How CRT are spending our donations, a prime example of utter waste of money

[cotswoldsman]

All of the Rufford volunteer group received a copy and all are boaters as well. I agree that this money should be spent elsewhere. I would make a start by repairing broken ground paddles and gate paddles on the western Leeds and Liverpool. After that I would repair the closed Elsan point at Lathom!

Peter I think you miss how these things work, besides recruiting new friends the most important thing is to retain existing friends and to do this you have to communicate and make them feel part of the club. Yes maybe the magazine does need improving but that comes with time. I have always found it difficult to understand why some boaters just don't get or understand the importance of friends

[cuthound]

If I were Richard and received a letter in that tone I think I would be loath to reply too, even more so now that it has been published in the public domain. I wonder what sort of reply you expected Laurence?

As regards Sister Mary. Well known in the nursing profession (thanks to Della Sadler-Moore) and perhaps amongst some boaters. Until recently there was nothing in the Spice of Bruerne (her old home) about her - now there is a small image and a small amount of text which may be read by those in the reception area which will hopefully encourage those interested enough to research her past on the Internet. There's her gravestone around the back of the museum (not somewhere everyone goes) and a small interpretation board and there was, until recently, a small pop up information board about her in the museum. This has been replaced very recently with some rather good display boards about her life. So 'otherwise forgotten' - that's probably true in the wider context and possibly why there is going to be, I understand, a new book about Sister Mary and her life.

Well before I became interested in canals, I recall seeing an episode of "This is your Life" (presented by Eamon Andrews) about her.

 

Edited to change Eamon beck from an auto corrected Damon.

Edited May 16, 2015 by cuthound

[cotswoldsman]

I think you will find when CaRT get round to producing an annual report that the number of 'recruited and retained Friends' will be just short of 10,000 as of financial year end (31 March).

 

So after almost three years the Trust has achieved just 10% of its self imposed ten year target of 100,000. From the Trust's 2013/14 Annual Report it was spending £2 for every £1 raised on charitable giving. Hopefully, the £900,000 loss will be much less in the 2014/15 Annual Report. However, there will still be a significant loss much higher than the Trust originally projected.

 

The revamped Waterfront is aimed mainly at donor and volunteer retention. It is, no doubt, aimed at 'Mr Average' who is not a boater.

 

 

 

 

I am not sure when I met with Ruth in January they were at 10,000 but most importantly retention was very high. Yes recruitment costs are high and I think even CRT will admit it took a while to find the best way to recruit but it seems they have cracked that. Just imagine what might happen if boaters got behind it, and I don't mean join but just carried a few flyers and handed them out.

[Leo No2]

Well before I became interested in canals, I recall seeing an episode of "This is your Life" (presented by Eamon Andrews) about her.

Edited to change Eamon beck from an auto corrected Damon.

Broadcast in 1959 - sadly there is no known copy of it - only a couple of stills, at least one of which is in the Boat Inn.

[mango]

I am not sure when I met with Ruth in January they were at 10,000 but most importantly retention was very high. Yes recruitment costs are high and I think even CRT will admit it took a while to find the best way to recruit but it seems they have cracked that. Just imagine what might happen if boaters got behind it, and I don't mean join but just carried a few flyers and handed them out.

I know we have had a few disagreements but I agree with that. Actually I'm proud to be a boater and a Friend. I don't agree with everything that CRT does but I recognise that they are endeavouring to support all who have an interest in waterways, even if that has nothing to do with boating.

[Tuscan]

As had been said this is not about boating but connecting with the wider audience who have been pounced on by a chugger and hopefully are too lazy to stop the direct debit. I'm told it normally takes about 3 years for these things to break even then the cash starts coming in faster than commissions going out. They probably have more engagement with canals as a linear park far more than anything to do with boating.

 

I see nothing wrong with CRT seeking to get more funds from the wider public and spending these funds on the wider canal experience.

hopefully leaving the existing funds to be spent on the system.

[cuthound]

Broadcast in 1959 - sadly there is no known copy of it - only a couple of stills, at least one of which is in the Boat Inn.

