Double Mooring advice please: Newbie!!

[Larfalot]

Hello hoping experienced river boat folk can advise me please.....we have 72ft river mooring and a 60ft and 40ft narrowboat and want to double moor them side by side not in a line....does the 60ft need to be closest to the bank and the 40ft the otherside or fine the other way around please?

Both will have their Stern together so can hop from one to the other.

Thanks in advance

[LadyG]

Well logic says puting the bigger boat inside, will give more stability. Main thing is to have both sets of  bow and stern ropes to shore, and use springs to shore for the inner boat to give less room to gain momentum, then the springs on the outer boat are on to the inner.

I'd think I'd have extra cleats welded on each boat to double up on security and strength. You will often find narrowboats are lacking in good mooring pins, the T at the front needs to be strong. Often that is the only fastening at the forward end of the boat.

Those tiny stern dollies may be strong, you need to check,  but they may not be the best idea for a more complex mooring situation. I would want to make sure the boats are always secure, and would avoid the Tugman's without  another knot. The standard yachty knot is a round turn, and two figure of eights followed by a locking hitch on a decent size cleat .  This cannot be undone without intervention but never jams.

Use fenders of appropriate sizes, and have them secure.

Edited July 16, 2023 by LadyG

[Tony Brooks]

As you say river and rivers tend to go into flood fairly quickly, I think that you need to think about deploying flood lines when necessary. This is a long and heavy-duty line run from a strong point at the front of the outer (or both) boat(s) to a very strong mooring on the bank like a mature tree or such like. The debris that tend to come down in a flood are likely to trap between the boat and put extra strain on the mooring lines. This is why I would put the shorter boat on the outside, otherwise with the sterns level there would be lots of room to trap more and more debris.

 

While talking about floods, you need to provide some form of provision to stop the boats riding over the bank in flood conditions, otherwise you may well find the boat dumped ashore, and with two roped together it might be enough to tip one over as the flood goes down.

[Tonka]

Is this on the River Thames? Is there enough width for passing boats. There is a rule on the Thames "that every boat has the right to navigate bank to bank" The boat on the inside has had his right impeded by the boat on the outside

[Tony Brooks]

18 minutes ago, Tonka said:

Is this on the River Thames? Is there enough width for passing boats. There is a rule on the Thames "that every boat has the right to navigate bank to bank" The boat on the inside has had his right impeded by the boat on the outside

 

That never caused any problems when the hire fleet was moored two or three deep during the winter, and the navigation inspectors were frequent visitors.  Also, how does that square with the "trot" moorings using piles a little way out from the bank.

[Tonka]

Just now, Tony Brooks said:

 

That never caused any problems when the hire fleet was moored two or three deep during the winter, and the navigation inspectors were frequent visitors.  Also, how does that square with the "trot" moorings using piles a little way out from the bank.

On the trot moorings piles were far enough from the bank for the boat on the inside to move towards the bank to pull out that way. 

The hire fleet was classed as commercial boats so were allowed. I have assumed we were talking about leisure moorings

[BEngo]

Bows upstream.

Shortest boat outside.  

Well moored as above.

Ideally on rising mooring tackle to keep you in the river on flood

If high flows are coming  rig a stout reflector board so that branches etc don't build up against the bows.

 

N

[MtB]

If the short boat is on the inside and the sterns are aligned together as the OP wishes, this raises the question of what to tie the bow of the short onto. I think a dolly (or better), a ring will need to be welded to the side deck of the longer boat for this.

 

The other approach is put the shorter boat inside, then a line from the bow of the longer boat can pass unimpeded to the bank. 

 

 

[Tonka]

1 hour ago, MtB said:

If the short boat is on the inside and the sterns are aligned together as the OP wishes, this raises the question of what to tie the bow of the short onto. I think a dolly (or better), a ring will need to be welded to the side deck of the longer boat for this.

 

The other approach is put the shorter boat inside, then a line from the bow of the longer boat can pass unimpeded to the bank. 

 

 

@LadyGmentioned that in her post

[ditchcrawler]

3 hours ago, Tonka said:

@LadyGmentioned that in her post

I didn't see that, has she edited her posting again?

[Tonka]

43 minutes ago, ditchcrawler said:

I didn't see that, has she edited her posting again?

Her posts states extra cleats would be needed

[Bacchus]

If you put the shorter boat on the inside as above it will be secure, but the gap will fill up with detritus and dead things.

[ditchcrawler]

2 hours ago, Tonka said:

Her posts states extra cleats would be needed

Are, not the little one inside

[Larfalot]

Thanks ever so much for everyone that kindly replied with tips and advice - much appreciated.

So whilst I agree the logic of the bigger boat on the inside bankside the most sensible I'm going to go small boat inside - both lined up Sterns together both will have independent ropes to bank attached to scaffold poles driven 5ft into the ground with hat tops so ropes can't slip off - I will do the same Bow end and have tyres as fenders - I will attach both boats together too - is that sensible?

Current water level to bank is 4ft and there will be small 6ft wide pontoon both ends of the smaller boat - these are floating option if level as leveles rise.

I like the sound of the stout reflector board but have no idea what it is?

[Alan de Enfield]

6 minutes ago, Larfalot said:

like the sound of the stout reflector board but have no idea what it is?

 

 

I think it is actually a 'deflector' board.

 

With the small boat on the inside you will have a big 'collecting point' for trees, logs, dead animals etc and after a bit of rain and the river goes into 'flood' the 'collecting point' will fill up within a matter of hours.

You should put a big board (at an angle - like a snow plough) between the bow of the 'big boat' and the bank to deflect any big tree stumps etc from smashing into your boat(s)

Edited July 16, 2023 by Alan de Enfield

[ditchcrawler]

10 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

 

 

I think it is actually a 'deflector' board.

 

With the small boat on the inside you will have a big 'collecting point' for trees, logs, dead animals etc and after a bit of rain and the river goes into 'flood' the 'collecting point' will fill up within a matter of hours.

You should put a big board (at an angle - like a snow plough) between the bow of the 'big boat' and the bank to deflect any big tree stumps etc from smashing into your boat(s)

An old telegraph pole would do the job nicely if the small boat is against the bank, it may even be long enough if you are against a pontoon, I couldn't work that bit out.

 

[Alan de Enfield]

Just now, ditchcrawler said:

An old telegraph pole would do the job nicely if the small boat is against the bank, it may even be long enough if you are against a pontoon, I couldn't work that bit out.

 

 

 

But ideally the deflector should also go below thw water - some tree stumps I have seen coming down the Trent weigh several tonnes, and, like icebergs 75% is underwater - they would simply roll under the pole (like a NB rolls under a dolphin/boom)

[Larfalot]

Thanks folks - the telegraph pole sounds like a great idea and thanks for mentioning the underwater protection bit too - I will crew some 2ft heavy duty bolts into the pole that'll sit under the water line - will post some pics once in situ

[Francis Herne]

On 16/07/2023 at 19:34, Larfalot said:

Thanks folks - the telegraph pole sounds like a great idea and thanks for mentioning the underwater protection bit too - I will crew some 2ft heavy duty bolts into the pole that'll sit under the water line - will post some pics once in situ

I don't understand how that's intended to work.

I'm picturing them hanging down something like a comb, but what stops objects rolling the pole so the bolts are horizontal?

Perhaps that's a misunderstanding of the idea.