Who are you kidding?

[weed slipper]

Josher, the most abused term on the cut?

Please discuss.

 

Ttp

 

MC

[carlt]

Dunno.

 

I just call them Uxbridge boats.

[Gary Peacock]

A bit like kit car replicas.

 

They are attractive to certain individuals!

 

Now the real thing would be worthy of a serious comment.

Edited March 10, 2009 by Gary Peacock

[Derek R.]

Josher, the most abused term on the cut?

Please discuss.

 

Ttp

 

MC

 

In what context - old boats, new replicas, why Josher, abused in what way and by whom?

[Hairy-Neil]

Josher, the most abused term on the cut?

 

I would say the word 'replica' was the more abused term.....

 

Caricature would be a better word.

 

car⋅i⋅ca⋅ture

 

1. Any imitation or copy so distorted or inferior as to be ludicrous.

 

2. A grotesque imitation or misrepresentation.

 

3. A portrayal that exaggerates and distorts prominent characteristics so as to make them appear ridiculous.

 

[carlt]

I would say the word 'replica' was the more abused term.....

 

Caricature would be a better word.

 

car⋅i⋅ca⋅ture

 

1. Any imitation or copy so distorted or inferior as to be ludicrous.

 

2. A grotesque imitation or misrepresentation.

 

3. A portrayal that exaggerates and distorts prominent characteristics so as to make them appear ridiculous.

 

Hear Hear.

 

Another abused term is "restoration".

[alan_fincher]

I would say the word 'replica' was the more abused term.....

 

Caricature would be a better word.

 

car⋅i⋅ca⋅ture

 

1. Any imitation or copy so distorted or inferior as to be ludicrous.

 

2. A grotesque imitation or misrepresentation.

 

3. A portrayal that exaggerates and distorts prominent characteristics so as to make them appear ridiculous.

 

I think I know a couple of (expensive!) builders that you may have in mind !

 

I've still not heard better than a comment by (I think) Liam that talked about bows that looked like they had been squashed between lock gates.

[weed slipper]

I think I know a couple of (expensive!) builders that you may have in mind !

 

I've still not heard better than a comment by (I think) Liam that talked about bows that looked like they had been squashed between lock gates.

 

 

Exactly

[David Schweizer]

Theere are quite a few buildrs who describe thier boats as "Josher style" when they bear almost no resmblence to the real thing whatsoever. However there are a few who build good copies, albeit somewhat smaller than the real thing. (Anyone who has moored in front of an unloaded ex FMC boat will know how big those bows really were.)

 

The only "imitation" Josher I have ever seen that was of similar proportions to the real thing was built quite a few years ago by Roger Farringdon, and it was big. It was the first time I had heard the expression Washer Josher to describe a boat. I am sure that there are some other boats aground that copy not only the lines, but the proportions of the original Joshers, but they are few and far between.

 

My own boat bears a striking similarity to some Nursers, and when photos of both are layed side by side the resemblence is apparent. but place the two boats together and you soon realise that my boat has significantly smaller proportions. I think the best description we couild go for is "informed by....)

[Liam]

Alan t'was me !

[Derek R.]

Hear Hear.

 

Another abused term is "restoration".

 

Reminds me of a trip we had on the River Cher in France. Tannoy voice recommends viewing the "restored" 19/18C lock cottage.

What we were looking at was possible the fabric of an old building completely rendered with modern materials and whitewashed.

Out of character windows and door, could have been breeze blocks rendered and built yesterday. The lock wasn't much better - fully electronic. Took twenty five minutes to pass through.

 

Derek

[journeyperson]

My boat was advertised as having a Josher bow. At the time I didn't even know what one was but I did know that I liked the look of it. I later learned what a Josher bow is and I still like the way mine looks. It doesn't matter to me that the seller took a liberty with the description.

[koukouvagia]

What distinguishes a replica Josher from the real thing isn’t the shape of the fore end – there are some very good copies out there – but the shape of the swim. Because no one ever sees this and because it would be very difficult to replicate, modern boatbuilders don’t bother. Or am I wrong? Are there any modern Joshers with a swim like this?

