Antifishing folk....

[PaddingtonBear]

I am extremely anti fishing. I concur with Casper et al. Those who somehow view fisherman (of both sexes) as a benefit have obviously never seen or noticed all the crap and rubbish they always leave around - drink cans (usually crap drink at that), crisp packets, old boxes, broken chairs and tents not forgetting the damage that they always do to the bank and vegetation trying to 'make' a secure platform. In any event I thought that a hobby was supposed to make you happy and possibly even healthy but all fishermen that I have seen seem to be dirty, grey, pallid, sociopaths.

[GSer]

I am extremely anti fishing. I concur with Casper et al. Those who somehow view fisherman (of both sexes) as a benefit have obviously never seen or noticed all the crap and rubbish they always leave around - drink cans (usually crap drink at that), crisp packets, old boxes, broken chairs and tents not forgetting the damage that they always do to the bank and vegetation trying to 'make' a secure platform. In any event I thought that a hobby was supposed to make you happy and possibly even healthy but all fishermen that I have seen seem to be dirty, grey, pallid, sociopaths.

 

 

Blimey! If we all took that stance there would be no boating either, plenty of evidence of litter dropped by boats and anglers where I boat and fish, as a litter picker by habit, I collect plenty from all camps walkers, cyclists, dogs, people, boater or fisherman it's a sad fact that some people are litter bugs.

 

Try looking at boaters from the bankside, no way is a quiet reply from the bank going to be heard by a steerer, and there is little chance of fishermen knowing (or even wanting to know) the need to shout just to say hello back.

 

All hobbies supposed to make you fit and happy, yeh right, you may be confused with sports?

 

The one thing that always surprises me is the lack of knowledge of the anti brigade, as if primed only with the bare basics, most assume to know all about all the branches of the sport, I doubt even many anglers know that much, what anglers are doing is (mostly) legal and mostly well governed by clubs, associations and the NFA.

 

Many years ago the anti's attended a fishing match I was competing in, they had a C4 film crew in tow just to film the carnage/litter etc etc, however it was so tame, they had to tip rubbish behind the anglers just to get some film, the antis were holding bits of sea fishing kit getting their bit of fame on film!!

 

I think before angling is banned perhaps keeping cats should be banned, little 'Tiddles' set loose overnight is likely to kill more in a week than I will in a lifetimes fishing.

 

Paul

Edited July 12, 2011 by GSer

[Nine of Hearts]

Personally I've never seen any evidence that anglers/fisherfolk leave any more rubbish than other folk on the canals. Also, I think that the surly fisherman thing is also a myth (and one that I believed in myself until recently). I've certainly been thanked more times for my consideration in passing from fisherpeeps than I have by boaters. I think the proportion of miserable buggers in the fishing fraternity is probably no higher than in any other cross section of humanity, one just notices the miserable ones more. I am minded of the Taosit proverb:

A woodcutter went out one morning to cut some firewood and discovered that his favorite axe was missing. He couldn't find it anywhere. Then he noticed his neighbour's son standing near the woodshed. The woodcutter thought, "Aha! That boy must have stolen my axe. I see how he lurks about the shed, shifting uneasily from foot to foot, greedy hands stuffed in his pockets, a guilty look on his face. I can't prove it, but he MUST have stolen my axe."

A few days later the woodcutter was surprised and happy to come upon the axe under a pile of firewood. "I remember now," he said, "Just where I'd left it!"

The next time he saw his neighbour's son, the woodcutter looked intently at the boy, scrutinizing him from head to toe. How odd, he thought, somehow this boy has lost his guilty look ...

[zenataomm]

Now lets not get tetchy, i did say ` i dunno`

 

I have fished over near 30 years and never seen this happen, but then i have fished lakes not canals in matchs.

 

You cant argue your way sorry, i believe in animals for for slaughter for food, but if you agree with caged/couped chickens then its no nuch different to me. Free range is better for the life of animals.

 

Sorry but a bit of contradiction to me there.

 

Firstly I'm not arguing, secondly I repeat my statement that killing an animal is ok to me if you're going to eat it. How humanely you dispatch it is a different discussion.

Torturing an animal, person or any living being for your own amusement is not ok to me, even if you are able to appease your conscience by saying it can't feel pain or is returned live back to its environment.

 

PS I've never gotten tetchy in my life. I was born a sanctimonious miserable git

However I do agree with you that free range is better for animals. As it transpires I am an animal myself and would love to be free range too. I could be if I didn't have to work and seriously doubt if I will even get put out to stud!

[sueb]

So far there has been little mention of damage to wildlife from hooks and lines. Swan rescue is adamant that lines are a serious risk. My dog once got a hook in his nose from a careless fisherman. Maybe if fishermen didn't use hooks, lines and ridiculously long rods I would approve.

