Drift Diary: An app for Continuous Cruisers to log and prove their distance travelled

[Tasemu]

This reminds me of a thought i had earlier in development, one of my mates dropped his phone in the river by accident and thats what made me think i should be backing the data up online so its not lost in the event of a phone loss... But perhaps those who are more sensitive about their data might prefer an option that stores everything on the phone..?

[David Mack]

Don't know if there's enough CCers out there who actually want to be able to document their movement for this to take off. But a bit of endorsement from CRT saying that this is one (but not the only) way to satisfy them would help.

The app could also be used by boaters taking part in the IWA Silver Propeller scheme or on the BCN Marathon Challenge and similar events, or indeed boaters who just want a personal online log of their travels, rather than keeping a paper version.

Is there an option for those who wish to do so to publish their data (in a reader-friendly format) either for invited friends/family or for anybody to view?

Is there an option to track more than one boat on the same login?

[rusty69]

3 minutes ago, magnetman said:

Martians might use it. 

You're not taking this very seriously, are you? 

[Tasemu]

1 minute ago, David Mack said:

Don't know if there's enough CCers out there who actually want to be able to document their movement for this to take off. But a bit of endorsement from CRT saying that this is one (but not the only) way to satisfy them would help.

The app could also be used by boaters taking part in the IWA Silver Propeller scheme or on the BCN Marathon Challenge and similar events, or indeed boaters who just want a personal online log of their travels, rather than keeping a paper version.

Is there an option for those who wish to do so to publish their data (in a reader-friendly format) either for invited friends/family or for anybody to view?

Is there an option to track more than one boat on the same login?

 

Currently there is an option to generate reports yes, they can be shared to whomever one likes. Its a little rudimentary at the moment but fully functional. Also multiple boats is definitely on the todo board.  

Edited July 31, 2023 by Tasemu

[IanD]

2 minutes ago, Tasemu said:

Currently i store the data on firebase, i see no major issue with this though nor do i scoff at people who might. I try to use the bare minimum required information to make the app work, emails don't need to be verified. I'm not sure what google or anyone else would want with geotagged boat pictures, and i imagine if anyone has online backups on their phone, like many smart phones do, they probably already have them. If there is a real desire for it i could beef up the encryption... I just don't see how valuable the data would realistically be. 🤔

People with tinfoil hats aren't worried about the value of the data, they're worried about Big Brother knowing where they are... 😉

 

Are the photos only stored by the app, or also on the phone?

 

With other apps I use which take pictures to analyse them (like Concur used for expenses, or passport verification for flying) the photo never appears on the phone, so it can never get accidentally (or on purpose) piped to Google or anyone else.

[David Mack]

5 minutes ago, magnetman said:

Martians might use it. 

 

2 minutes ago, rusty69 said:

You're not taking this very seriously, are you? 

I know a couple of Martins who might well use it!

[IanD]

3 minutes ago, Tasemu said:

This reminds me of a thought i had earlier in development, one of my mates dropped his phone in the river by accident and thats what made me think i should be backing the data up online so its not lost in the event of a phone loss... But perhaps those who are more sensitive about their data might prefer an option that stores everything on the phone..?

Providing both options would be preferable... 😉

 

(but given the proximity of phones to water in this case, having the data securely stored online has obvious advantages, especially for the likes of magnetman...)

[Tasemu]

Just now, IanD said:

People with tinfoil hats aren't worried about the value of the data, they're worried about Big Brother knowing where they are... 😉

 

Are the photos only stored by the app, or also on the phone?

 

With other apps I use which take pictures to analyse them (like Concur used for expenses, or passport verification for flying) the photo never appears on the phone, so it can never get accidentally (or on purpose) piped to Google or anyone else.

 

Currently it only accepts pictures from the gallery, i haven't had the chance to build anything like an inbuilt camera functionality yet, but its already on the todo list. I will definitely look into how these apps are doing this when i get onto building that part out.

[David Mack]

2 minutes ago, Tasemu said:

Currently there is an option to generate reports yes, they can be shared to whomever one likes.

I suppose I was thinking of an output that automatically updates a blog site or similar whenever the data is updated.

[magnetman]

4 minutes ago, rusty69 said:

You're not taking this very seriously, are you? 

Are you a Marian denier? 

[rusty69]

1 minute ago, David Mack said:

 

I know a couple of Martins who might well use it!

No competiton from victron then. I believe they use the Venus OS, not the Martian one. 

Just now, magnetman said:

Are you a Marian denier? 

Nope. Nor Robin Hood 

[IanD]

6 minutes ago, magnetman said:

Are you a Marian denier? 

Or a Robin Hood denier? 😉

 

Dammit, too slow... 😞

7 minutes ago, Tasemu said:

 

Currently it only accepts pictures from the gallery, i haven't had the chance to build anything like an inbuilt camera functionality yet, but its already on the todo list. I will definitely look into how these apps are doing this when i get onto building that part out.

 

You showed a picture of a map earlier showing a location trace and pin points, presumably where photos were taken?

 

So does the app run all the time and continuously track location (warning! warning! tin hat alert!!!) or only on demand?

 

Do you just store photos with metadata (which can be edited and location spoofed) or are they entered into a database with some kind of journalling record?

 

Do you also record metadata about the phone that was used?

Edited July 31, 2023 by IanD

[Tasemu]

5 minutes ago, David Mack said:

I suppose I was thinking of an output that automatically updates a blog site or similar whenever the data is updated.

 

Wouldn't be against this in the slightest, though i'd struggle to get it into v1.0

 

4 minutes ago, IanD said:

Or a Robin Hood denier? 😉

 

Dammit, too slow... 😞

 

You showed a picture of a map earlier showing a location trace and pin points, presumably where photos were taken?