Wow, I was 5 then, what a memory (now where did I put my glasses?).

 

Didn't start canalling untill I was 19.

 

Thanks for the info, much appreciated.

[Allan(nb Albert)]

As had been said this is not about boating but connecting with the wider audience who have been pounced on by a chugger and hopefully are too lazy to stop the direct debit. I'm told it normally takes about 3 years for these things to break even then the cash starts coming in faster than commissions going out. They probably have more engagement with canals as a linear park far more than anything to do with boating.

 

I see nothing wrong with CRT seeking to get more funds from the wider public and spending these funds on the wider canal experience.

hopefully leaving the existing funds to be spent on the system.

Version 3 of the incremental benefits plan (which is the only one in the public domain, I think) suggests that in 2013/14 they would make a loss on charitable income of £400,000. They actually lost £900,000.

 

That plan shows that they will not be in gross profit until 2017/18 (year six). I guess this reflects the difficulty of competing in an already competitive marketplace when other charities are perceived as being more deserving.

 

The plan, which includes a prudence factor suggests that they will be generating £7m profit after 15 years (when government grant ceases).

 

 

 

 

[Laurence Hogg]

You didn't have much positive to say about the recent BBC 4 K&A video production either. It's almost like you run a media company or something.... Oh look... http://www.laurencehoggproductions.co.uk/

 

Well that was just cheap TV - end of story. Yes I do run LHP but what is the significance of that? we do more railway stuff now than waterways.

Do you agree CRT should spend your donations (if you donate) in this way?

Do you seriously think they will reach 100,00 friends?

Or like me do you wish we still had British Waterways with all its warts?

[cotswoldsman]

 

Well that was just cheap TV - end of story. Yes I do run LHP but what is the significance of that? we do more railway stuff now than waterways.

Do you agree CRT should spend your donations (if you donate) in this way?

Do you seriously think they will reach 100,00 friends?

Or like me do you wish we still had British Waterways with all its warts?

Yes I think they will reach 100,000 or near that figure the first 20,000 are the most difficult. Have you done much charity fund raising? I don't care how they spend the friends money if it helps reach the target. I know that in Ruth they have someone who knows what they are doing and has vast experience

[bassplayer]

Well that was just cheap TV - end of story. Yes I do run LHP but what is the significance of that? we do more railway stuff now than waterways.

Do you agree CRT should spend your donations (if you donate) in this way?

Do you seriously think they will reach 100,00 friends?

Or like me do you wish we still had British Waterways with all its warts?

1) You seemed more intent on slating the content of the magazine (and BBC 4 video) rather than it being produced in the first place. I think outreach is important for any charity or trust. It's important there is some sense of belonging as it helps retain enthusiasm. The magazine might work but everyone should be given the option to save printing costs and have it just sent by email.

 

2) I've no idea if it will reach 100,000 friends but at least they are trying to do something positive! There are too many negative people in this world.

 

3) I thought CRT was just a renamed BWB anyway. I've always said that things kind of worked until the tinkerers (to borrow the expression) were let loose.

 

If we are worried about wasted funds then we should stop this nonsense of suggesting that 'we' spend our money on stupid enforcement ideas (eg ANPR cameras). So long as boaters pay their licence fee and don't upset anyone, leave them alone.

[Laurence Hogg]

1) You seemed more intent on slating the content of the magazine (and BBC 4 video) rather than it being produced in the first place. I think outreach is important for any charity or trust. It's important there is some sense of belonging as it helps retain enthusiasm. The magazine might work but everyone should be given the option to save printing costs and have it just sent by email.

 

2) I've no idea if it will reach 100,000 friends but at least they are trying to do something positive! There are too many negative people in this world.

 

3) I thought CRT was just a renamed BWB anyway. I've always said that things kind of worked until the tinkerers (to borrow the expression) were let loose.

 

If we are worried about wasted funds then we should stop this nonsense of suggesting that 'we' spend our money on stupid enforcement ideas (eg ANPR cameras). So long as boaters pay their licence fee and don't upset anyone, leave them alone.