Sue

[carlt]

So far there has been little mention of damage to wildlife from hooks and lines. Swan rescue is adamant that lines are a serious risk. My dog once got a hook in his nose from a careless fisherman. Maybe if fishermen didn't use hooks, lines and ridiculously long rods I would approve.

Sue

Still don't understand your logic, though Sue.

 

You enjoying seeing a pack of dogs tear a fox apart, and all.

[Tiny]

So far there has been little mention of damage to wildlife from hooks and lines. Swan rescue is adamant that lines are a serious risk. My dog once got a hook in his nose from a careless fisherman. Maybe if fishermen didn't use hooks, lines and ridiculously long rods I would approve.

Sue

 

And fished in a lake and not in a canal

[sociable_hermit]

I think the proportion of miserable buggers in the fishing fraternity is probably no higher than in any other cross section of humanity, one just notices the miserable ones more.

Nope, sorry, got to disagree with you there.

 

Most people I meet when I'm out on the boat will smile and say hello. Even on a day where people are being more antisocial than usual, I'll still reckon to exchange greetings with a good number of folk and have lock-side conversations with a few.

 

With fishermen I reckon, on average, 8 out of every 10 will ignore me completely, 1 will be nice, and 1 will moan. That's only a 10% happiness rate, and even that's immediately balanced out by the accompanying 10% who are grumpy to the same extent, or far worse. And I wouldn't mind the occasional misery guts if I'd done something wrong, but I do always try my best to slow down and stay mid-channel to avoid ruining their "fun". The only sport which seems to piss the players off more is golf, and I think the reason might be the same. They are both frustrating activities, where perfection is always within grasp, in theory, but seldom comes around in practice. Consequently there are always a few frustrated fishermen looking for someone - anyone - to blame for their bad luck. Particularly, I suspect, if one of the reasons they're on the bank in the first place is to escape from being at home.

 

Sorry, I am not being a punchbag for your frustrations, thanks very much. And I'd appreciate your contribution to the waterways environment all the more if you could be at least half as friendly and welcoming as everyone else on the cut.

[Nine of Hearts]

I am surprised you singled out golfers and anglers as miserablers, but not cyclists. Whenever I see cyclists I always wave at them with both hands. They never reciprocate. Grumpy sods.

[GaZ]

I've only started getting into fishing in the last year or so and I have to say that everything I have read, either in a magazine or on a forum, has always said that the welfare of the animal always comes first. Go onto any fishing forum and there will be a thread along the lines of "What stater kit do I need" and there will almost always be a large landing mat and bonjela in the list. When I thought about starting fishing it never would have occured to me to carry bonjela to help not only hook wounds heal but any other wounds too. The large landing mat is self-explanitary. It's a case of knowing what you should be doing before you actually go and do it.

 

Whether it's fishing, shooting, boating or any other pursuit in the countryside, bankside or not, it's all about respect. Respect for your quarry, for the countryside and for other people.

 

It's when people don't show respect that problems occur.

 

 

Cheers

 

GaZ

[mayalld]

I've only started getting into fishing in the last year or so and I have to say that everything I have read, either in a magazine or on a forum, has always said that the welfare of the animal always comes first. Go onto any fishing forum and there will be a thread along the lines of "What stater kit do I need" and there will almost always be a large landing mat and bonjela in the list. When I thought about starting fishing it never would have occured to me to carry bonjela to help not only hook wounds heal but any other wounds too. The large landing mat is self-explanitary. It's a case of knowing what you should be doing before you actually go and do it.

 

Whether it's fishing, shooting, boating or any other pursuit in the countryside, bankside or not, it's all about respect. Respect for your quarry, for the countryside and for other people.

 

It's when people don't show respect that problems occur.

 

 

Cheers

 

GaZ

 

So, the fact that angling magazines and forums (which might be ever so slightly in favour of angling) put forward various things that they say promote the welfare of the fish means that the fish is absolutely fine then?

 

Have you heard that the word "gullible" has been taken out of the dictionary?

 

No matter what anglers do to reduce the suffering that they inflict, could they please stop trying to insult the intelligence of others by pretending that a fish that has been dragged from the water with a hook through its mouth is as well off as a fish that hasn't.

 

Being caught involves some degree of harm and suffering to a fish that they wouldn't suffer if they weren't caught.

[Ally]

I have to agree with Dave (!) There is no way that a hooked fish, removed from it's natural habitat of free swimming water, is a happy fella!

I have some understanding for fishing for food, but absolutely no understanding for people sitting....often on a lock approach, fishing for tiddlers that eventually get unhooked and chucked back...what is the point? It doesn't make them happy seemingly, as they are nearly always grumpy, don't like having to move for boats coming on to the lock approach, and just look plain miserable 9 out of 10 times.

To my mind, if you want to fish, do it somewhere pleasant, where you won't be disturbed all the time, and do it for food......or get out on the sea!

