Extra large side hatches

[Martin Kedian]

Thought this might interest some thinking of side doors challenging work but really pleased with the end result 

 

[IanM]

I think I'd want it welded in and not just pop-riveted. 

[Martin Kedian]

They are put in with teck screws weld them in if it is your preferred option however windows are fitted this way and are fine this keeps the paint intact 

[Stilllearning]

25 minutes ago, IanM said:

I think I'd want it welded in and not just pop-riveted. 

I suspect that a seamed weld round that window frame will do terrible things to the visual aspect of the tumblehome steel. Ripples, etc. Also maybe would necessitate the removal of the interior lining too?

[David Mack]

34 minutes ago, IanM said:

I think I'd want it welded in and not just pop-riveted. 

But that means removing much more lining and insulation to avoid the fire risk and will inevitably damage the paint around the area. Martin's solutions are designed to be retrofitted to existing boats with minimal disturbance. And for that the screw on solution is ideal.

 

The impact of the screw heads could be reduced by drilling and tapping the new frame, bolting through from the inside, then grinding the bolt ends flush. Would just require local touching up of the frame paintwork after installation.

[Martin Kedian]

20 minutes ago, Stilllearning said:

I suspect that a seamed weld round that window frame will do terrible things to the visual aspect of the tumblehome steel. Ripples, etc. Also maybe would necessitate the removal of the interior lining too?

Correct 

12 minutes ago, David Mack said:

But that means removing much more lining and insulation to avoid the fire risk and will inevitably damage the paint around the area. Martin's solutions are designed to be retrofitted to existing boats with minimal disturbance. And for that the screw on solution is ideal.

 

The impact of the screw heads could be reduced by drilling and tapping the new frame, bolting through from the inside, then grinding the bolt ends flush. Would just require local touching up of the frame paintwork after installation.

That would work but.be a lot more cost never met anyone wanting this option 

[Chris Lowe]

For those who may not know, Tek screws are self drilling and self tapping roofing & cladding screws, that come mostly with hex or colour moulded heads, but low profile are available.

Ones like below can aslo come powder coated to the appropriate colour.

 

[Alan de Enfield]

 

Interesting - I wonder if anyone has given any thought as to why boat windows open inwards.

Outward opening windows are frowned upon for obvious reasons.

 

But I guess that you do what the customer wants !

[Martin Kedian]

Never made an inward opening hatch for a boat they all lay back flat to the side of the boat

[Alan de Enfield]

4 minutes ago, Martin Kedian said:

Never made an inward opening hatch for a boat they all lay back flat to the side of the boat

 

I know, that is the standard, but in todays litigious society I wonder why ?

[Martin Kedian]

Pass 

[Rob-M]

3 hours ago, Alan de Enfield said:

 

Interesting - I wonder if anyone has given any thought as to why boat windows open inwards.

Outward opening windows are frowned upon for obvious reasons.

 

But I guess that you do what the customer wants !

Aren't they similar to a side hatch where the doors open outwards rather than an inward opening window.  Just glazed rather than solid doors.

[BoatinglifeupNorth]

Have seen yo

2 hours ago, Martin Kedian said:

Pass 

Have seen your work with normal window to side hatch and for the price and finish I can’t fault it. Extra wide maybe could be stretching it a bit and for the Newbies. But if your after a standard window to hatch I’d recommend.

[Alan de Enfield]

29 minutes ago, Rob-M said:

Aren't they similar to a side hatch where the doors open outwards rather than an inward opening window.  Just glazed rather than solid doors.

 

Yes, but to repeat myself - Why ?

[David Mack]

1 hour ago, Alan de Enfield said:

 

Yes, but to repeat myself - Why ?

With an outward opening door or side-hinged window you can arrange the cill detail so that water cannot get in at the bottom, and an 'eyebrow' moulding above the opening stops water getting in at the top. Can't do that so easily with inward opening.

[Francis Herne]

Inward-opening hatches would have a few more issues:

* Need clear wall space to fold the door back; no shelves or bulkheads next to the hatch.

* Naturally want to swing inward when unlatched and clonk the opener in the face.

* Won't stay fully open without catches on the wall, then you get the previous issue when closing it too.

* Limited room indoors to stand out of the way when opening/closing, depending on boat layout. Side corridors will be a pain.

