Alde Comfort 2928, no heat to radiators

[BlueRover]

Can anyone help me with this? I have an Alde comfort 2928 which appears to work fine. It fires up but no heat gets to the radiators. I can hear the circulation pump whirring and the water in the header/expansion tank gets hot. I have tried bleeding all 3 radiators but can find no airlock? The system also circulates through the calorifier (dual coil) though I can't see any valve to control whether the hot water from the boiler circulates to the radiators or the calorifier, or both. Up until recently the first radiator in the circuit would get warm but not the other two. On a trip last week, even the first radiator stayed cold even though the boiler had been running for around 20 mins and the water in the header tank on the Alde 2928 was close to boiling. The circulation pump was definitely working. I normally use engine heat for domestic hot water, which works fine. Any ideas/suggestions as to what may be going on and how to get heat into the radiators? Thanks in advance.

[bottle]

When you say the circulation pump is working are you sure it may be just making a noise and not moving any water.

 

If so, it could be the impeller is US

[bizzard]

Are the two wires on the circ pump on their correct terminals. The pump will run in reverse if their wrong.

[Nightwatch]

On our system we have an isolator valve before the first radiator. Do you. Is it closed.

[Kwacker]

I have the same setup.

Tucked away beneath the back steps are two large valves, if these are closed, the hot water is only circulated through the calorifier.

It is very easy to remove the circulation pump to check rotation and impeller integrity.

[dor]

Have you added more antifreeze to the system? If it is added neat, it can stop circulation in the radiators due to the difference in density. If the pipes are getting hot but the radiator isn't, it is either because the antifreeze hasn't mixed or it needs bleeding.

 

You also say that up until recently the first rad got warm but not the other two. It sounds as though you need a control in the calorifier loop - a 22mm full flow ball valve should be used. Depending on the setup, it is too easy for the circulation to just 'short-circuit' through the calorifier and not circulate through the rad circuit properly. You may find you can partially close it to balance the system, or shut it off completely so only the rads are heated. You may also find that if you run the pump on its own when the engine is running, the calorifier can act as a heat exchanger and get the rads surprisingly hot without using the boiler at all, provided the calorifier and rad circuits are balanced.

[Jo_]

Probably something unnecessary to ask, but have you checked the level of the water in the plastic reservoir that surrounds the circulation pump? I ask because we had the same problem (everything seemed fine but the radiators weren't heating) and, from the outside, it LOOKED as though the level was fine but that was just staining on the plastic. When Graham the Alde man opened it up unscrewed the circulation pump and lifted it to check the bottle, it was empty ). Refilling it and keeping an eye on the level has solved the problem. Graham gave me a little hollow plastic tube which, when I've unscrewed the pump and lifted it a bit, I can drop in and check the level of the water/antifreeze very easily.

[Nightwatch]

Only slightly off topic as it's about our boiler.

 

Had a couple of problems over the past couple of days. Wouldn't light at all. Replaced the igniter. All is well,lights the pilot within a second or two. The pilot stays slight indefinitely.

Turn knob and main burner starts up. Okay!

 

However, after about a minute or thereabouts the main burned goes out and the unit starts to tick like the pilot has gone out also. Turn back the the 'Star' and the tick tick stops. The pilot is still lit. Turn knob and the main burner reignites, goes out after a minute or so again and repeat the above until you have no tolerance left.

 

Any ideas please. We have two new puppies that need a bit of constant heat throughout the boat. As do we humans.

 

Martyn

Edit. We have an Alde slimline.

Edited January 11, 2015 by Nightwatch

[Tony Brooks]

What shape is the pilot light flame? They are not symmetrical and should have a longer jet directed over the flame failure. When mine suffered the inevitable spider/rust problem the flame looked ok but was symmetrical, it had lost the longer jet. Worth a check

[Nightwatch]

Thanks Tony. I will look now and report back.

 

Martyn

What shape is the pilot light flame? They are not symmetrical and should have a longer jet directed over the flame failure. When mine suffered the inevitable spider/rust problem the flame looked ok but was symmetrical, it had lost the longer jet. Worth a check

had a look. All seems to be okay with the pilot. The thermocouple is well and truely covered with the flame.

[Tony Brooks]

In that case I suspect the thermocouple. Best make sure nut securing its tube into the control box is tight. The destructions say that you need to make sure the contact surfaces of the joint nipple are clean I think that is under the union nut.

 

Just had an off the wall thought, you are not running out of gas by any chance? With a near empty bottle and a cool morning might prevent sufficient gas vaporising for the main burned but will do enough for the pilot light.

[Nightwatch]

Thanks again. Gas,I think is okay, I will check. I fear I have to the blooming thing apart AGAIN.

