Working locks

[carlt]

Going up:

 

"Take the boat into the tail of the lock, leaving it in gear, just ticking over. Then hop off, let the boat go into the lock unmanned, then lift the top paddles to control the speed of the boat. When she is in, close the bottom gate and drop the paddles. Then go up to the top of the lock and lift all the paddles. When the lock is full, the boat will push the top gates open, so then be nippy. Close the top paddles, jump onto the boat and take her out of the lock."

Edited July 6, 2009 by carlt

[RLWP]

Going up:

 

"Take the boat into the tail of the lock, leaving it in gear, just ticking over. Then hop off, let the boat go into the lock unmanned, then lift the top paddles to control the speed of the boat. When she is in, close the bottom gate and drop the paddles. Then go up to the top of the lock and lift all the paddles. When the lock is full, the boat will push the top gates open, so then be nippy. Close the top paddles, jump onto the boat and take her out of the lock."

 

Now, I know that is the way the old boys did it, but I'm still not confident enough to let the boat manage all that by herself. I get scared at the "Close the top paddles, jump onto the boat and take her out of the lock" stage...

 

Richard

 

I have got on, driven out (cos it's quicker) and then stopped the stern in the mouth of the lock by then.

[carlt]

Going down:

 

"Take the boat in, leaving the boat in gear, ticking over. Open the paddles and wait until the lock is empty open the gates and the boat will move out, slowly. Then jump onto the cabin top or allow her to move out and jump on at the tail of the lock."

[Nine of Hearts]

Going up:

 

"Take the boat into the tail of the lock, leaving it in gear, just ticking over. Then hop off, let the boat go into the lock unmanned, then lift the top paddles to control the speed of the boat. When she is in, close the bottom gate and drop the paddles(x). Then go up to the top of the lock and lift all the paddles(y). When the lock is full, the boat will push the top gates open, so then be nippy. Close the top paddles, jump onto the boat and take her out of the lock."

 

I presume the paddles you are dropping at (x) are the ones you lifted to control the boat speed, and are the top ones. If so, why drop them only to raise them again at (y)? If not and they're the bottom ones, how did they come to be open? Also, you appear to have left the top gate open when you left

Edited July 6, 2009 by Nine of Hearts

[RLWP]

I presume the paddles you are dropping at (x) are the ones you lifted to control the boat speed, and are the top ones. If so, why drop them only to raise them again at (y)

 

Bacause otherwise the bottom gate will slam when the boat has cleared it?

 

Richard

[Nine of Hearts]

Bacause otherwise the bottom gate will slam when the boat has cleared it?

 

Richard

 

It already did slam. The instruction to drop the paddles comes after the one to close the gate. Didn't you hear the bang?

[RLWP]

It already did slam. The instruction to drop the paddles comes after the one to close the gate. Didn't you hear the bang?

 

Is that a BW locky I can see fuming down the towpath?

 

Richard

 

(points at Carl) "It was him"

[Naughty Cal]

(points at Carl) "It was him"

 

Surely the lifeboat would be wedged firmly in the lock though

[starman]

On the Nene I tend to have a single rope at the stern end, even when going up. We sometimes bounce the front off the opposite wall, but a rope at the stern stretching backwards means I can be sure I can keep the bows out of the cataract coming over the top gates. Our tug-deck has eight-inch high sides, a less than one inch lip at the bottom of the front doors and two inch-square drains, if we catch the torrent, it will end up flooding the boat.

 

MP.

 

Just going up the Nene now and Starwoman and me seem to have perfected a technique. I come in slowly, she climbs rear lock ladder from front deck then walks up lock to secure front rope; I lob rear rope over bollard near guillotine (occasionally missing and cursing), climb ladder and tie off rope. We can then both do paddles, share struggles with manual 'wheel' guillotines and can generally control boat against side while lock fills by adjusting front rope only. I leave lock, moor against pathetically small and usually badly placed jetty with centre line while SW begins the tiresome close vee gates and re-open guillotine procedure. We long for the simplicity of the canal locks ahead!

[carlt]

Surely the lifeboat would be wedged firmly in the lock though

I had narrow boats for 25 years and a wide beam for less than two.

 

I feel qualified to comment.

 

I presume the paddles you are dropping at (x) are the ones you lifted to control the boat speed, and are the top ones. If so, why drop them only to raise them again at (y)? If not and they're the bottom ones, how did they come to be open? Also, you appear to have left the top gate open when you left

No they are the bottom paddles that you've just emptied the lock with (if it was set against you).

[MoominPapa]

Just going up the Nene now and Starwoman and me seem to have perfected a technique. I come in slowly, she climbs rear lock ladder from front deck then walks up lock to secure front rope; I lob rear rope over bollard near guillotine (occasionally missing and cursing), climb ladder and tie off rope. We can then both do paddles, share struggles with manual 'wheel' guillotines and can generally control boat against side while lock fills by adjusting front rope only. I leave lock, moor against pathetically small and usually badly placed jetty with centre line while SW begins the tiresome close vee gates and re-open guillotine procedure. We long for the simplicity of the canal locks ahead!