 

So does the app run all the time and continuously track location (warning! warning! tin hat alert!!!) or only on demand?

 

Nope, it only has access to the photos you choose the log into the app and then uses them to generate the markers and stats.

[David Mack]

5 minutes ago, IanD said:

So does the app run all the time and continuously track location (warning! warning! tin hat alert!!!) or only on demand?

If its not running continuously it would need a canalplan type route finding function to fill in the route in between, and occasionally that would find the wrong route.

[magnetman]

The future is just like now but in a little while. 

[rusty69]

1 minute ago, magnetman said:

The future is just like now but in a little while. 

Is that a Huxley quote? 

[IanD]

If you sort out things like photo logging/security/access control (to prevent location spoofing), this could be a *very* useful application to convince CART where a boat has been, as well as all the other uses... 🙂

[Tasemu]

2 minutes ago, David Mack said:

If its not running continuously it would need a canalplan type route finding function to fill in the route in between, and occasionally that would find the wrong route.

 

The GIS data for navigable canals and rivers are publicly available from the CRT themselves. I used this data to calculate the distance along the line between the two furthest points in the picture array.

[IanD]

3 minutes ago, David Mack said:

If its not running continuously it would need a canalplan type route finding function to fill in the route in between, and occasionally that would find the wrong route.

I don't suppose CART would care, it's still far *far* better than hoping that a towpath checker sees the boat every couple of weeks... 🙂

[magnetman]

2 minutes ago, rusty69 said:

Is that a Huxley quote? 

Written on a wall by Limehouse cut. Don't know if it was famous. 

 

It is now. 

[rusty69]

Just now, magnetman said:

Written on a wall by Limehouse cut. Don't know if it was famous. 

 

It is now. 

Probably written by Roger Waters. 

[ditchcrawler]

59 minutes ago, magnetman said:

Xiaomi Redmi 8A. 

 

Chinese thing. They are watching via the front camera and analysing my facial expressions using AI. 

 

All this data is used by the Big System. 

 

 

 

Dont you have a bit of sticky tape over it. 

[rogeriko]

The solution is so simple and now I that am going to mention it I expect CART will impliment it.

 

There is over a million teenagers with a black box tracker in their car for insurance purposes. Drive too fast, drive too far and your insurance is cancelled or goes up.

These work on the GPS system and they have a multi-carrier chip inside so they can report your driving habits, speeding, braking etc back to the central computer using whichever network works in your current location. If you unplug it you get a text immeadiately asking why. In fact you have to email them to say your car is going to the garage and it will be electically disconnected before you even go.

 

A simple black box bolted to the roof of every boat will be a necessary requirement for a CC Licence, checked at every inspection and photographically confirmed as you cruise by the new camera system that will be set up similar to the number plate recognition cameras that you drive by everyday checking your car tax and insurance. If you are out of 4g reception the black box memorises your movements and uploads it as soon as reception is resumed. There would be a little transmitter in your black box to communicate your ID with the camera network as you cruise by the camera.

This will be controlled by a central computer with infringement tickets sent out automatically and CART could lay off hundreds of employees that would cover the cost of the system.

[Tasemu]

12 minutes ago, rogeriko said:

The solution is so simple and now I that am going to mention it I expect CART will impliment it.

 

There is over a million teenagers with a black box tracker in their car for insurance purposes. Drive too fast, drive too far and your insurance is cancelled or goes up.

These work on the GPS system and they have a multi-carrier chip inside so they can report your driving habits, speeding, braking etc back to the central computer using whichever network works in your current location. If you unplug it you get a text immeadiately asking why. In fact you have to email them to say your car is going to the garage and it will be electically disconnected before you even go.

 

A simple black box bolted to the roof of every boat will be a necessary requirement for a CC Licence, checked at every inspection and photographically confirmed as you cruise by the new camera system that will be set up similar to the number plate recognition cameras that you drive by everyday checking your car tax and insurance. If you are out of 4g reception the black box memorises your movements and uploads it as soon as reception is resumed. There would be a little transmitter in your black box to communicate your ID with the camera network as you cruise by the camera.

This will be controlled by a central computer with infringement tickets sent out automatically and CART could lay off hundreds of employees that would cover the cost of the system.

 

Ominous... I can't say i totally agree. But i see where you might make the connection. What makes you so confident that a system designed for new drivers at high risk of claiming on their insurance policies would be implemented for a licence system for barged travelling through the uk waterways where congestion is the main cause of concern?

[IanD]

16 minutes ago, rogeriko said:

The solution is so simple and now I that am going to mention it I expect CART will impliment it.

 

There is over a million teenagers with a black box tracker in their car for insurance purposes. Drive too fast, drive too far and your insurance is cancelled or goes up.

These work on the GPS system and they have a multi-carrier chip inside so they can report your driving habits, speeding, braking etc back to the central computer using whichever network works in your current location. If you unplug it you get a text immeadiately asking why. In fact you have to email them to say your car is going to the garage and it will be electically disconnected before you even go.

 

A simple black box bolted to the roof of every boat will be a necessary requirement for a CC Licence, checked at every inspection and photographically confirmed as you cruise by the new camera system that will be set up similar to the number plate recognition cameras that you drive by everyday checking your car tax and insurance. If you are out of 4g reception the black box memorises your movements and uploads it as soon as reception is resumed. There would be a little transmitter in your black box to communicate your ID with the camera network as you cruise by the camera.

This will be controlled by a central computer with infringement tickets sent out automatically and CART could lay off hundreds of employees that would cover the cost of the system.

Installing all the cameras and building the back-end system shouldn't cost more than -- ooh, maybe 10% of CARTs annual budget... 😉

 

Never mind getting paranoid tinfoil-hat-wearing anti-technology boaters to bolt something to their boat which tracks them all the time -- oh yes, and needs powering... 😞