Leaving some of the hull walls bare?

[luctor et emergo]

I was wondering the other night, whilst sketching possible lay-outs for my new boat, if it would be a possibility to leave some of the external hull walls 'uncovered', for example behind a solid fuel stove. I appreciate that it would possibly create some condensation, but if the boat is properly heated and ventilated, should that not be easy to deal with. A small amount of condensation can be wiped away.

 

Reasons for this are two fold.

It would take away part of the fire danger of a solid fuel stove, if the stove is fitted closer to the hull side. Looking to save space in a small boatsmans' sized cabin... .

It would make fitting wood around the port holes easier, because you (well, I... ) dont need to trim it with rounsd trim.

 

just wondering.

 

 

cheers

[dor]

I suspect it would work as a very efficient dehumidifier. Doesn't matter how well ventilated your boat is, warm air will contain moisture and a cold metal surface, which is what you are proposing, will cause any moisture in the air that comes into contact with it to condense out. If you do need to maximise space, at least line it with 10mm or so of cement-based board or whetever is the current substitiute for asbestalux.

[casper ghost]

The back 12 feet of my boat is bare steel as i'm doing refit. I stayed the night on it and got loads of condensation, and I mean loads... I was also rather cold as I lost alot of heat through the steel. I would insulate every inch of steel..

[carlt]

If you want to look at bare hull get a wooden boat.

 

I wouldn't leave any of a steel hul exposed.

[Liam]

Behind the Epping on Ariel, under the gunnel level on Ariel is completely unlined, so you can just see the painted steel and rivets. So far I haven't noticed any problems with condensation in that area when I first visit on a Friday afternoon after leaving the boat all week or on a Saturday afternoon, after the stove has been in for 24 hours.

 

To be fair I thought I'd be wiping up pools of water all the time but it hasn't been the case.

[GSer]

I was wondering if leaving the hatch doors bare steel they would act as a dehumidifier, just a small gutter on the door or angled ledge on the step at the bottom to take away the moisture to the outside.

 

Paul

[blackrose]

I was wondering the other night, whilst sketching possible lay-outs for my new boat, if it would be a possibility to leave some of the external hull walls 'uncovered', for example behind a solid fuel stove. I appreciate that it would possibly create some condensation, but if the boat is properly heated and ventilated, should that not be easy to deal with. A small amount of condensation can be wiped away.

 

Reasons for this are two fold.

It would take away part of the fire danger of a solid fuel stove, if the stove is fitted closer to the hull side. Looking to save space in a small boatsmans' sized cabin... .

It would make fitting wood around the port holes easier, because you (well, I... ) dont need to trim it with rounsd trim.

 

just wondering.

 

 

cheers

 

Is this the steel boat equivalent of exposed brickwork to get that rustic effect?

Edited February 1, 2010 by blackrose

[Roger Gunkel]

I think that the idea of a bare hull side behind the stove to save insulation is ridiculous, sorry!

 

The bare steel, being in direct contact with the water and the outside air, will act as a heat sink rather like a skin tank for engine cooling. The fire will work really hard trying to heat the river and outside air, with the loser being the reduction in heat in the cabin air. In addition, as has already been mentioned, the bare area is a great way to get loads of condensation, particularly when the stove cools.

 

If you want to save space, rather than heating the river, why not insulate the sides properly and fit a smaller stove that just heats the cabin.

 

Roger

[alan_fincher]

A few years ago circumstances forced me to have some of the lining out of Chalice in fairly cold weather, (not quite freezing temps outside, canal not hugely warmer).

 

It mattered not whether I had a lot of heat on, or none, the exposed areas literally teemed with condensation, particularly anything that was below canal level.

 

(That's with our usual "all toplights open", level of ventilation).

 

Up against where the sides were still lined with Rockwool, that was literally sponging up moisture from the exposed panels beside it.

 

My very strong recommendation is "don't even think about it", if there is any other way of doing it.

 

What I don't fully understand though, I'll admit, is that the same doesn't seem to happen with the uninsulated bilge of a boat. I can only assume that is influenced by there generally being less heat and/or moisture laden air down that low ?