I forgot to say that the other motive for not roping the boat front and back against the side is the scary stories I've read in a couple of blogs of the edge of the baseplate catching on the bolts for the safety chains and tipping the whole boat dramatically sideways. I reason that if the thing is drifting around somewhere diagonally, it cant possibly catch bolts front and back and do that.

 

The Moomin approach does require one person on board during locking (sorry Carl).

 

 

Sorry to destroy your equanimity with that, think of it as quid pro quo for my spending the next three weeks worrying about Sargasso Nene

 

MP.

[alan_fincher]

Going down:

 

"Take the boat in, leaving the boat in gear, ticking over. Open the paddles and wait until the lock is empty open the gates and the boat will move out, slowly. Then jump onto the cabin top or allow her to move out and jump on at the tail of the lock."

 

I may be missing something here, but if you have left the boat in forward gear, when it is descending the lock, it's stem will be up against the bottom gates.

 

How do you perform the "open the gates" step, without first moving the boat back away from the gate ?

Edited July 6, 2009 by alan_fincher

[Nine of Hearts]

How do you perform the "open the gates" step, without first moving the boat back away from the gate ?

 

You give it a rare old shove to begin with, and your boat shoots backwards up the lock like a pinball off a flipper. By the time the boat is on its way back (presumably having scored 3,000 points and lit multiball at the same time), you'll have the gate fully open.

[alan_fincher]

The locky told me that the 6 wide locks on the T&M coming up from Shardlow were designed for the off side top ground to be worked first to hold a boat on the towpath side coming up. This seemed to work well.

 

If you mean he told you to open the top ground paddle on the side where the boat isn't , then whilst it may work on the T&M, it's the complete opposite of what you are advised to do in a GU lock.

 

In a GU lock you open the ground on the side the boat is on, because the flow generally passes under the front of the boat, "bounces" off the opposite wall, then "pins" the boat to the side you want it to stay on. (Open the paddle on the "non boat" side, and the front of the boat will often cannon towards it....).

 

This completely supports my point that there can't be a "one size fits all" that works for all canals, and without local knowledge even the experienced can be surprised.

 

Personally having for some time tried following advice to keep our 50 foot boat well forward, even when working single in a double lock, I have now changed my strategy, and usually hold well back, near the bottom gates. With the front 20 feet from the "paddle zone" it no longer really matters a toss which order the paddles are wound, (even if the "gates" mare drawn before the "grounds"), and the whole thing is a lot less stressful. (It wouldn't work with a seventy footer, though !)

Edited July 6, 2009 by alan_fincher

[carlt]

I may be missing something here, but if you have left the boat in forward gear, when it is descending the lock, it's stem will be up against the bottom gates.

 

How do you perform the "open the gates" step, without first moving the boat back away from the gate ?

I've never had any trouble opening a gate, against the boat in gear, at tickover.

[Nine of Hearts]

I've never had any trouble opening a gate, against the boat in gear, at tickover.

 

Seriously, this wouldn't work on my puppy as even without the boat in gear, if she's near the front gate the opening gate catches the bow fender and tries to push the boat sideways rather than backwards. I imagine your ability to perform this operation is heavily reliant on the shape of your snout. Exaggerated joshers beware! (

[carlt]

I imagine your ability to perform this operation is heavily reliant on the shape of your snout. Exaggerated joshers beware! (

and the fact that I would never let a front fender get anywhere near a lock gate.

[alan_fincher]

I've never had any trouble opening a gate, against the boat in gear, at tickover.

I'm kind of surprised ?

 

Easy to do whether gates are single or double ?

 

I suspect then, to some extent, it may be the difference between your experience of genuinely 70 plus foot boats that really are probably the full 7 foot, and those of us with shorter boats a few inches narrower. The former will sit straighter in a lock, and can take up less of an angle to the sides.

 

In a typical downhill single lock, with two bottom gates, the stem of our boat is generally unlikely to end up on the "join", unless you carefully put it there. So it will generally ride down the gate several inches from the "join", with the boat tending to go as "diagonal as it can". As some single locks are well over 8 feet wide, in practice, the "skew" can be considerable.

 

With our one, if you tried to push the gate it is bearing on open, you are as likely to jam it in in it's diagonal way, as to move it back.

 

With a single bottom gate I'd have thought something similar would happen, the nose would surely start to travel further into the side the gate is hinged from, because as you open it, the gate starts to angle in precisely the direction you don't want the nose to start "digging in". Again, with ours, I'd expect it to be as likely to jam as to move back freely in a straight line, before then slipping forward past the gate.