 

[Liam]

All of the boats with the impressive replica Josher fore end simply have an under water profile of any other boat... as in slab sided. I'm not sure of the correct word for the profile to not only 'bend' in but 'up' aswell (if you get what I mean) but it sure does look good and would very much improve the water flow to the prop.

 

But what do I know

[Naughty Cal]

Anyone got any pics of the pointy end to explain to idiots like me what the fuss is about.

[koukouvagia]

Anyone got any pics of the pointy end to explain to idiots like me what the fuss is about.

 

 

 

The shape of the fore end of a Josher is usually described as a “double curvature” bow. Looking end on as in the picture the profile is first convex then concave. (The foreshortening in the picture doesn't make this seem as pronounced as it really is) Originally the iron was pressed to this shape. Now modern boat builders achieve the same complex shape by using strips of steel which are then disguised behind the guards (or rubbing strakes as they are sometimes called).

The shape of the boat both at the fore end and the stern make joshers swim so well.

[tony collins]

This is a side on photo of Python built 1929 by Yarwoods.

 

 

 

Tony

Edited March 11, 2009 by tony collins

[David Schweizer]

What distinguishes a replica Josher from the real thing isn’t the shape of the fore end – there are some very good copies out there – but the shape of the swim. Because no one ever sees this and because it would be very difficult to replicate, modern boatbuilders don’t bother. Or am I wrong? Are there any modern Joshers with a swim like this?

 

Yes that is impressive, I have actually seen a couple like that over the years, and as almost the only boats I see on chocks are in Roger Farringdon's shed, they must either have been ones that he was repairing or building. I will be on the lookout in future.

 

On a separate note, a swim shape like that must make the back cabin very cramped below the Uxter plate. My boat has very long tapered swims, but even without the steep tumblehome things are a bit tight.

Edited March 11, 2009 by David Schweizer

[bottle]

and this is one based on the Josher can you spot the difference.

 

[Speedwheel]

This is a side on photo of Python built 1929 by Yarwoods.

 

If it is a Yarwoods then it is not a Josher!

[Derek R.]

If it is a Yarwoods then it is not a Josher!

 

Beg to differ. Alan Faulkner's 'FMC' lists 62 Motors built by Yarwoods for FMC, 44 of them being fitted out at Saltley or Uxbridge.

Python was built at Yarwoods and fitted out at Uxbridge - a Josher.

 

Derek

[Liam]

There were more than a couple of Joshers built at Yarwoods?

 

Here's the names, copied from Matt's 'Sickle' website: Adder, Antelope, Avis, Badger, Bison, Buffalo, Camel, Cormorant, Crane, Dolphin, Dove, Dragon, Kangaroo, Kestrel, Nautlius, Ostrich, Otter, Owl.

[Speedwheel]

But the hull was built by Yarwoods. To the boatmen a Yarwoods boat was not a Josher only Uxbridge and Saltley. I will double check but I am fairly sure that's right. I think that is what Carl was refering to about Uxbridge Boats.

 

I was talking to Malcolm about Cactus (built Yarwoods fitted out Saltley) and he said that it was not really a Josher. (in the true sense that is!!! It is far more a josher than any Josher style you get these days!)

 

Mark

Edited March 11, 2009 by Satellite

[carlt]

But the hull was built by Yarwoods. To the boatmen a Yarwoods boat was not a Josher. I will double check but I am fairly sure that's right. I think that is what Carl was refering to about Uxbridge Boats.

 

Mark

It was my understanding that FMC, themselves, differentiated between Yarwoods(and other builders) boats from "true" Joshers, built by FMC, at Uxbridge and Saltley.

 

This distinction may have been lost, over time, though.

[tony collins]

But the hull was built by Yarwoods. To the boatmen a Yarwoods boat was not a Josher. I will double check but I am fairly sure that's right. I think that is what Carl was refering to about Uxbridge Boats.

 

I was talking to Malcolm about Cactus (built Yarwoods fitted out Uxbridge) and he said that it was not really a Josher.

 

 

The hulls of Python And Panther were built together at Yarwoods, to the same design. Both have the swim design show on the photo of Owl. Python went to Uxbridge for fitting out, Panther went to Saltley for fitting out. I think that Python had a 9hp Bolinder fitted, I know that Panther had the 15hp version.

 

Tony