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First it was composting toilets, now it is moorings, running engines, diesel heating and solid fuel stoves


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6 hours ago, doratheexplorer said:

This is excellent news! I had a CRT mooring for a while, with a metermacs account.  Gave up the mooring a couple of years ago as I wasn't using it enough.  I've just checked, and my metermacs account is still active!  Lovely Jubbly!

Same with us. Still got a credit of around £16. In therms and conditions they say the account will be closed automatically when you give up the mooring but not so.

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6 hours ago, Alan de Enfield said:

This metermacs thing seems a little complicated.

The marina group that we are currently in have 'smart credit cards', you can fill up the card (with £'000s if you want).  you can go to any bollard 'dump' your electric, plug in and just use it.

When you leave the mooring you put your card back in it takes the balance of the leccy and puts it back on your card. Next night, new mooring / marina, put your card in and repeat, when you leave, you reload the card and off you go.

 

If C&RT are putting in new bollards they could use a similar system.

I never found it complicated. Log into your account at any time, day or night, and put as much credit as you like. Plug into any bollard. Go to the Master and put your details in and you have power. When you leave you just unplug and get a text to say you've been unplugged and power has been shut off. You can go to any MeterMacs bollard at any site where there are free bollards.

 

If they are opening up the MeterMacs system to all then perhaps they will put the ones at Friars Mill moorings in Leicester into use.

Edited by pearley
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1 hour ago, Mike Todd said:

bio diesel may be green but is it clean?

Yes less particular matter and NOX and as I said it's on its second life unlike diesel, so overall I feel better using it than the alternative, my whispergen didn't like it at all for some reason used to block the evaporator screen 

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2 hours ago, IanD said:

It's as clean as normal diesel, and greener (amount depending on how it's made and from what) -- much greener if it's recycled cooking oil.

 

Whether it's cleaner or greener than other energy sources depends on what they are... ?

 

We shouldn't let the quest for perfection stop us using something that's better but not ideal, it's still better than doing nothing until something perfect comes along. When it does, then you can switch to it ?

 

The reason I asked the question is that the pressure to remove diesel from urban contexts (especially) seems to be based more on emissions rather than source ie cleaner rather than greener. In which case, something that is much the same emission-wise, even if much greener, will not satisfy that pressure group, however worthy the green agenda may be.

 

On numerous occasions (including the debates in General Synod of the CofE) I have seen these two distinct objectives completely confused. They are not even necessarily compatible with each other. The drift to all-electric is often promoted as 'green' when in fact it is mainly 'clean' - at least at the point of consumption. Unless care is taken, electric may still be 'dirty' it just transfers the problem elsewhere but the pressures we  are talking about here are quite likely NIMBYs anyway.

1 hour ago, peterboat said:

Yes less particular matter and NOX and as I said it's on its second life unlike diesel, so overall I feel better using it than the alternative, my whispergen didn't like it at all for some reason used to block the evaporator screen 

What source of biodiesel are you using?

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1 minute ago, Mike Todd said:

The reason I asked the question is that the pressure to remove diesel from urban contexts (especially) seems to be based more on emissions rather than source ie cleaner rather than greener. In which case, something that is much the same emission-wise, even if much greener, will not satisfy that pressure group, however worthy the green agenda may be.

 

On numerous occasions (including the debates in General Synod of the CofE) I have seen these two distinct objectives completely confused. They are not even necessarily compatible with each other. The drift to all-electric is often promoted as 'green' when in fact it is mainly 'clean' - at least at the point of consumption. Unless care is taken, electric may still be 'dirty' it just transfers the problem elsewhere but the pressures we  are talking about here are quite likely NIMBYs anyway.

What source of biodiesel are you using?

Recycled veg oil you can tell with the smell, but I know the guys that run it, they are currently struggling to get supplies due to closed restaurants etc

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15 hours ago, peterboat said:

Yes less particular matter and NOX and as I said it's on its second life unlike diesel, so overall I feel better using it than the alternative, my whispergen didn't like it at all for some reason used to block the evaporator screen 

 

Are you sure the use of biodiesel reduces Nox?

 

This paper says it increases by between 1 and 7% whenbiodiesel l is used.

 

 https://dieselnet.com/tech/fuel_biodiesel_emissions.php#:~:text=Abstract%3A Biodiesel reduces PM%2C HC,tends to increase with biodiesel.

 

I would expect it to increase, because whilst most of the NOx comes burning the nitrogen in the air and plant matter absorbs nitrogen when growing, so must increase NOx when burnt.

Edited by cuthound
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32 minutes ago, cuthound said:

 

Are you sure the use of biodiesel reduces Nox?

 

This paper says it increases by between 1 and 7% whenbiodiesel l is used.