 

I can't see that pushing a boat back with a single gate in a single lock would be significantly different from pushing a boat back with one of the bottom gates in a double lock. So instead of thumb-lining, couldn't boaters then have just pushed the gates open against the tick over, and stepped back on as the boats were leaving ? OK, I accept more physical effort than thumb-lining, but I rather doubt it would be possible to do it, even if you were to try.

 

(Now awaits You Tube footage of people opening bottom gates where a boat is resting on them in tickover. )

[carlt]

I'm kind of surprised ?

 

Easy to do whether gates are single or double ?

It depends what you mean by "easy".

 

As with most ageing mechanical devices, there have been occasions when much tugging and cursing was required to produce results and, rarely, it proved necessary to climb down and knock the boat into neutral.

 

Most of the time, though, the boat and lock behave as expected and the technique works.

 

I suspect you may be right about the fuller figured boat behaving better, in a lock, than the skinny vessels, though.

[Chertsey]

It depends what you mean by "easy".

 

As with most ageing mechanical devices, there have been occasions when much tugging and cursing was required to produce results and, rarely, it proved necessary to climb down and knock the boat into neutral.

 

Most of the time, though, the boat and lock behave as expected and the technique works.

 

I suspect you may be right about the fuller figured boat behaving better, in a lock, than the skinny vessels, though.

Never tried it but must admit I'm surprised. Trouble enough moving the weight of the gate sometimes, let alone with added boat? But I guess we are talking about people considerably bigger and stronger than myself.

 

Possibly also lower tickover power?

[starman]

I forgot to say that the other motive for not roping the boat front and back against the side is the scary stories I've read in a couple of blogs of the edge of the baseplate catching on the bolts for the safety chains and tipping the whole boat dramatically sideways. I reason that if the thing is drifting around somewhere diagonally, it cant possibly catch bolts front and back and do that.

 

The Moomin approach does require one person on board during locking (sorry Carl).

 

 

Sorry to destroy your equanimity with that, think of it as quid pro quo for my spending the next three weeks worrying about Sargasso Nene

 

MP.

 

I suspect that only happens if you get one of those super-heroes helping who wants to show how quickly they can raise a paddle! We take it nice and steady and don't rope too tight. (And I don't think Starwoman would be very chuffed if I stood on the boat holding a rope while she turned one of the wheels).I worry more about those damned jetties that seem to come half way up the cabin side rather than at hull level.

[Chertsey]

(And I don't think Starwoman would be very chuffed if I stood on the boat holding a rope while she turned one of the wheels).I worry more about those damned jetties that seem to come half way up the cabin side rather than at hull level.

Why ever not? Or could she not stand on the boat and hold the rope? Where getting on and off is such a chore, it seems odd to do it more often than necessary!

 

Tho I think OH and my Nene stunt double dispensed with ropes altogether this time.

[MoominPapa]

I suspect that only happens if you get one of those super-heroes helping who wants to show how quickly they can raise a paddle! We take it nice and steady and don't rope too tight.

Thinking about it, it's probably only a problem going down - and going down either no ropes or one rope from the stern (when there's a cascade over the gate) is best.

 

I worry more about those damned jetties that seem to come half way up the cabin side rather than at hull level.

Yes, horrible. The wooden capping at Perio comes just over our Gunwhales. I once had to call the lock crew back to stand on the front deck: as they'd left the boat it had risen and the fender loops at the edge had jammed solidly into the bottom of the wood. The only way to move the boat was to add the weight back!

 

MP.

[alan_fincher]

Yes, horrible. The wooden capping at Perio comes just over our Gunwhales. I once had to call the lock crew back to stand on the front deck: as they'd left the boat it had risen and the fender loops at the edge had jammed solidly into the bottom of the wood. The only way to move the boat was to add the weight back!

Never tried the Nene, but the Lee has some similar ones. Also several others with so much random sharp metal and bolt ends sticking out, that I can't think of a better way of stripping of paint and blacking.

 

 

We nearly fell foul of the opposite feature at Marsworth at the weekend - large protruding metal guards just below normal pound level, (a couple of inches under, and projecting 5 or 6 inches beyond the visible edge.

 

If you tie up to go and set the lock, as you take water from the pound you are in, your uxter plate settles on to this feature. I have once been firmly grounded on one, when not fully paying attention.

[RLWP]

In a GU lock you open the ground on the side the boat is on, because the flow generally passes under the front of the boat, "bounces" off the opposite wall, then "pins" the boat to the side you want it to stay on.

 

On Hatton flight, the water passes under the whole boat, not just the front. If you watch, the water rises first at the front but eventually all the way along the boat. I guess that the paddles discharge into a culvert that runs the whole length of the lock with several exits into the chamber.

 

Richard

 

Bit like those clever BCN locks which discharge behind the bottom gate to close it for you.