None renewal of my mooring agreement

[Dave Marshall]

I live in Manchester City centre in new Islington marina ,

the management had written and told me they are not renewing my mooring license. basically because I’ve been hear so long 14 years now ,

before any of my area was built up around me im the longest standing resident hear it  was all waist land around me  ,  I put in a complaint because nothing was getting fixed so instead of fixing the stuff it’s shoot the messenger and get rid of me instead of addressing the problems .😡

the management have threatened to remove my boat out of the marina  whilst I’m looking after my girlfriend from having her Gaul bladder out that week .

ex army ptsd adhd registered disabled physically hold a blue badge at my address 

my mooring agreement runs out on the 1/3/24 

this is a company called Waterpride started 3 years ago to basically to run this marina buy a backer of another company for  a guy called Ben lane who manages the place 

there is no complaints procedure or any writes to appeal and there’s 1 man in control of over 80 people lives he got rid of 2 other  residents in this way but I want and will stand up to this bully if you haven’t anything to loose that becomes a problem to that company my boat is now chained  to the pontoons and to cut them constitutes a criminal offence does it not? I’ve put notice on my chains to that affect they will have to take me to corte now or am I missing anything or further I can do ive rang 101 and put them in the picture anything further I need to do 

ive have loads of legal advice but no legal representation because I can not nor can the Manchester law society find a Solisators that deal with this area and never come across it before thanks for any advice that may be given 

[Tony Brooks]

Unless you never agreed to the terms of the mooring contract (verbally or in writing) I fear that you will end up on the wrong side of the law, so take great care. If you have never had a contract, then things might be different.  If the mooring was let as a proper residential mooring then other aspect of the law, re landlords rights and duties may come into effect, but I doubt yours is a residential mooring. probably a leisure mooring where a blind eye was turned to those living aboard.

 

Typically, leisure mooring contracts allow the mooring owner to tell the berth holder to vacate the berth, but that would require any unused time left on the contract to be compensated for.

[Tracy D'arth]

On a leisure mooring you have no right of tenure at all.  Best to find another mooring rather than get involved in a very expensive legal battle that you have no chance of winning.

[Tony Brooks]

Just now, Tracy D'arth said:

On a leisure mooring you have no right of tenure at all.  Best to find another mooring rather than get involved in a very expensive legal battle that you have no chance of winning.

 

I agree.

[pearley]

Does the actual marina not belong to the City Council or Urban Splash?

If you are a member of NABO or RBOA they could possibly help.

But does sound typical if a lot of marina management.

6 minutes ago, Tracy D'arth said:

On a leisure mooring you have no right of tenure at all.  Best to find another mooring rather than get involved in a very expensive legal battle that you have no chance of winning.

According to their website they only have residential and visitor moorings.

Edited February 27 by pearley

[Arthur Marshall]

The marina offers both leisure and residential moorings, so I'd presume the OP is on a residential one. But, as he says , the place has changed ownership recently, so he may be on a leisure one as a legacy from ages ago.

Before we can advise, we need to know which - eg do you pay council tax? I'd suspect a residential mooring there would cost a bomb, but if legit, housing benefit (or whatever it is now) should cover the cost.

[Tracy D'arth]

The situation MAY be different IF he is on a proper RESIDENTIAL mooring but its always tricky because losing that mooring does not make him homeless, he can move and live on the boat anywhere else.

[Arthur Marshall]

Just now, Tracy D'arth said:

The situation MAY be different IF he is on a proper RESIDENTIAL mooring but its always tricky because losing that mooring does not make him homeless, he can move and live on the boat anywhere else.

That's if the boat moves. It was towed there initially - there's an old thread about it on here.

[Dave Marshall]

I was on a full residential marina the new management changed that to void us of paying council tax to make us pay a compersit council tax to pay for the running of the site 

[LadyG]

51 minutes ago, Dave Marshall said:

I was on a full residential marina the new management changed that to void us of paying council tax to make us pay a compersit council tax to pay for the running of the site 

Sorry, can you rephrase that, I understood that council tax is levied on the boat owner who is on a Residential mooring, so each boater pays. Marinas nay have both Residential and leisure moorings, is this the case?

I can't see the marina owner ever being involved in individual CT negotiations.

I could understand if they wanted no Residential moorings and expected boaters to pay the costs of the marina, but I can't see the council making one CT charge per marina. 

Citizens Advice may assist, but as they are individually run by a small group, you may have to press them to get legal advice from the organisation. Try online 

 

PS 

I don't think you will be able to do much more than negotiate with the marina owners, better to keep things low key rather than going in guns blazing with immediate responses , good luck 

 

Edited February 27 by LadyG

[Machpoint005]

The key might be in the thread title, which is "Non-renewal of my mooring agreement" 

 

What does the agreement say about renewal? 

 

It there is nothing in writing, the OP hasn't a leg to stand on.

 

 

Edited February 27 by Machpoint005

[Arthur Marshall]

The site says it offers 33 residential and 7 visitor moorings. What it did before the takeover is anyone's guess, probably, like most of them, allowing people to live on but not technically residential. Then the whole area has been poshed up and it's being pushed as a "boutique marina", and as always happens in these cases on land as well as water, older residents get pushed out and rents whacked up.

I'd have thought if the OP hasn't been paying council tax it can't be residential, though even if he had what difference that would make I don't know. I've always been told that there is no legal security for any mooring.

It may just be that the marina, has for the first time got planning permission for residential moorings and it was just tolerated/ignored before. Councils are broke and looking for money.

Edited February 27 by Arthur Marshall

[MtB]

Sad to say, but the whole point of renting a mooring, house, business premises or whatever is the right for either party to cancel it when it no longer is convenient. 