 

Have seen or read this magazine?

[Paul C]

Or like me do you wish we still had British Waterways with all its warts?

 

The thing is, you don't get the choice to go back to British Waterways running the network, the fact remains that there was a massive recession, the government of the time made sweeping cuts and one of those things was the transformation of BW into CRT.

[bassplayer]

Have seen or read this magazine?

Yes. I read it without prejudice and without a puffed up chest though.

[Laurence Hogg]

Yes. I read it without prejudice and without a puffed up chest though.

 

And you agree that the events list on page 7 is representative of whats going on?

[bassplayer]

And you agree that the events list on page 7 is representative of whats going on?

Yes, there could be more stuff in the events list. I'm sure the magazine will improve over time (it is the first issue). As others have said, it's not just targeted at boaters but I think it's a good start. Did you find anything good about the content of the magazine? If you did, your letter to Mr Parry could have contained at least some positives.

[Laurence Hogg]

Yes, there could be more stuff in the events list. I'm sure the magazine will improve over time (it is the first issue). As others have said, it's not just targeted at boaters but I think it's a good start. Did you find anything good about the content of the magazine? If you did, your letter to Mr Parry could have contained at least some positives.

 

I didn't find anything good about it at all except the quality of printing and assembly. It is not the first issue either the magazine has been running since day one. The previous version was on cheap lightweight paper and the content although poor was better than this one.

[baz gimson]

 

rub the thighs of their nylon trousers in satisfaction that it's got the right dimensions.

 

and wearing socks with their sandals to compliment their terylene trousers and curiously coiffured eyebrows

[bassplayer]

I didn't find anything good about it at all except the quality of printing and assembly. It is not the first issue either the magazine has been running since day one. The previous version was on cheap lightweight paper and the content although poor was better than this one.

Maybe you could volunteer your experience and skills to CRT if you think you can improve on it.

 

I don't think it would help if it was completely boater centric though. Don't forget CRT provide the Boaters Update which is more targeted at us boaters.

 

....there nothing positive about being negative....

[Laurence Hogg]

Maybe you could volunteer your experience and skills to CRT if you think you can improve on it.

 

I don't think it would help if it was completely boater centric though. Don't forget CRT provide the Boaters Update which is more targeted at us boaters.

 

....there nothing positive about being negative....

 

I am probably BW/CRT's oldest volunteer, having first started in 1972 collecting artefact's for the museum at Stoke Bruerne, I have done many other things with them over the years from running major events to advising on boat beams. Recently I have constantly badgered CRT to use the skills and knowledge that surrounds them in their licence holders and friends but to no avail.

 

In 49 years of involvement I have never seen the management so bad, the resources wasted and the moral so low as it is now. Look at the western Leeds Liverpool, would BW have allowed that scenario to develop even a few years ago?

They are wasting our donations and licence money (I pay both) and not doing the job properly. Also whilst they provide the boaters update there are many boaters who haven't a internet connection or are of the non PC user generation, what good is it to them.

 

Yesterday I looked at the notice boards in Wolverhampton, the mildewing notices are all over 4 years old and the contact numbers are now useless, one stating where the local office is (or was 9 years ago!). The depot and yard / facilities are so scruffy and weeded it looks disused, only our boat looks alive in the scene.

 

They have killed my enthusiasm, that's why my boat is for sale and when that goes I wish to have no further involvement with CRT.

[bassplayer]

 

I am probably BW/CRT's oldest volunteer, having first started in 1972 collecting artefact's for the museum at Stoke Bruerne, I have done many other things with them over the years from running major events to advising on boat beams. Recently I have constantly badgered CRT to use the skills and knowledge that surrounds them in their licence holders and friends but to no avail.

 

In 49 years of involvement I have never seen the management so bad, the resources wasted and the moral so low as it is now. Look at the western Leeds Liverpool, would BW have allowed that scenario to develop even a few years ago?

They are wasting our donations and licence money (I pay both) and not doing the job properly. Also whilst they provide the boaters update there are many boaters who haven't a internet connection or are of the non PC user generation, what good is it to them.