* Awkward lump sticking out of the wall when open. My venetian blind holders are bad enough at catching my shoulder when I walk past.

 

I can't remember seeing any inward-opening door on a narrowboat.

Perhaps roller shutters are the answer! 🙃

 

Those Tek screws do look ugly to me; I wouldn't want them on my boat. Countersunk ones would look alright probably.

Edited October 26, 2023 by Francis Herne

[blackrose]

1 hour ago, Francis Herne said:

Those Tek screws do look ugly to me; I wouldn't want them on my boat. 

 

To me a dome headed bolt is no uglier than a fake rivet - or even a real rivet.

Edited October 27, 2023 by blackrose

[Martin Kedian]

6 hours ago, David Mack said:

With an outward opening door or side-hinged window you can arrange the cill detail so that water cannot get in at the bottom, and an 'eyebrow' moulding above the opening stops water getting in at the top. Can't do that so easily with inward opening.

Correct 

6 hours ago, Francis Herne said:

Inward-opening hatches would have a few more issues:

* Need clear wall space to fold the door back; no shelves or bulkheads next to the hatch.

* Naturally want to swing inward when unlatched and clonk the opener in the face.

* Won't stay fully open without catches on the wall, then you get the previous issue when closing it too.

* Limited room indoors to stand out of the way when opening/closing, depending on boat layout. Side corridors will be a pain.

* Awkward lump sticking out of the wall when open. My venetian blind holders are bad enough at catching my shoulder when I walk past.

 

I can't remember seeing any inward-opening door on a narrowboat.

Perhaps roller shutters are the answer! 🙃

 

Those Tek screws do look ugly to me; I wouldn't want them on my boat. Countersunk ones would look alright probably.

Counter sunk has been  done as well and then filled 

[JungleJames]

So what exactly was done here, and what was the point?

 

I'm assuming a window cutout has been enlarged?

 

The point? Apart from wanting an ugly boat, was I assume so you could pass a cup of tea outside? Very expensive cuppa. Or is it to pass 2 cuppas outside at once, hence the 2 windows? Still an expensive cuppa.

 

If they wanted a decent opening, why not replace the window with a sliding version? You get just as large an opening, as I really don't see the need in having 2 very separate opening windows as in this case. 

[Martin Kedian]

14 minutes ago, JungleJames said:

So what exactly was done here, and what was the point?

 

I'm assuming a window cutout has been enlarged?

 

The point? Apart from wanting an ugly boat, was I assume so you could pass a cup of tea outside? Very expensive cuppa. Or is it to pass 2 cuppas outside at once, hence the 2 windows? Still an expensive cuppa.

 

If they wanted a decent opening, why not replace the window with a sliding version? You get just as large an opening, as I really don't see the need in having 2 very separate opening windows as in this case. 

The customer requested it 

[blackrose]

18 minutes ago, JungleJames said:

If they wanted a decent opening, why not replace the window with a sliding version? You get just as large an opening, as I really don't see the need in having 2 very separate opening windows as in this case. 

 

You think you'd find a sliding boat window that big? Even if you could, surely the opening wouldn't be as large as you could only have half of it open?

 

Plus since you're talking about what's ugly, those sliding windows take the first prize in my opinion.

Edited October 27, 2023 by blackrose

[Martin Kedian]

19 minutes ago, blackrose said:

 

You think you'd find a sliding boat window that big? Even if you could, surely the opening wouldn't be as large as you could only have half of it open?

 

Plus since you're talking about what's ugly, those sliding windows take the first prize in my opinion.

This is true I admit this is not everybody’s cup of tea however I enjoyed the challenge and it was a replacement for an old bus window single glazed so cold and damp. These are double glazed and thus help with the heat loss and are opening in the summer  lots of ideas and views on things as always. I did think it might just offer another option 

[blackrose]

I see no problem in bolting a sidehatch on and it looks fine to me. I assume you're sealing it with some sort of PU sealant, Marineflex, Sikaflex, CT-1 etc?

[Chris Lowe]

7 hours ago, Francis Herne said:

Those Tek screws do look ugly to me; I wouldn't want them on my boat. Countersunk ones would look alright probably.

They come countersunk as well, and also flat heads 

 

    

 

[blackrose]

If it was me I'd paint the screw heads and blend them in a bit so they wouldn't be so obvious.