 liter/h

 

Of course these values are only for engines that have 20HP actively working, you don't have to feed non working horses.

 

Peter.

[bargemast]

I worked at a Ford Main Dealer in St Helens, early 70,s while a student.

I remember a bet between two mechanics that a Ford Transit Diesel would idle all day on tickover using less than a gallon of fuel.

This it did from 8.00am [may have been 9.00am] till 5.00pm. Not sure how much was left but there was some left.

 

 

How many Hp would a Transit engine deliver on idle, I bet very few, if we say 2,5Hp it would be about 0,4 liter/h, which means that there should have been a bit left of the gallon.

 

Peter.

[koukouvagia]

A decently efficient diesel engine will use something under .5 pints/bhp/hour. A good engine might use under 0.4, but that'll be at it's maximum thermal efficiency which is not usually in pottering mode.

Pottering along a narrow canal ought only to use a couple of horsepower, so yes 1 pint could be possible. Of course if you have a heavy charging load, or are pushing along a bit faster & using energy making waves etc, it'll rise substantially.

 

This makes the 44hp Kelvin K2 pretty economical. During sea trials when the engine first appeared, a figure of 1/5 gal/hour was recorded. This was on a 40' x 13' boat with a draught of 5'6". At 7 knots it consumed 1 gallon per hour.

 

The article in "The Motor Boat" July 1932 ends by saying,"fuel costs..on such a craft are almost negligible." Hmm. I've been out boating for the past five weeks and I've spent the best part of 200 quid on diesel!

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Timleech]

This makes the 44hp Kelvin K2 pretty economical. During sea trials when the engine first appeared, a figure of 1/5 gal/hour was recorded. This was on a 40' x 13' boat with a draught of 5'6". At 7 knots it consumed 1 gallon per hour.

 

The article in "The Motor Boat" July 1932 ends by saying,"fuel costs..on such a craft are almost negligible." Hmm. I've been out boating for the past five weeks and I've spent the best part of 200 quid on diesel!

 

Almost negligible compared with steam or inefficient petrol engines, diesel was fairly new at that time as well as being probably a lot cheaper than today.

 

 

 

 

Tim

[Athy]

It is hard to calculate exactly, but I think our 2LW does about 7 m.p.g., which includes idling/ to-ing and fro-ing in locks.

[Timleech]

It is hard to calculate exactly, but I think our 2LW does about 7 m.p.g., which includes idling/ to-ing and fro-ing in locks.

 

I've just done a quick back of envelope sum for our recent excursions.

Preston Brook - Lymm, Watford to Brentford, then down & back to West India Dock twice for the Pageant, then upstream to Pangbourne, about 75 litres total for approx 150 miles. Some of it gently along the GU canal, then the tideway mostly with the tide but at between 5 & 6 knots through the water, & about 5 mph over the ground against the flow up the non-tidal Thames. 35' long, 9' beam, about 3'4" static draught, Gardner 4LW with hydraulic drive.

That comes to about 2 miles/litre or 10 miles/gallon. I'd expect a decent shaped narrow boat at gentle canal speeds to do a bit better than that.

 

Tim

[Athy]

That's good going, Tim. Perhaps I should fill our tank, keep a note of mileage, then fill up again and divide the miles by the gallons. As it is, I never fill the tank - just dip it, and if it is looking low, pour a jerrycan of fuel in there, or sometimes buy £20 worth from Dusty if he is passing. I might surprise myself by how many miles to the gallon I'm getting. I have had the engine professionally serviced every year since we got it (2006, from Walsh's) so it should be in good condition, and the shell is by Mel Davis so I'd say that its shape should be good too.

Edited July 11, 2012 by Athy

[ditchcrawler]

as little as 1 to 1.5 litres per hour. Thats surprised me. I wish i had i day tank. I've got a year tank under my floor :-) i only know its empty when my fire goes out! I've put in 70 gallon so far in my tank and its still not full. But from what you said I've got lots of cruising hours in there.

I have a BD3 basically an old Ford tractor engine that is about 40 hp and a little over three litres and that gives between 1 1/4 and 1 1/2 Litre per hour on rivers and canals in a 57 foot Narrowboat weighing about 18 tones

[bargemast]

I have a BD3 basically an old Ford tractor engine that is about 40 hp and a little over three litres and that gives between 1 1/4 and 1 1/2 Litre per hour on rivers and canals in a 57 foot Narrowboat weighing about 18 tones

 

 

I suppose that your 1 1/4 and 1 1/2 is your avarage consumption with locks, and bridge passages, as if it would be this low number over a day without the stops, it would mean that you are only using about 7,5Hp of the available 40Hp's.

 

Peter.

[George94]

A pint an hour ?

 

Really ?

 

I'd be surprised if many come in much under 2 pints an hour, and I'd expect realistically to be more than that.

 

A rule of thumb for a "not that modern" narrow boat engine seems to be around1.5 litres an hour, which I make over 2.5 pints an hour). I cannot believe 1 pint an hour - sorry!

 

Depends how fast you go, I suppose. I trundle along with a JP3 on a rather larger boat and use less than a litre an hour most of the time. But I am seldom in a hurry.

[RichardKenward]

I came here to get some information about fuel consumption and having found the information I was after thought it would be nice to provide the following. I had to go through the whole registration procedd to do this <BG> This is from the owners workshop manual that covers the three models of the Lister engines the TS/TR1, 2 and 3 cylinder.

 

Cheers

 

Richard

 

Fuel Consumption

A Specific Gravity of 0.84 is assumed

l/h =

g/kWh x kW x load factor

840

pt/h =

lb/bhp h x bhp x load factor

1.05

Load Factor - Naturally aspirated engines

100% = 1.0 50% = 0.58

75% = 0.78 25% = 0.40

Load Factor - Turbocharged engines

100% = 1.0 50% = 0.55

75% = 0.76 5% = 0.38

[PhilR]

.

Edited February 16, 2014 by PhilR

[RichardKenward]

Well thanks for that! Perhaps I should explain better. I own a two cylinder lister generator and wanted to get a clearer idea of consumption. I came here on the off chance of finding some useful information with regard to fuel consumption of the Lister engines after an internet search throw up your site, but I found the information rather varied so I searched on the internet again and found the owners workshop manual for the lister engines I mentioned. I thought that it might be of interest to someone here what it said so I went to the trouble of registering simply to pass on the information I had gleaned.

 

I am not into boating though it does attract me, however as I expect you will say why don't I just run my generator and measure the fuel consumption. Since it is fed from a 100 gallon tank that is not that straight forward but I will make up a small capacity tank and couple that up direct to the gen set and get an accurate measure of consumption at a certain loadings.

 

Cheers

 

Richard