 

Tiresome as it is tight in a corner and sadly I'm the wrong shape for standing on my head. Things need to be done.

 

Martyn

[gaggle]

Thanks again. Gas,I think is okay, I will check. I fear I have to the blooming thing apart AGAIN.

 

Tiresome as it is tight in a corner and sadly I'm the wrong shape for standing on my head. Things need to be done.

 

Martyn

The same problem ,wrong gas butane ? instead of propane which when used solved problem , saying that sure I had to also swap connection valve to do the switch so maybe not

 

Can anyone help me with this? I have an Alde comfort 2928 which appears to work fine. It fires up but no heat gets to the radiators. I can hear the circulation pump whirring and the water in the header/expansion tank gets hot. I have tried bleeding all 3 radiators but can find no airlock? The system also circulates through the calorifier (dual coil) though I can't see any valve to control whether the hot water from the boiler circulates to the radiators or the calorifier, or both. Up until recently the first radiator in the circuit would get warm but not the other two. On a trip last week, even the first radiator stayed cold even though the boiler had been running for around 20 mins and the water in the header tank on the Alde 2928 was close to boiling. The circulation pump was definitely working. I normally use engine heat for domestic hot water, which works fine. Any ideas/suggestions as to what may be going on and how to get heat into the radiators? Thanks in advance.

room thermostat turned down

[Nightwatch]

Right, here we go. Took it all apart,cleaned,tightened and blew everything.

 

Put it all back together again. Same symptoms.

 

Then a rush of blood to the brain. We have just had a pram cover fitted. Our boat is a cruiser stern and the boiler is in the corner to the side of the steps. Where a stove goes in a rear cabin.

 

Now the design of the cover goes over the vent for the boiler. They have created a trunking in Acrylic material with an external material mesh to stop exhaust fumes entering the cover and also to allow vent to air.

 

It's been a bit windy hasn't it? There's the problem. Remove the trunking and hey presto fully operational. Time to talk to the cover fittererers me thinks.

 

Thanks for the suggestions.

 

Nice and warm Now and the puppies are grateful, I think!

 

Martyn

[Tony Brooks]

This is very worrying.Unless the Alde is exceptionally old it uses a balanced flue so any "extension" of the flue would have top be twin tubes, an inner and an outer plus a suitable flue termination to minimise the chances of burned gasses being drawn back down the flue. I suspect that is exactly what has been happening. When the main burner fires up it fills the new "tube" with burnt gasses (no or very little oxygen) that then get drawn back into the burner and so putting it out.

 

I also suspect it could produce a BSS fail and increases the risk of lost of CO being produced.

 

This seem to fit very nicely with certain aspects of the Cable Size topic where people who a boater would suppose would know what they are on about actually do not.

 

Please report the cover maker's comments back and maybe offer to PM their name to anyone who is looking for a cover maker. This sounds downright dangerous.

[Nightwatch]

I will certainly be talking to the canopy people.

 

I will anticipate a bit of a battle with them as I suggested that this may well fail a BSC.

 

Martyn

[MtB]

This is very worrying. <snip> This sounds downright dangerous.

I agree. Not only that but this is an offence under the Gas Safety (Installation and Use) Regulations 1998 on several counts.

 

3. - (1) No person shall carry out any work in relation to a gas fitting or gas storage vessel unless he is competent to do so.

 

8. - (2) No person shall do anything which would affect a gas fitting or any flue or means of ventilation used in connection with the fitting in such a manner that the subsequent use of the fitting might constitute a danger to any person, except that this paragraph does not apply to an alteration to premises.

 

26. - (2) No person shall connect a flued domestic gas appliance to the gas supply system except by a permanently fixed rigid pipe.

 

26. - (9) Where a person performs work on a gas appliance he shall immediately thereafter examine

(a) the effectiveness of any flue

( the supply of combustion air;

© its operating pressure or heat input or, where necessary, both;

(d) its operation so as to ensure its safe functioning, and forthwith take all reasonable practicable steps to notify any defect to the responsible person and, where different, the owner of the premises in which the appliance is situated or, where neither is reasonably practicable, in the case of an appliance supplied with liquefied petroleum gas, the supplier of gas to the appliance, or, in any other case, the transporter.

 

The GSIUR apply to your boat as it is a residence. This flue modification ought really to be reported to the HSE under the RIDDOR regulations too.

 

A call complaining to Gas Safe Register would probably be acted on too, and result in them getting a stern letter from the HSE (or even a prosecution) if you feel they try to fob you off.

 

MtB

[Nightwatch]

Wow! I've opened a hornet nest here.

 

I will speak to the company asap and ascertain what can be done.

 

Martyn

Edited January 11, 2015 by Nightwatch