nb-Dusk Till Dawn

[John Orentas]

Chris.

 

Yes they do things like that, I bought my first shell from L P (a long time ago). At that time they did nothing but build shells, engine fitters and general fitters out were welcomed into the place to do their jobs.

 

The somewhat negative reputation they have now is not well deserved, the average first time buyer would be surprised at the number of new boats on the market, sold under various names are in fact L P shells. The situation is to some extent self inflicted in that being at the low cost end of the market they attract the low cost fitters out, many disappear after selling a couple of boats.

[John Orentas]

Stan.

 

I have always liked the look of the 'double doughnut' type of R & D coupling, though I have no direct experience of them. The problem is invariably that all the options require varying amounts of space between the stern tube and gearbox, it is often necessary to move the engine forward on it's beds.

 

The good news for Stuarts boat is that there appears to be a lot of space available.

[ChrisPy]

Chris.

 

Yes they do things like that, I bought my first shell from L P (a long time ago).  At that time they did nothing but build shells, engine fitters and general fitters out were welcomed into the place to do their jobs.

 

The somewhat negative reputation they have now is not well deserved, the average first time buyer would be surprised at the number of new boats on the market, sold under various names are in fact L P shells.

stuart's boat is a sailaway from LB, so it includes the engine installed by LB (directly or by their subcontractor).

 

I agree that it is easy for a company producing a huge number of boats at comparatively low prices to get a negative reputation. LB build about 400 boats a year, many of them fully fitted, and they are still expanding their production faciltities. They couldn't continue to do that if the product was of questionable quality. Having seen the level of activity (ie lack of typical British inactivity!) in their workshops, it is clear that their low prices are very much the result of efficiency, plus a standard production line type of process. I'll bet they don't have many post-delivery problems with welding or other basics that could cause a lot of grief to fix.

 

I would be interested to hear of others' experiences of the engine installations of LB sailaways. What about hire boats? It is hard to believe that there are hundreds of LB built hire boats out there noisily shaking themselves to bits. Call out and maintenance costs would be prohibitive.

[John Orentas]

Chris.

 

Not quite sure what point you are making, I have never heard of a hire boat being built by L B.

 

Don't no about "hundreds of boats" we have only seen photo's of one.

Edited February 8, 2005 by John Orentas

[ChrisPy]

Chris.

 

 

Don't no about "hundreds of boats" we have only seen photo's of one.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I think you'll find it's an LB standard. mine's a 57' widebeam and Stuart's one looks exactly as mine is described.

[Richard Bustens]

HI all

Well i may be missing something but i fail to see how you can have a solid mounting from the prop shaft through the hull bearing at one end and onto the gear box the other and put the engine on flexible mounts .

Surly at best the bearing is going to ware out in next to no time

[Gary Stacey]

Could add a standard r and d (the plastic/nylon one abot 2" or so thick), these take up very little room and do allow a certain amount of movement, should be easy to retrofit.

[ChrisPy]

Could add a standard r and d (the plastic/nylon one abot 2" or so thick),  these take up very little room and do allow a certain amount of movement, should be easy to retrofit.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

would that require the engine to be moved forward?

can it be done without shortening the shaft?

[Gary Stacey]

you may be able to slide the prop shaft through enough to accomodate this without having to move the engine. Or shorten the prop saft a couple of inches, if it is a clamp on 'split half' type coupling with no keyway this is easy enough to do

 

Gary

[john b.]

From their sales brochure L.Bs appear to fit a flexy coupling to fully fitted boats 50ft and above anything shorter its an optional extra.

Not sure whether this also applies to sailaways.

Puzzled.

 

Johnb

[ChrisPy]

From their sales brochure L.Bs appear to fit a flexy coupling to fully fitted boats 50ft and above anything shorter its an optional extra.

    Not sure whether this also applies to sailaways.

                                Puzzled.

                           

                                              Johnb

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

my boat should have a 30mm Vetus shaft with a 48hp Isuzu.

The standard literature states as an optional extra (for 1.5" shaft).

 

anyway they didn't agree to fit one.

[John Orentas]

If space is a problem it may be possible to fit an Aqua-Drive coupling. An expensive option but they are very good, the difficult bit is fitting a thrust bearing along with it's welded in mounting plate in front of the stern tube. Between the end of the prop-shaft and the gearbox is fitted a double constant velocity joint arrangement which allows a great deal of misalignment. Not really a DIY job.