 

 https://dieselnet.com/tech/fuel_biodiesel_emissions.php#:~:text=Abstract%3A Biodiesel reduces PM%2C HC,tends to increase with biodiesel.

 

I would expect it to increase, because whilst most of the NOx comes burning the nitrogen in the air and plant matter absorbs nitrogen when growing, so must increase NOx when burnt.

I googled and found this article which said it reduced emissions including NOX so I believed it, there were others saying the same,

6 Oct 2020 — Waste vegetable oil-diesel fuel blends can recycle used frying oil, which is. ... vegetable-diesel fuel could recycle cooking oil waste, which reduces household ... Technological challenges for the production of biodiesel in arid lands ... brake power with a reduction in exhaust emission such as CO2 and NOx.
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24 minutes ago, peterboat said:

I googled and found this article which said it reduced emissions including NOX so I believed it, there were others saying the same,

6 Oct 2020 — Waste vegetable oil-diesel fuel blends can recycle used frying oil, which is. ... vegetable-diesel fuel could recycle cooking oil waste, which reduces household ... Technological challenges for the production of biodiesel in arid lands ... brake power with a reduction in exhaust emission such as CO2 and NOx.

 

 

Hmm, the article referred to within the article you linked to is dated 2002 and was based on a test engine for 500 hours and mainly seemed concerned with lube oil viscosity, power output and smoke emissions. No mention of NOx except in the blurb which had the test procedure linked.

 

Wheras the article I linked to was specifically studying the impact of biodiesel on NOx production. I kmow which one I would trust.

 

Logically if the vegatable oil contains nitrogen then when it is burned as a fuel NOx must increase.

 

The nitrogen comes from the plants growing and increasingly is absorbed when the vegatable oil is stored in a nitrogen rich atmosphere to preserve it prior to use.

 

 

Edited by cuthound
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20 minutes ago, cuthound said:

 

 

Hmm, the article referred to within the article you linked to is dated 2002 and was based on a test engine for 500 hours and mainly seemed concerned with lube oil viscosity, power output and smoke emissions. No mention of NOx except in the blurb which had the test procedure linked.

 

Wheras the article I linked to was specifically studying the impact of biodiesel on NOx production. I kmow which one I would trust.

 

Logically if the vegatable oil contains nitrogen then when it is burned as a fuel NOx must increase.

 

The nitrogen comes from the plants growing and increasingly is absorbed when the vegatable oil is stored in a nitrogen rich atmosphere to preserve it prior to use.

 

 

I burn far more of the stuff in my bubble stove than in the genny [hasnt been used in anger yet] so I wonder if it produces NOX ? Its normally high temps that cause it, and I dont think the bubble stove gets that hot to cause NOX?

Crown oils also say that it reduces NOX as well

HVO Fuel Supplier (Hydrotreated Vegetable Oil Fuel)

HVO fuel is a fossil-free, FAME-free paraffinic renewable diesel fuel made from sustainable raw materials. Our HVO fuel is available for delivery across the UK. What's more, it's compatible with diesel engines and machinery.

HomeProductsHVO Fuel Supplier (Hydrotreated Vegetable Oil Fuel)

Go Green with HVO Fuel – We Can Deliver Today/Tomorrow Across the UK!

Crown HVO fuel, also known as hydrotreated vegetable oil or HVO, is an advanced renewable diesel fuel derived from 100% renewable waste streams through hydrotreatment and isomerisation. It meets bio content requirements with no FAME included and, to that point, avoids the instability and operability issues seen by many low blend diesels and high blend biofuels.

HVO fuel is available for delivery to any site in the UK within 48 hours. The fossil-free, FAME-free fuel also has a wide range of OEM approvals for use in modern diesel engines and off-road machinery.

hvo fuel

Change is coming, so why not lead the way with Crown HVO fuel?

HVO fuel offers a fast and simple step towards “net zero” with no CAPEX requirement and reduces greenhouse gas CO2 emissions by around 90%. The feedstocks used to manufacture Crown HVO are 100% waste, drawn from primary sources which have bypassed damage to the environment, natural ecosystem and the drive for global deforestation.

For every 1,000 litres of diesel burned, you will produce 3.6 tonnes of greenhouse gas CO2, compared to just 195kg GHG CO2 for every 1,000 litres of HVO burned.

Crown HVO versus standard diesel

We enlisted the help of fully independent test house, Applied Emissions, to help us carry out an experiment to test Crown HVO’s chemical output when compared to standard diesel.

Watch the video here to find out more and to see the results:

If you’re looking for a bulk supplier of the clean-burning, environmentally-friendly alternative to mineral diesel, with the added benefit of a significantly longer shelf life, get in touch with our friendly team today by calling 0330 107 1451 for a HVO fuel quote.

