Tiller or Wheel

[fergyguy]

Those of you who have a widebeam which did you go for Tiller or Wheel? And Why?

[PD1964]

Don't own one but have moved several of each I find the tiller suits the canals best, quicker response, more easy to manoeuvre, better at slower speeds, just make sure your throttle control is within reach, downside more physical to steer, takes away space on deck due to tiller arcs and sometimes hard to reach throttle. Wheel more suited to river work where there are less locks.

[mrsmelly]

31 minutes ago, fergyguy said:

Those of you who have a widebeam which did you go for Tiller or Wheel? And Why?

My liveaboard widebeam was tiller and thats my preference. I have used chain and hydraulic steered widebeams for work in the past, its what you get used to really. The widebeam with wheel steering was 86 feet by a tad over 20 foot beam with 16 feet six inch air draught with front steering. My liveaboard was tiny at only fifty by ten so tiller steering made sense. If you mean something smallish say a 60 or 70 foot by 12 or 14 then I would go tiller every time if it were me.

[Slim]

Can't talk about tiller v wheel on a canal boat but having sailed a number of yachts with both tthere's no contest . Tliier in all cases. More responsive, feel and general sense of being in control. Offshore you can develop some pretty impressive blisters as well but you don't normally encounter genuine gale force winds on the 'cut

 

 

 

 

 

[OldGoat]

14 hours ago, Slim said:

Can't talk about tiller v wheel on a canal boat but having sailed a number of yachts with both tthere's no contest . Tliier in all cases. More responsive, feel and general sense of being in control. Offshore you can develop some pretty impressive blisters as well but you don't normally encounter genuine gale force winds on the 'cut

 

 

 

 

 

In a similar vein - some years ago I joined a group of dinghy and proper sailors one of whom was writing article for a magazine. The subject of the article was a  40ft. NB in France (covering estuary , river and canal cruising). It had bot tiller and wheel steering. This was my first NB experience. Except when it was raining heavily - every one - but everyone preferred the tiller steering.

 

On the British canal system there's absolutely no contest - Tiller is best.

On our cruising area - Thames - we see all sorts of craft with wheel steering and most folks jut don't have control of their boat, some of which is down to experience (not...) but mostly because there's a lot of wheel turning to get a change of direction.

Quite apart from any prejudice,  a conventional wheel steering system has a lot of cables  with a major problem of access to the cables if there is a problem. I'm assuming steering from the front.

 

 

    

 

[Alan de Enfield]

28 minutes ago, OldGoat said:

there's a lot of wheel turning to get a change of direction.

There doesn't have to be, it depends on if the system is correctly set up.

The hydraulic steering on both my boats is 'geared' so the hydraulic ram pushes the rudder by far, far more that the distance the wheel is turned

 

I don't really have the problem anyway as with twin engines I can steer it tighter than any tiller or wheel simply by putting on in F'wd and one in reverse - it will then turn 'do-nuts' within its own length, so engines for close quarters manoeuvring and 'steering' when cruising.

[OldGoat]

5 hours ago, Alan de Enfield said:

There doesn't have to be, it depends on if the system is correctly set up.

The hydraulic steering on both my boats is 'geared' so the hydraulic ram pushes the rudder by far, far more that the distance the wheel is turned

 

I don't really have the problem anyway as with twin engines I can steer it tighter than any tiller or wheel simply by putting on in F'wd and one in reverse - it will then turn 'do-nuts' within its own length, so engines for close quarters manoeuvring and 'steering' when cruising.

With respect, nay a tinge of jealousy -

You have twin large rudders to help you steer when you're lee-rail-under

Your boat was designed  and built in volume (well more than canal boats are) - so there is knowledge at the point of manufacture for a near optimum setup

You don't have the option of a tiller arrangement (could be wrong there)

 

Us poor ditch crawlers don't have any of those advantages / features...

[Alan de Enfield]

3 minutes ago, OldGoat said:

Your boat was designed  and built in volume (well more than canal boats are) - so there is knowledge at the point of manufacture for a near optimum setup

Agreed - the Cat is a 'volume produced' boat.