[GaZ]

It has nothing to do with being gullible, the post was mearly supposed to put across my own surprise at the fact that fish welfare is promoted at all within the fishing press, let alone seen as first and foremost.

 

Perhaps a difference needs to be made between fishing for different species, ie fishing for big carp is seen almost as a mission for some fishermen (sometimes they even target on specific fish that they know about) and they can spend weeks or even months trying to catch it, as opposed to match fishing which seems to be pulling large volumes of fish out of the water almost indescriminately?

 

I don't know, as I said I've only been fishing a few times (and I certainly would not refer to myself as an angler) so I'm certainly not in a position to start acting as a spokesman for the sport!

 

On a personal level I'd be much happier if fishing was done for consumtion, I have enjoyed the fishing I have done but would rather have done it in order to have something for dinner that evening!

 

Cheers

 

GaZ

 

p.s completely random question Dave, but you don't happen to be part of "Mayall and Tabby" a folk duet that played in the pubs in Douglas in the 2009 Isle of Man TT do you?

[mayalld]

It has nothing to do with being gullible, the post was mearly supposed to put across my own surprise at the fact that fish welfare is promoted at all within the fishing press, let alone seen as first and foremost.

 

Perhaps a difference needs to be made between fishing for different species, ie fishing for big carp is seen almost as a mission for some fishermen (sometimes they even target on specific fish that they know about) and they can spend weeks or even months trying to catch it, as opposed to match fishing which seems to be pulling large volumes of fish out of the water almost indescriminately?

 

I don't know, as I said I've only been fishing a few times (and I certainly would not refer to myself as an angler) so I'm certainly not in a position to start acting as a spokesman for the sport!

 

On a personal level I'd be much happier if fishing was done for consumtion, I have enjoyed the fishing I have done but would rather have done it in order to have something for dinner that evening!

 

Cheers

 

GaZ

 

p.s completely random question Dave, but you don't happen to be part of "Mayall and Tabby" a folk duet that played in the pubs in Douglas in the 2009 Isle of Man TT do you?

 

So far as I'm concerned, unless it is for food, I can't agree with fishing, and regard the "we are so keen on animal welfare" to be a cynical attempt to gloss over the fact that fish wellfare would be even better served by NOT dragging them out of the water.

 

p.s. I don't sing, and I don't play an instrument. I do have an aunt who is into that kind of thing, but I don't recall her being in the Isle of Man recently, and she's never mentioned a specific duo.

[GaZ]

That's a shame, they were really good! Been trying to track them down since.

[Gibbo]

...fishing for big carp is seen almost as a mission for some fishermen (sometimes they even target on specific fish that they know about) and they can spend weeks or even months trying to catch it...

 

Pitting their skill and intelligence against a fish? How rewarding.

[Nine of Hearts]

Pitting their skill and intelligence against a fish? How rewarding.

 

I don't know, that fish in that film gave Robert Shaw and Roy Scheider a run for their money.

 

That was real, wasn't it?

[RLWP]

I don't know, that fish in that film gave Robert Shaw and Roy Scheider a run for their money.

 

That was real, wasn't it?

 

Absolutely true

 

BBC Radio 4 this morning

 

Richard

[Naughty Cal]

Pitting their skill and intelligence against a fish? How rewarding.

 

It is rewarding if you are going to eat your catch.

 

Freshly caught BBQed makarel served with freshly picked Samphire cant be beaten.

[carlt]

 

Freshly caught BBQed makarel served with freshly picked Samphire cant be beaten.

I'll see your Mackerel and raise you one Bass, stuffed with puy lentils, bacon and garlic.

[Gibbo]

It is rewarding if you are going to eat your catch.

 

Totally agree. But doing it to watch the animal suffer seems rather sick to me. Especially considering how thick a fish is and just how easy it actually is to catch one. Any old dick can catch a fish.

[Naughty Cal]

I'll see your Mackerel and raise you one Bass, stuffed with puy lentils, bacon and garlic.

 

Nah. Too many flavours.

 

Freshly caught and cooked fish needs no sprucing up. Keep it simple and it speaks for itself.

 

(Wouldnt say no to a freshly caught bass mind you)

[Guest wanted]

I've only started getting into fishing in the last year or so and I have to say that everything I have read, either in a magazine or on a forum, has always said that the welfare of the animal always comes first. Go onto any fishing forum and there will be a thread along the lines of "What stater kit do I need" and there will almost always be a large landing mat and bonjela in the list. When I thought about starting fishing it never would have occured to me to carry bonjela to help not only hook wounds heal but any other wounds too. The large landing mat is self-explanitary. It's a case of knowing what you should be doing before you actually go and do it.

 

Whether it's fishing, shooting, boating or any other pursuit in the countryside, bankside or not, it's all about respect. Respect for your quarry, for the countryside and for other people.