 

If the OP requires security of tenure, a long lease or outright purchase of a freehold is the way. 

 

 

[Tracy D'arth]

It is possible that this mooring was a blind eye leisure mooring and the marina was charging a high occupancy charge to the folk resident there.

It matters not as there is no right of tenancy in any case.

[MtB]

7 minutes ago, Tracy D'arth said:

It is possible that this mooring was a blind eye leisure mooring and the marina was charging a high occupancy charge to the folk resident there.

It matters not as there is no right of tenancy in any case.

 

There are, I think, specific regulations governing residential caravan sites controlling security of tenure. These might, just possibly, cover proper residential boat moorings too. But only if the OP really does have a fully legitimate, all tees crossed and and i's dotted, residential mooring. 

 

 

[Arthur Marshall]

59 minutes ago, MtB said:

 

There are, I think, specific regulations governing residential caravan sites controlling security of tenure. These might, just possibly, cover proper residential boat moorings too. But only if the OP really does have a fully legitimate, all tees crossed and and i's dotted, residential mooring. 

 

 

I have a vague memory of reading that when these regs came in for caravan sites, they did not apply to those living in marinas, but were specific to the sites.

[blackrose]

15 hours ago, Dave Marshall said:

I put in a complaint because nothing was getting fixed so instead of fixing the stuff it’s shoot the messenger and get rid of me instead of addressing the problems .

 

This is actually a fairly common occurrence across marinas and caravan sites where there is no right or security of tenure for non-residents. You rock the boat and you get kicked out. That's applied both to troublemakers and sometimes unfortunately to people with legitimate complaints. Sometimes the constant complaints of the latter group can become perceived as vexatious by an otherwise reasonable mooring manager also resulting in the same conclusion.

 

I've been very careful how I complain about things at the various marinas and private garden end moorings I've moored at over the years, and that's all based on the premise that I have no "rights" as such, other than the goodwill afforded to me as a decent customer who pays his bills on time and doesn't cause any trouble. If I do have cause to complain my email or the first words out of my mouth generally begin with "I'm sorry to bother you with this but..." rather than asserting demands, and that usually elicits a reasonable response.

 

On the other hand if you are still on a genuine residential mooring then you do have residential rights and security of tenure and they can't just kick you out. I didn't know a marina could just end your residential status on a whim and relegate you to a leisure mooring? How does that work? Surely once you're on a residential mooring that then rests with the local authority? I think you need to clarify exactly what type of mooring you have now.

Edited February 28 by blackrose

[Arthur Marshall]

You would think that 14 years in a place would earn you some consideration rather than a very short notice to leave, but the same thing happened to a guy on my previous mooring. Really nice bloke, expert in all boat stuff, gas safe engineer and engine expert, been at the same place twenty years. No reason given.

I can see why you don't want to move, it's obviously a prime town mooring, but like others here, I can't see what you can do unless you have had, in the past, a long term agreement.

I'd check your insurance documents or bank account to see if either give you access to proper legal advice - it's all just opinion on here. But there are other marinas, and, (admittedly it's only my opinion) nicer places to live than Manchester!

[Belle]

On the day I'd untie and be gone, without a word, My concern would be if you wanted another marina nearby you could be judged ( I'm sure wrongly) as the problem / trouble maker 

[blackrose]

36 minutes ago, Arthur Marshall said:

You would think that 14 years in a place would earn you some consideration rather than a very short notice to leave, 

 

We don't know how much notice to leave the OP was actually given do we? 

[Arthur Marshall]

16 minutes ago, blackrose said:

 

We don't know how much notice to leave the OP was actually given do we? 

True, the post on here looks like a last resort if, as he says, he's had legal advice already. Be interesting to know what that advice was, presumably not what he would have wanted to hear.

I wouldn't be too sure that his mooring chains can't be cut by the marina, either, if he has no legal right to be there. And, presumably, if he stays there without permission, he's liable to penalties for trespass.

I'm sure there's someone on here who has run a marina who would know?

[LadyG]

51 minutes ago, Belle said:

On the day I'd untie and be gone, without a word, My concern would be if you wanted another marina nearby you could be judged ( I'm sure wrongly) as the problem / trouble maker 

Earlier there was something about the boat having been immobile, that would obviously complicate matters.

[Arthur Marshall]

2 minutes ago, LadyG said:

Earlier there was something about the boat having been immobile, that would obviously complicate matters.

It was towed there donkey's years ago - I imagine it's sorted now.

[pearley]

9 hours ago, Arthur Marshall said:

I have a vague memory of reading that when these regs came in for caravan sites, they did not apply to those living in marinas, but were specific to the sites.

Here at Hartford Marina we have several floating 'lodges', some purpose built, some caravans on pontoons. 2 years ago they gave notice to one of the caravans. She had a Certificate of Lawful Occupation? which gave her residential status. She took them to court and won, the judge ruling that the regulations re caravan sites applied. The marina retaliated by increasing their mooring fees well above inflation.

[MtB]

1 hour ago, pearley said:

Here at Hartford Marina we have several floating 'lodges', some purpose built, some caravans on pontoons. 2 years ago they gave notice to one of the caravans. She had a Certificate of Lawful Occupation? which gave her residential status. She took them to court and won, the judge ruling that the regulations re caravan sites applied. The marina retaliated by increasing their mooring fees well above inflation.

 

If a house landlord tries that dirty trick, the tenant can go to a rent tribunal and ask for a "fair rent" to be set. This is quite likely to apply to caravan site tenancies too.

 

 

Its never a great thing to be at war with one's landlord though. Personally I'd just leave for an easy life, but some people prefer to dig their heels in and not get trampled on.