Turning sharp bends

[DHutch]

Yeah mooring on such 'hotspots' is always good fun.

- I very much enjoyed the fortnight spent paint the boat moored opersite braunston junction water point.

- With a boat on the waterpoint theres only about 10ft of canal there, on a bend, lined with boats, just after the juntion.

- Loads of boats fail to make it round, and a rather staggering number try to get two 7ft boats in a 10ft space.

 

Then when someone crams it into you and applogises the response is (roller in hand) "dont worry, i only painted it this morning"... gotta love it!

 

 

 

Daniel

[bristol & argo]

Yeah, we sound off at every blind/narrow/bridgeona bend, but you rairly get a response boat or no boat.

 

- But as you say, speed is the key. Get that 22tonnes upto 5mph, and watch the little boats moving out of the way.

Daniel

 

I see your 22t and raise you 15t...

 

Why is it people seem assume that 37t of motor and butty with only 22hp is able to stop, and why do they race you to a bridge hole? OK they get to the bridge hole first, they get to go through the bridge hole first, but then they have to stop anyway because there is motor and butty jacknifed all over the cut.

 

If you hear a railway lookout horn approaching a blind bend or bridge hole, it could be me, i'm only going slowly, but 37t is not going to stop in half a boats length, and certainly not in a straight line!

 

Simon.

[mayalld]

I see your 22t and raise you 15t...

 

Why is it people seem assume that 37t of motor and butty with only 22hp is able to stop, and why do they race you to a bridge hole?

 

Cos they are clueless, just like canoeists who assume that you are going to be able to steer to the last inch at slow speed and not crush them.

[David Schweizer]

I see your 22t and raise you 15t...

 

Why is it people seem assume that 37t of motor and butty with only 22hp is able to stop, and why do they race you to a bridge hole? OK they get to the bridge hole first, they get to go through the bridge hole first, but then they have to stop anyway because there is motor and butty jacknifed all over the cut.

 

If you hear a railway lookout horn approaching a blind bend or bridge hole, it could be me, i'm only going slowly, but 37t is not going to stop in half a boats length, and certainly not in a straight line!

 

Simon.

This is a bit but it is nice to see that Bristol is still in active service. Has she still got her Black Prince conversion, or has she been returned to working condition.

 

My friend Geoffrey use to own her, but she was sold about five years ago, a long story, but not for telling here. I also remember her when she was in the Willow Wren fleet under the name Dipper, Jack Boswell had her for a while and I believe his son Tommy was born it.

 

We are planning tom go down the Sourthern GU later this year so maybe we will see her.

[GUCCC150]

I see your 22t and raise you 15t...

 

Why is it people seem assume that 37t of motor and butty with only 22hp is able to stop, and why do they race you to a bridge hole? OK they get to the bridge hole first, they get to go through the bridge hole first, but then they have to stop anyway because there is motor and butty jacknifed all over the cut.

 

If you hear a railway lookout horn approaching a blind bend or bridge hole, it could be me, i'm only going slowly, but 37t is not going to stop in half a boats length, and certainly not in a straight line!

 

Simon.

 

I agree Monarch is a heavy old cow and very deep in the water but they also think they will beat you !!! But they always lose as weight is everything

[g0n]

For what it's worth, local charts of the Ure up around Boroughbridge (where there's a series of /very/ sharp bends) say that you should sound your horn before turning each one - one long blast to say that you're entering a blind corner. Never met another boat coming the opposite way in that bit, and I'm glad - it's very narrow and would be awkward. Upstream of West Haddlesley Flood Lock on the Aire there's a similar stretch but a bit wider.

 

Personally, I always drop to dead dead slow before entering a blind corner, and sound the horn. Cruising with the ex, I usually went and stood on the bows going round very sharp bends, to get the maximum warning of anything coming.

 

On a river, it also depends on the strength and direction of the flow. On a fairly quick flowing river like the Ure, going upstream, I'd always try and give way to the boat coming downstream, as they're going to have a hellish worse time slowing down than me.

 

 

 

 

A couple of years back, we were cruising on the River Wey. On the way back to the Thames, I was steering the boat. Coming up to a sharp right hand bend, people on the bows started shouting 'boat!'

 

This was one of those sharp bends you really only get on rivers although there are some on the canals. Anyway, I got a bit flustered (if I'm honest) on seeing the bows of this narrowboat come round the bend and me, more or less heading for those bows.

 

I had been trying to take the corner wide so as not to hit the bottom on the inside, plus there was a tree in the way, and this obviously put me on the left of the bend, the wrong side.

 

Anyway, I felt I had two options. Either forget steering and put her astern and quickly or try to steer more sharply round the bend. I opted for the former after trying the steering bit (didn't seem to be working very well).

 

I did manage to slow the boat down but we still crashed into the other boat at a bit of an angle. I apologised profusely and the other boat was understanding and didn't seem too bothered - I love bow fenders! (Not an excuse to go crashing into other boats though, I know!)

 

I am now put off steering round sharp bends because of the dilemma of where to be in the navigation e.g. left, middle or right, especially when turning the right-handers. Left hand bends are OK since you just take them, reasonably, as wide as possible.

 

So the question really is, how do people cope with sharp right hand bends and what would be your course of action if a boat was coming towards you which you hadn't spotted due to the corner? Any thoughts...

[Billypownall]

Perfect people don't exist and as someone who has been boating, carefully, fragile boats for many years and rarely goes above tickover, without any major mishaps I think you're talking to the wrong boater.

 

And yes I used to ski regularly when I lived in France. Fell over loads (as did more skilled skiers than I) never damaged anything though.