 

My other boat (Cruiser) is a custom built 'one-off'.

 

The guy who had it built knew exactly what hull he wanted (it was an offshore trawler) but the company that built them had gone bust so he bought the moulds from the receivers.

He then bought a small boat builder and had them build the boat to his requirements - Twin engine (the original was a single) and a safe range of 2000miles, on-suite shower, separate on-suite toilet and basin to the master cabin. Shower room & toilet to the forward cabin, separate kitchen, separate dining room and separate saloon.

He knew exactly which engines he wanted (A matched pair of Ford 6-cylinder Dover engines) and travelled all over Europe to find them. He bought the engines and shipped them back to the UK where they were totally disassembled and rebuilt to the original specs.

 

I have all of the various invoices etc and bill of sale.

 

It was built in 2003, I bought it in 2015 and it had 73 hours 'on the clocks' it hadn't had much use - just a rich-man's fantasy.

 

There are still hundreds of the original boats out there fishing.

[Guest]

I remember steering a Leeds and Liverpool short boat called "Susan" when I was a youth (anyone know if she is still going?) She had been converted to wheel steering and I couldn't get on with it. Perhaps with time I might have got more familiar with it, but not in two days anyway. Think I would want a tiller on such a boat.

[OldGoat]

Thanks for the enlightenment  - now I'm totally confused; three boats? 

So where does the Cat: come in - or are you not inclined to change your bio?

[Alan de Enfield]

6 minutes ago, OldGoat said:

So where does the Cat: come in

I don't really get that much enjoyment in sailing, (you spend 50% of the time on engines anyway) I'd rather point where I want to go and get there.

 

The Cat gets used 'a bit' but now mainly by No1 Son and family (+ friends) when they comes back to the UK for holidays.

[peterboat]

Now my widebeam had tiller steering, when I converted it to electric I also installed wheel steering [hydraulic] which has low turns lock to lock, it also has a rudder indicator. now for speed its a tiller, for comfort its the wheel everytime, its taken me a while to get used to it, but now its a dodle, I do have a wheelhouse sit does make sense and if going through narrow gaps it helps with  a 12 foot widebeam to be able to see down one side. One other advantage is it sails where its pointed, I can take my hands of the wheel and dash inside pop the kettle on and get back out, and its still going straight, couldnt do that with the tiller

 

[Neil2]

I have a "narrowboat" with (hydraulic) wheel steering, it has to be as it's centre cockpit controlled.  I've also been on yachts with tiller steering and wheel steering, and other powered boats too, inboard and outboard motors.   It flies in the face of received wisdom I suspect but I much prefer a wheel in all these situations and I can't see how that view would change if I were to pilot a widebeam.  

 

There's a couple of reasons.  One Peter has mentioned above, even with a balanced rudder I have never had a narrowboat that would maintain a straight course for more than a few seconds if you let go of the tiller.  The second is the sheer joy of being able to steer and control the throttle/gears without moving.  I remember some of the early hire boats we had were a total pain to manoeuvre because of the relative positions of the throttle and tiller, but even a well thought out trad stern boat still isn't as sweet as having a wheel next to the throttle control.  YMMV of course!

[Guest]

I have seen a few boats that have both a wheel and tiller. One in particular was to enable a person in a wheelchair to steer with the wheel. Presumably there is some quick release method of disconnecting the wheel mechanism?

[Alan de Enfield]

26 minutes ago, catweasel said:

I have seen a few boats that have both a wheel and tiller. One in particular was to enable a person in a wheelchair to steer with the wheel. Presumably there is some quick release method of disconnecting the wheel mechanism?

On my hydraulic steering there is some 'magic' involved, as I can steer from either of the two helm stations.

Move one wheel and the other one doesn't move - but both work the rudder.

 

There is some sort of 'splitter-box' (non-return valve) in the system.

 

Edited July 8, 2019 by Alan de Enfield