 

The double doughnut type R & D coupling always looks good to me, on my first boat, before they where available I made up a similar unit using two Hurth nylon couplings about six inches apart. These types of coupling have the advantage of being capable of transmitting the thrust through to the gearbox without an additional bearing.

 

On my present boat I have again built my own system, similar to an Aqua-Drive with a separate thrust bearing, but using an industrial type 'Rubber tyre' coupling, this system works perfectly and is very cheap to install.

 

Whatever type of coupling arrangement you decide upon, it must allow angular and linear misalignment and also cope with the thrust from the propeller shaft.

 

There are no easy options for retro-fitting.

Edited February 9, 2005 by John Orentas

[Richard Bustens]

Are we sure that there is no flexi joint in the shaft as i can not see any builder mounting a engine on flexi mounts and not putting same on the shaft.

Or is it possible that the engine mounts are not flexi but just adjusting bolts solid mounted? then it would not need a flexi coupling.

[Amicus]

I can’t tell from the photo but this may be a different set-up to that described by John a little while ago.

What might be installed here is a cutlass bearing in the outer end of the tube and a stuffing box/gland fitted to the inner end of the stern-tube via a length of flexible hose. A cutlass bearing can stand a small amount of misalignment, tis made of polypropylene, maybe polyurethane.

The Vetus web-site shows it better than I can describe, http://www.vetus.com/

Under propshafts.

This type of set-up is very common on salty type boats.

[stuart]

Insulation finally complete. Roof insulation held in place with small wooden battens that will eventually take the oak-ply lining over the cabin roof.

 

 

Lining out the hull sides has begun using 9mm oak ply. Fairly straight forward so far!

 

[stuart]

You guys are worrying me about this prop shaft stuff....

 

I've got a couple more photos here to try and help identify the bits and pieces. The boat is fitted with a Vetus prop.

 

I'm okay with the DIY of the shell fitout but engines are foreign to me!

 

 

For a bigger image, Click here

 

 

Click here for bigger image

[stuart]

I have been waiting for a bit of a technical run-through of your boat, perhaps with you saying that the photo' showed a mock up of the final installation, but it  does look a bit finished.

 

If that really is the finished installation, it is appalling that a builder would send out a boat with an engine installed in that manner. 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Hi John.

 

This is the "finished" engine/gearbox layout. I've not touched it - and hopefully I wont have too.

 

Stu.

[Amicus]

Worry not! wot you got there is as I desribed above. Note the hose and hose clips, and the small dia. hose from the weed-hatch thinngy to the stuffing box, this provides lub and cooling to the stuffing-box and the out-board bearing, (compleat with valve)

[Amicus]

One thing you should check with the installer, the gland packing, I would expect it to be the PTFE variety as opposed to the traditional greasy type. This is to do with it being water lubed, notice you don’t have the usual brass greaser

http://skyscraper.fortunecity.com/daisywheel/371/alfa/4.html

Edited February 9, 2005 by Amicus

[John Orentas]

I have noticed in recent years that other types of gland packing material has become available, I too have wondered if one of the newer ones is better that the traditional type. Have you seen any reports or whatever.

[Richard Bustens]

Well Liverpool Boats are a member of this forum can we not ask them to comment.?

[Amicus]

John, It’s a few years since I’ve been active in the boaty world and am nowhere near up to speed. (You may have noticed I’m trying to rectify this vis.narrowboats ) I have experience only of the traditional greasy stuff and the PTFE. These two are not interchangeable, one needs grease and the other needs water. Obviously there are environmental ground for using the PTFE but it means a complete change of the stern-gear, or rather, the stern-tube.

[Tommo]

If I recall correctly the Centerflex M type flexi coupling will fit straight onto the gearbox in place of the fixed coupling, without adjusting the shaft length.

 

Tommo

Edited February 9, 2005 by Tommo

[John Orentas]

Water lubricated stern-tubes don't work well on the canals, the amount of grit in the water wears things out rapidly.

 

The RS components catalogue contains several alternative gland packing materials, the one that stands out is PTFE, this stuff is used for bearings in industrial use without lubricants at all. I do wonder if it has been tried out on conventional stern-tubes by any of the magazines or builders.

[Amicus]

The RS components catalogue contains several alternative gland packing materials, the one that stands out is PTFE, this stuff is used for bearings in industrial use without lubricants at all.  I do wonder if it has been tried out on conventional stern-tubes by any of the magazines or builders.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Emmmmm, dunno mate. Presumably you would continue to use grease for the bearing, so it comes down to, using grease in the PTFE packing????

At a guess I would say no problem, PTFE is good without any additional lubricant. But I don’t see what you would gain.