[Roger Gunkel]

What I don't fully understand though, I'll admit, is that the same doesn't seem to happen with the uninsulated bilge of a boat. I can only assume that is influenced by there generally being less heat and/or moisture laden air down that low ?

 

Its probably because as the heat inside the boat is always rising, the air in the bilge is going to equalise with the water temperature outside, so as the moisture will be left higher in the boat, the coldest air will probably be comparatively dry and once it really cools down there is no heat down there to make it absorb moisture or rise up again. Well it sounds logical!

 

Roger

[Liam]

If everybody has experienced lots of condensation on their unlined steel, why haven't I?

 

Just curious.

[alan_fincher]

If everybody has experienced lots of condensation on their unlined steel, why haven't I?

 

Just curious.

I'll admit I've not seen what happens if the "bare bit" is right by an efficient solid fuel stove.

 

I suppose the stove could be managing to drag a lot of the moist air in, and up the chimney, and hence reducing what settles on the steelwork ?

 

I find that a bit hard to swallow though - I'd still expect the presence of the very much colder steel right by the heat source to mean a lot of moisture would form on it.

 

Count yourself lucky, I'd say, but isn't "around the stove" where an awful lot of working boats can end up with particularly excessive corrosion ? I seem to have seen that more than once, haven't I ?

[Liam]

I can't comment on the hull side behind the stove, but definately the actual counter, depending on how many loaded butties they've had run into them. Corrosion usually sets in behind the guards after they've been buckled and dented away from the main steelwork where moisture can get in.

 

As far as I am aware the bit behind the stove on Ariel is original, and is still in good nick. I am suprised to note though, that during the recent freezing of the canal, no matter how hot I have the stove during the day, the ice is still the same thickness near the stove as elsewhere along the length of the boat.

[Natalie Graham]

Years ago I spent some time, during a cold, snowy early spring, on a roughly converted ex-working boat which had no lining or insulation at all on its steel cabin. (It didn't have any glass in the toilet porthole either, but that is another story involving being in there coming up the top lock at Stoke Bruerne, on Easter weekend, surrounded by tourists and faces peering in to see in the old boat.) At night it was like sleeping in a rain storm with the drips coming off the ceiling. If the bedding happened to touch the sides in the night it became soaking wet. Don't do it! Insulate and line every square inch.

Edited February 1, 2010 by Natalie Graham

[steelaway]

I was wondering if leaving the hatch doors bare steel they would act as a dehumidifier, just a small gutter on the door or angled ledge on the step at the bottom to take away the moisture to the outside.

 

Paul

 

 

Hi

 

That's thinking outside the box?

 

I like it - would it work? - might be worth a try.

 

Alex

[Roger Gunkel]

I was wondering if leaving the hatch doors bare steel they would act as a dehumidifier, just a small gutter on the door or angled ledge on the step at the bottom to take away the moisture to the outside.

 

Paul

 

If you leave them unlined, they will start to drop to the temperature of the outside air and moisture will start to condense all over them. You could collect the moisture and run it out of the boat, but you will also get freezing cold air dropping down from the cold steel. You could just as easily leave the hatch open, so that all the moisture just rises out of the boat and is replaced with dryer fresh air from outside. Same result, no messing about!

 

Roger

[blackrose]

Hi

 

That's thinking outside the box?

 

I like it - would it work? - might be worth a try.

 

Alex

 

Dude! The box is there for a reason!

[luctor et emergo]

A resounding endorsement for lining all of the steelwork then. . I may go for a blown air diesel heater in the end, which will go a long way to save space. The space that would be taken by a SF stove can be used better then. Maybe even for a fridge.. oh, but that means back to gas.. and I would like to have a gas free boat.

 

Back to the drawing board again.

 

Thanks for all your answers (rustic indeed... :lol: )

[steelaway]

Dude! The box is there for a reason!

 

 

I remember it used to be, can you remind me what it's for?

I also remember that it used to be a black box is this correct?

 

Alex