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A list of battery charging figures

swift1894

By swift1894
in Boat Equipment

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WotEver Veteran II

WotEverDonate to Canal World

Posted
Posted

Can someone summarise what this topic is/was all about so I don't have to read 12 pages? :)

1. Read post #1.

2. Accept that OP was told to get some SG readings.

3. Read the post above yours.

 

The other 11 pages were nothing more than one poster confusing matters.

 

Tony

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George94 Experienced

George94

Posted
Posted (edited)

1. Read post #1.

2. Accept that OP was told to get some SG readings.

3. Read the post above yours.

 

The other 11 pages were nothing more than one poster confusing matters.

 

Tony

 

I think we need a new standard abbreviation for the Smartgauge, lest the electrical dunces amongst us (me especially) get confused by the letters SG.

 

ETA: I think your precis of the foregoing eleven pages was admirably succinct and impresively accurate.

Edited by George94
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WotEver Veteran II

WotEverDonate to Canal World

Posted
Posted

 

I think we need a new standard abbreviation for the Smartgauge, lest the electrical dunces amongst us (me especially) get confused by the letters SG.

I never use that abbreviation for SmartGauge for just that reason. SG is a commonly used abbreviation for Specific Gravity though, so I do use it in that context.

 

Tony

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George94 Experienced

George94

Posted
Posted

I never use that abbreviation for SmartGauge for just that reason. SG is a commonly used abbreviation for Specific Gravity though, so I do use it in that context.

 

Tony

 

Indeed, but not everybody is as punctilious as you concerning units and abbreviations.

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smileypete Veteran II

smileypete

Posted
Posted (edited)

1. Read post #1.

2. Accept that OP was told to get some SG readings.

3. Read the post above yours.

 

The other 11 pages were nothing more than one poster confusing matters.

 

Tony

 

Ah OK thanks, the initial posts make it sound like a case of insufficient charge voltage and charge time.

Edited by smileypete
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WotEver Veteran II

WotEverDonate to Canal World

Posted
Posted

 

Ah OK thanks, the initial posts make it sound like a case of insufficient charge voltage and charge time.

That's about the sum of it. Probably terminally sulphated batteries now, supported by low SG readings.

 

Tony

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BD3Bill Community Regular

BD3Bill

Posted
Posted

I do wonder if a lot of these battery problems we see on here are related to poor interconnection of battery banks???

 

Even though I only have two leisure batteries I found the existing arrangement was wrong, & wonder how much of the previous owners problems / dead bank were down to this one simple factor???

Go and look at Mr Brooks excellent diagrams !

 

The good fellows who venerate Trojans will of course be an exception by the very nature of how the banks have to be built up as they are multiples of 6v...mmm.

 

I read these threads with great interest as someone who doesn't get problems with the batteries. ( That'll jinx me ! )

 

What I do conclude is Inverters are bad. ( Runs for cover ! ) Is this assumption wholly wrong?

 

Cheers

Bill

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nicknorman Veteran II

nicknormanDonate to Canal World

Posted
Posted (edited)

I do wonder if a lot of these battery problems we see on here are related to poor interconnection of battery banks???

 

Even though I only have two leisure batteries I found the existing arrangement was wrong, & wonder how much of the previous owners problems / dead bank were down to this one simple factor???

Go and look at Mr Brooks excellent diagrams !

 

The good fellows who venerate Trojans will of course be an exception by the very nature of how the banks have to be built up as they are multiples of 6v...mmm.

 

I read these threads with great interest as someone who doesn't get problems with the batteries. ( That'll jinx me ! )

 

What I do conclude is Inverters are bad. ( Runs for cover ! ) Is this assumption wholly wrong?

 

Cheers

Bill

Inverters are bad only in that they represent a means of taking a lot of charge out of the batteries in a short space of time, if the owner is cavalier with connecting mains appliances. Used sensibly there is nothing wrong with them - its down to the old "you have to put back whatever you take out (and a bit more)".

 

As a result of Gibbo's views and Smartgauge website the perceived wisdom on here is that battery interconnect geometry is very important. I dispute that. What is important is to have interconnects of suitable beefiness and making good connections such that there is no significant voltage drop. If that is the case (as it is on our bank) it really doesn't matter if you have the connections all at one end, on the diagonal or (with more than 2 batteries) some convoluted star network. When we got the boat it had the high current connections at one end but it also had well made 70mm^2 interconnects and consequently, tests showed that the current on charge and discharge (eg 175A from the alternator, 200A into the inverter) was evenly shared between the batteries and there was no detectable (with a normal digital voltmeter) difference in voltage across any of the batteries.

 

When I came add the Mastershunt and go from 4 x 110AHs to 2 x 2 T105s, I did put the main connections across the diagonal simply because it was convenient to do so, but it didn't make any difference.

Edited by nicknorman
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Loafer Veteran

Loafer

Posted
Posted

Inverters are bad only in that they represent a means of taking a lot of charge out of the batteries in a short space of time, if the owner is cavalier with connecting mains appliances. Used sensibly there is nothing wrong with them - its down to the old "you have to put back whatever you take out (and a bit more)".

 

As a result of Gibbo's views and Smartgauge website the perceived wisdom on here is that battery interconnect geometry is very important. I dispute that. What is important is to have interconnects of suitable beefiness and making good connections such that there is no significant voltage drop. If that is the case (as it is on our bank) it really doesn't matter if you have the connections all at one end, on the diagonal or (with more than 2 batteries) some convoluted star network. When we got the boat it had the...

 

I've often wondered about that. I never could see how a 0.00000000000001 ohm short length of cable could make any difference anywhere.

 

Inverters are bad only if you leave them on when you don't need to use them, IMHO.

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nicknorman Veteran II

nicknormanDonate to Canal World

Posted
Posted

I may be wrong but I thought the basis for Gibbos thesis on battery connections was the resistance of the connections rather than the cable. Which as you say should be negligible.

Top Cat

Well it was both I think. Of course connections can deteriorate if not maintained and I think that when pressed, that was much of his point. But when I was measuring the battery voltages I was careful to put the probes on the actual battery posts and not on the cable terminations and as I said, no differences in voltage could be detected.

 

I suppose I can see that if you are installing a system knowing that it is never going to be looked at again, taking care to even out the connection paths might be a good idea, but personally I would prefer to spend a small amount of time every few years to ensure the connections are sound, and then the detail of the topology doesn't matter.

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ditchcrawler Veteran II

ditchcrawlerDonate to Canal World

Posted
Posted

 

I've often wondered about that. I never could see how a 0.00000000000001 ohm short length of cable could make any difference anywhere.

 

Inverters are bad only if you leave them on when you don't need to use them, IMHO.

But surly that would be twice the resistance of one half the length

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WotEver Veteran II

WotEverDonate to Canal World

Posted
Posted

But surly that would be twice the resistance of one half the length

Yes, and all he's (we're) aiming for is as close to perfection as possible. If you're making up the connections for a bank then why not do it to the best standard that you can?

 

Tony

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Top cat Rising Star

Top cat

Posted
Posted

I found out the hard way that fiddling with battery connections can cause problems.

The negative cable from my starter battery passed over one of the vents making topping up difficult. One day I decided to fix that by loosening the clamp on the battery terminal and rotating the connector. All seemed well immediately afterwards but after a couple of days the engine wouldn't turn over. After much diagnosis it turned out that when I rotated the connection I broke the connection within the battery which was making good enough contact for voltage readings but couldn't supply the cranking current. Result new battery.

 

Since then I leave battery terminal connections alone but make sure they we clean when fitted and keep them under a layer of vaseline.

 

Top Cat

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