 

Yesterday I looked at the notice boards in Wolverhampton, the mildewing notices are all over 4 years old and the contact numbers are now useless, one stating where the local office is (or was 9 years ago!). The depot and yard / facilities are so scruffy and weeded it looks disused, only our boat looks alive in the scene.

 

They have killed my enthusiasm, that's why my boat is for sale and when that goes I wish to have no further involvement with CRT.

That's a pretty emotional post. When you say 'they' have killed your enthusiasm, who do you believe is directly responsible?

 

I suspect a lot of it is simply the changing needs of the waterways. Boating was probably the main driver in the past but now we have many different types of stakeholder. CRT are just trying to tap into all of them.

 

Personally, I am a bit cynical and wonder if there are other financial drivers behind it all. After all CRT are sitting on land and property worth a lot of money.

 

It's certainly interesting to see it from the viewpoint of someone who has worked hard to keep the heritage alive. Maybe it's too early to give up.

[cotswoldsman]

 

Look at the western Leeds Liverpool, would BW have allowed that scenario to develop even a few years ago?

 

Laurance what have I missed?

[Laurence Hogg]

Laurance what have I missed?

 

Lock 64 - Leeds & Liverpool Canal »

Waterway: Leeds & Liverpool Canal

From Date: 11th May 2015

To Date: 15th May 2015 at 23:59 inclusive

Lock 89 (Ell Meadow Lock) to Lock 87 (Wigan Bottom Lock / Dock Yard Lock) - Leeds & Liverpool Canal »

Waterway: Leeds & Liverpool Canal

From Date: 13th April 2015 at 20:00

To Date: 31st May 2015 at 08:00 inclusive

Southfield Bridge 159 to Church Bridge 160, West Marton »

Waterway: Leeds & Liverpool Canal

From Date: 11th May 2015 at 08:00

To Date: 17th July 2015 at 17:00 inclusive

The waterway is in a dreadful state from lack of maintenance.

[Laurie Booth]

 

I am probably BW/CRT's oldest volunteer, having first started in 1972 collecting artefact's for the museum at Stoke Bruerne, I have done many other things with them over the years from running major events to advising on boat beams. Recently I have constantly badgered CRT to use the skills and knowledge that surrounds them in their licence holders and friends but to no avail.

 

In 49 years of involvement I have never seen the management so bad, the resources wasted and the moral so low as it is now. Look at the western Leeds Liverpool, would BW have allowed that scenario to develop even a few years ago?

They are wasting our donations and licence money (I pay both) and not doing the job properly. Also whilst they provide the boaters update there are many boaters who haven't a internet connection or are of the non PC user generation, what good is it to them.

 

Yesterday I looked at the notice boards in Wolverhampton, the mildewing notices are all over 4 years old and the contact numbers are now useless, one stating where the local office is (or was 9 years ago!). The depot and yard / facilities are so scruffy and weeded it looks disused, only our boat looks alive in the scene.

 

They have killed my enthusiasm, that's why my boat is for sale and when that goes I wish to have no further involvement with CRT.

Link to boat sale please.

[adam1uk]

 

Lock 64 - Leeds & Liverpool Canal »

Waterway: Leeds & Liverpool CanalFrom Date: 11th May 2015To Date: 15th May 2015 at 23:59 inclusive

 

 

 

Lock 89 (Ell Meadow Lock) to Lock 87 (Wigan Bottom Lock / Dock Yard Lock) - Leeds & Liverpool Canal »

Waterway: Leeds & Liverpool CanalFrom Date: 13th April 2015 at 20:00To Date: 31st May 2015 at 08:00 inclusive

 

 

 

Southfield Bridge 159 to Church Bridge 160, West Marton »

Waterway: Leeds & Liverpool CanalFrom Date: 11th May 2015 at 08:00To Date: 17th July 2015 at 17:00 inclusive

 

The waterway is in a dreadful state from lack of maintenance.

One of those is overnight restrictions due to vandalism.