 

It's when people don't show respect that problems occur.

 

 

Cheers

 

GaZ

 

So, the fishing forums and mags recognise that harm is being done to the fish by suggesting ways to limited and or heal the damage.

 

the argument that it dosen't harm the fish has been disproved by it's greatest supporters it would seem.

 

Hoist by it's own pitard and all that.

[Marches]

I'm not anti-fishing per se, it just pisses me off sometimes.

 

My reasons:

 

• There's a lake around here in a country park, the rights belong to a fishing club in a nearby city as opposed to the town the lake is in. The fishermen have tents and fishing rods sprawled out all over the beaches (there's sand) and act as if they own the place. Despite it being a country park people often can't take their kids to the beaches beside the lake or let their dogs go for a swim because of a few out-of-twon fishermen giving them evil looks. Hence the locals are being turfed off what should be their "common land" if you like.
  
• The canals and rivers are often taken over by people fishing too
  
• On most rivers you can't row a boat or take a canoe because of fishing clubs and their water rights. What sort of a country are we where we give rights ownership of rivers to private clubs?
  
• I see it as largely pointless. Most anglers throw their catch back in either alive or dead. What's the point in that? If you're going to hunt then stop wasting your time and actually eat the damn thing instead of teasing it and playing with food. Sports hunting which most modern angling comes under is stupid, keep racing pigeons or something if you have a competitive side, if you fish to get outdoors then take up bird watching.
  

 

On the other hand I do like this about fishing though:

 

• It gets people interacting with nature and into the countryside
  
• Angling societies maintain fish stocks and try to keep rivers clean which is good for all of us
  
• The land around waterways is often semi-woodland and preserved for the enjoyment of the anglers and often the public too. Without the fishing lobby our rivers would be a lot less clean.
  

[Josher]

I'm not anti-fishing per se, it just pisses me off sometimes.

Looks like you are not the only one!

 

Anglers on the Rochdale Canal, Todmorden.

 

Tuesday 11 October 2011 Halifax Courier

 

Canal should be for everyone to share: Anglers speak out on attack

 

AN ANGLER who was thrown into a canal five years ago has spoken out after a 64-year-old was kicked into the water by a cyclist. Last week the Courier reported how fellow anglers had to help Derek Bowers out of the Calder and Hebble Navigation after being booted in by the abusive cyclist during a fishing competition. Martin Hellewell, 51, who competes for Halifax, was involved in a similar incident when he was thrown into the same waterway by teenagers near Brighouse market in 2006. “I was fishing when I heard some teenagers nearby. They were just drinking and I didn’t worry about them. Then I heard heavy footsteps behind me and next thing I knew I was flying through the air into the water. The hardest thing was getting out. If it had been an older guy he could have died. To be fair it’s the only trouble I’ve had in 45 years.”

 

Mr Hellewell, from Cleckheaton, said that in his experience the main problem seemed to come from cyclists. “If your poles are in the way 90 per cent of people will wait for you to move but there are a small minority who have a problem. It tends to be the cyclists – the walkers are not in such a rush. If they poles are across the towpath it means the anglers are landing a fish so people only have to wait a few seconds for us to move them.”

 

On Sunday, 34 anglers braved wind and rain for the penultimate match of the Pennine League on the Rochdale Canal at Todmorden. They told the Courier the canal was a resource for everyone to share and anglers, cyclists and walkers should all be able to get along. They also told of their experiences of cyclsits smashing their equipment and giving them abuse as they fished. John Meredith, 38, from Barnoldswick, said: “The majority of people are alright. We have as much right to be here as they have but I do think the anglers can be as bad sometimes. The canal’s there for everybody to enjoy and we actually pay to use it. If I move my pole it doesn’t cost much to be courteous and say thanks.”

 

Alan Crook, 53, of Bury, said he had a £500 carbon fibre pole destroyed by a passing cyclist. “He just came along and rode straight over it,” said Mr Crook. “This stuff isn’t cheap so I was pretty annoyed. But you only get one or two like that. Everybody’s got to share the canal.” Tim Noon, 51, of Huddersfield, speaking about the incident in which Mr Bowers was kicked into the canal, said: “It’s terrible. I have known him since I was about eight. It’s one of the worst incidents I have heard of – he could have drowned. Luckily it hasn’t put him off.” Neil Burrows, 36, from Huddersfield, said: “We do get some trouble. We are all here to enjoy the canal but people come along and kick my poles out of the way without even saying anything. I just bite my tongue because you don’t want to make the situation worse.” Terry Schofield, 67, from Huddersfield, said: “I was nearby when Derek was pushed in. The bloke threatened to push me in too. just for looking at him. We have to work together to keep the canal open for everybody.” Pete Riley, 47, from Halifax, said: “I think we can all use the canal together – it’s there to be shared.”