HVO is a relatively new fuel in the UK, however its excellent environmental and logistical credentials are being increasingly noted – proven by a 100% increase in UK uptake in the last year. For a more detailed overview of HVO fuel, visit our HVO Fuel Frequently Asked Questions page where we delve into the FAME-free fuel further.

hvo fuel

What is HVO fuel?

HVO fuel is a synthetic paraffinic fuel that’s stable, renewable, sustainable and high quality, making it perfectly suited for a wide range of applications including fuel for vehicles, generators and industrial power systems. As a premium-quality second-generation renewable diesel alternative, it’s made from 100% renewable raw materials.

HVO is a drop-in alternative to fossil diesel, meeting EN 15940 standards and Fuel Quality Directive 2009/30/EC Annex II. There is no need to modify existing infrastructure – simply order HVO diesel today and go.

 

 

Why use HVO fuel?

Up to 90% reduction in greenhouse emissions: significantly better for the environment than regular diesel or biodiesel
Renewable, sustainable and carbon offset delivery mileage: synthesised from waste fats and vegetable oils, eliminating up to 90% of greenhouse gas emissions and reducing NOx, PM and CO emissions in addition to recycling food waste. We also offset the carbon produced by our delivery tankers, further improving the fuel’s green credentials
Drop-in replacement for regular diesel & gas oil: meets EN15940 standard for paraffinic fuels and Fuel Quality Directive 2009/30/EC Annex II. A wide range of OEM approvals means it can often be used without needing engine and machinery

Edited by peterboat
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2 hours ago, peterboat said:

I burn far more of the stuff in my bubble stove than in the genny [hasnt been used in anger yet] so I wonder if it produces NOX ? Its normally high temps that cause it, and I dont think the bubble stove gets that hot to cause NOX?

Crown oils also say that it reduces NOX as well

HVO Fuel Supplier (Hydrotreated Vegetable Oil Fuel)

HVO fuel is a fossil-free, FAME-free paraffinic renewable diesel fuel made from sustainable raw materials. Our HVO fuel is available for delivery across the UK. What's more, it's compatible with diesel engines and machinery.

HomeProductsHVO Fuel Supplier (Hydrotreated Vegetable Oil Fuel)

Go Green with HVO Fuel – We Can Deliver Today/Tomorrow Across the UK!

Crown HVO fuel, also known as hydrotreated vegetable oil or HVO, is an advanced renewable diesel fuel derived from 100% renewable waste streams through hydrotreatment and isomerisation. It meets bio content requirements with no FAME included and, to that point, avoids the instability and operability issues seen by many low blend diesels and high blend biofuels.

HVO fuel is available for delivery to any site in the UK within 48 hours. The fossil-free, FAME-free fuel also has a wide range of OEM approvals for use in modern diesel engines and off-road machinery.

hvo fuel

Change is coming, so why not lead the way with Crown HVO fuel?

HVO fuel offers a fast and simple step towards “net zero” with no CAPEX requirement and reduces greenhouse gas CO2 emissions by around 90%. The feedstocks used to manufacture Crown HVO are 100% waste, drawn from primary sources which have bypassed damage to the environment, natural ecosystem and the drive for global deforestation.

For every 1,000 litres of diesel burned, you will produce 3.6 tonnes of greenhouse gas CO2, compared to just 195kg GHG CO2 for every 1,000 litres of HVO burned.

Crown HVO versus standard diesel

We enlisted the help of fully independent test house, Applied Emissions, to help us carry out an experiment to test Crown HVO’s chemical output when compared to standard diesel.

Watch the video here to find out more and to see the results:

If you’re looking for a bulk supplier of the clean-burning, environmentally-friendly alternative to mineral diesel, with the added benefit of a significantly longer shelf life, get in touch with our friendly team today by calling 0330 107 1451 for a HVO fuel quote.

HVO is a relatively new fuel in the UK, however its excellent environmental and logistical credentials are being increasingly noted – proven by a 100% increase in UK uptake in the last year. For a more detailed overview of HVO fuel, visit our HVO Fuel Frequently Asked Questions page where we delve into the FAME-free fuel further.

hvo fuel

What is HVO fuel?

HVO fuel is a synthetic paraffinic fuel that’s stable, renewable, sustainable and high quality, making it perfectly suited for a wide range of applications including fuel for vehicles, generators and industrial power systems. As a premium-quality second-generation renewable diesel alternative, it’s made from 100% renewable raw materials.

HVO is a drop-in alternative to fossil diesel, meeting EN 15940 standards and Fuel Quality Directive 2009/30/EC Annex II. There is no need to modify existing infrastructure – simply order HVO diesel today and go.

 

 

Why use HVO fuel?

Up to 90% reduction in greenhouse emissions: significantly better for the environment than regular diesel or biodiesel
Renewable, sustainable and carbon offset delivery mileage: synthesised from waste fats and vegetable oils, eliminating up to 90% of greenhouse gas emissions and reducing NOx, PM and CO emissions in addition to recycling food waste. We also offset the carbon produced by our delivery tankers, further improving the fuel’s green credentials
Drop-in replacement for regular diesel & gas oil: meets EN15940 standard for paraffinic fuels and Fuel Quality Directive 2009/30/EC Annex II. A wide range of OEM approvals means it can often be used without needing engine and machinery

 

So no detail of the mount of NOx reduction.I found this on the Surrey Research which states NOx reduction is dependent on adjusting engine parameters to suit, presumably lowering combustion temperatures which really affect NOx production.

 

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=http://epubs.surrey.ac.uk/845538/1/1-s2.0-S0016236117314151-main.pdf&ved=2ahUKEwjJl8TWyKXvAhWwRBUIHevuCl4QFjADegQIChAC&usg=AOvVaw3n55L8gemU19Q0zNq3X2PP

 

 

This paper goes into more detail and shows that without optimising the fuel injection system and timing of the engine to run on HVO there is no reduction in NOx.

 

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0016236117314151

 

Nevertheless HVO is a step in the right direction. I wonder how easily the type of engines used in canal boats can be optimised to run on HVO to reduce particulates and NOx?

 

Edited by cuthound
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17 hours ago, peterboat said:

Recycled veg oil you can tell with the smell, but I know the guys that run it, they are currently struggling to get supplies due to closed restaurants etc

But in other contexts there has been concern over the sourcing of veg oil.

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Central London ULEZ will expand to cover everything inside the North and South circular in October 2021. While it only covers road vehicles I wonder if it's a factor in this development.

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42 minutes ago, Mike Todd said:

But in other contexts there has been concern over the sourcing of veg oil.

I agree, but can only do what I do sourcing recycled veg oil biodiesel. We all have to make a stand to make a real difference 

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1 hour ago, Mike Todd said:

But in other contexts there has been concern over the sourcing of veg oil.

True if this involves growing plants somewhere (often on place of other plants, or tropical rainforest...) and processing these to turn them into biodiesel and transporting the result halfway around the planet.

 

If the oil is already there (restaurants) and would otherwise be a waste product which has to be disposed of, turning it into biodiesel for local use where it replaces fossil fuel diesel -- what Peter is doing -- is a much better option.

 

It's a drop in the bucket -- there aren't enough restaurants in the whole of the UK to feed a significant part of the total diesel fleet -- but this isn't a reason *not* to do it as a personal contribution to being green ?

1 hour ago, aread2 said:

Central London ULEZ will expand to cover everything inside the North and South circular in October 2021. While it only covers road vehicles I wonder if it's a factor in this development.

I suspect the rising number of (polluting) liveaboard boats in an area with a rising number of (complaining) landlubbers (new build flats?) is the real reason...

  • Greenie 1
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Green D+ claims a 30%+ reduction in NoX and an 86%+ reduction in PMs and this appears to be backed up by a reputable independent testing regime: https://www.gbf.ltd.

 

Chemically, HVO (2nd Generation biofuel) has the same formula as mineral diesel but without the aromatics, sulphur and minerals which actually makes it purer. 1st Generation FAME biodiesel chemically undergoes little change, leading to the 'soaps' dropping out (saponification) and the 'sticky diesel' that RCR are coming across. And that's before mention of the dreaded diesel bug!

 

I've used 200 litres of HVO in my Dickinson stove this winter without problems as part of a IWA-led trial using HVO in a combination of heating/cooking/propulsion devices found on the inland waterways, without any issues. Likewise there have been no problems in pressure jet devices (Mikuni/ Eberspacher/etc). It's also destined for a selection of the more rarified engines no longer manufactured once lockdown is lifted. It carries pretty much universal OEM approvals from diesel engine manufacturers worldwide (+ Webasto) so I see little need to include these diesel engines in the trial.

 

In a recent Land & Water trial, fuelling a 24 tonne swing shovel, the machine enjoyed a 10% improvement in fuel consumption and a 10% reduction in NoX. This was Crown Oil HVO without any additives.

 

HVO has made it possible for the largest commercial operator on the Thames to meet PLA's stringent emission regulations without any other engine modifications and Dispensor will soon be supplying London's first fuel boat selling HVO as well as all the GPS Marine Services tugs and workboats: https://allaboutshipping.co.uk/2021/03/09/river-thames-to-slash-carbon-footprint-thanks-to-a-new-green-floating-fuel-station-from-gps-marine-contractors-and-green-biofuels/

 

Ultimately, I'm sure we all want to enjoy carbon neutral boating but realistically that's several decades away. As a drop-in alternative to mineral diesel, at over 90% carbon neutral, 'well to wheel', HVO has a lot going for it right now as an interim fuel for the 60 – 80,000 diesel-powered boats on the inland waterways.

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