I do hope while you are travelling at tickover you give some thought to those behind Carit. Tickover merchants who think everyone shouldn't exceed 2 mph are getting just as big a problem as the speedsters.

[carlt]

I do hope while you are travelling at tickover you give some thought to those behind Carit. Tickover merchants who think everyone shouldn't exceed 2 mph are getting just as big a problem as the speedsters.

No I'm an ignorant hypocrite who wouldn't dream of letting anyone overtake me.

[Billypownall]

No I'm an ignorant hypocrite who wouldn't dream of letting anyone overtake me.

Just the sort of reply I expected. However I would say you are not a hypocrite who is a person who pretends to be what he is not. You make no pretence. It would be nice though to think kindly of you.

[Puffer]

All very interesting. I have had a number of close encounters on sharp bends, but no "strikes". I try and adopt the policy that slow approach is best and when nearing the bend turn into it and increase speed, watching whether the front end reacts enough or not, adjusting the revs accordingly. A slow approach and then applying power gives a twisting rather than forward motion. If I encounter an oncoming boat, I apply enough astern to slow down, hopefully enabling me to see the reaction of the other boat. Failing this I stop and worry about the correction after. Seems to work quite well.

I agree that the use of horns should be encouraged, even a novice boater would realise there is someone round the corner.

[carlt]

Just the sort of reply I expected. However I would say you are not a hypocrite who is a person who pretends to be what he is not. You make no pretence. It would be nice though to think kindly of you.

Where practicable, I let folk overtake, though on a hogged workboat drawing over 3', I don't give up the centre channel easily. If it's not possible to let someone past I'll speed up to 4mph (except past moored boats). If you want to go faster than that then you can risk the shallows.

[Machpoint005]

No I'm an ignorant hypocrite who wouldn't dream of letting anyone overtake me.

Nice one, Carlt: the response you got suggests the Americans aren't the only lot who don't 'do' irony.

 

Where practicable, I let folk overtake

 

I'm with you on this one, and it has to be up to the boat in front to decide when someone can come past. It's never up to the fastard behind.

[honey ryder]

but isnt it annoying when someone can "tickover" slower than you, which means you have to take it in and out of gear for miles on end past moored boats. ive had that happen to us in some places and the Man complains telling me to overtake them...but its impossible to overtake in this situation, we just have to struggle to avoid the moored boats as we drift around out of gear. . Dont get me wrong, we dont go fast anywhere, but i think our tickover might be faster than some others.

 

i had a recent encounter with a sharp turn, thankfully no one coming the other way. chugging along at maybe 3mph, suddenly i realise the corner is ALOT tighter than i anticipated, maybe 100 degrees turn left. i had the tiller hard over but it wasnt turning fast enough. had no option but to reverse to avoid harpooning the plastic boat on the corner. I had the option to add more revs to make it turn a bit faster but i really didnt want to damage another persons boat attempting that. I think it was too late for the extra speed option.

bit embarrassed but no contact made with anyone or bankside. Got moaned at for ages about being a rubbish woman driver for hours after, in fact He was still on about it the next day.

it didnt help that the following day i damaged the rain cap on the chimney because i caught an over hanging branch going round a similar sharp bend.

Edited June 13, 2007 by honey ryder

[carlt]

but isnt it annoying when someone can "tickover" slower than you, which means you have to take it in and out of gear for miles on end past moored boats. ive had that happen to us in some places and the Man complains telling me to overtake them...but its impossible to overtake in this situation, we just have to struggle to avoid the moored boats as we drift around out of gear. . Dont get me wrong, we dont go fast anywhere, but i think our tickover might be faster than some others.

Yes it is. Though my engine speed is wonderfully slow, at tickover, Usk has a huge prop so it still pushes along at a reasonable speed. Following someone who not only travels slower at tickover but also is going so slowly they can't move in a straight line, can get very annoying.

 

Sometimes I think people don't look behind them when dawdling and, in turn, don't read the cut ahead, when desperate to over take.

[DHutch]

Ahh, you see, this is where the beauty of not having a gearbox really takes off!

- But yes, being stuck behind someone whos going slower than you can is always a bad thing.

 

 

Daniel

[Ron]

Yes it is. Though my engine speed is wonderfully slow, at tickover, Usk has a huge prop so it still pushes along at a reasonable speed. Following someone who not only travels slower at tickover but also is going so slowly they can't move in a straight line, can get very annoying.

 

Sometimes I think people don't look behind them when dawdling and, in turn, don't read the cut ahead, when desperate to over take.

 

We probably take a boat out for a week a year and claim no expertise.

 

I think most of our problems have been caused by indecision, lack of confidence and going too slowly to allow steerage.

 

Worst nightmares have been heavy cross winds when passing moorings.

You are desperately trying to prevent the boat drifting sideways into moored craft and a only accomplish this by going at an unsocial speed.

Try turning a sharp bend in these conditions and you really have problems!

 

Sidestreams before locks and bridges causing a similar dilemma - you need the speed to stop the boat being spun, it becomes a game of nerves.

 

I sometimes suspect people cause an awful lot of problems for themselves by being "over polite", so often both boats approaching a bridge ( or corner ) stop dead, loose steerage and start drifting into a bank or whatever, when if one actualy made the decision to go through, neither would be in difficulty.

 

Clear decisions and clear intentions are needed ... use of horns also helps

Making a wrong but correctable decision can be better that making none.

 

You seem to be able to turn suprisingly sharply by throwing open the throttle with the tiller on full lock, which at times can be a better option than reverse as you have more control. But obviously not always appropriate.

 

I don't advocate lunacy, but feel the first aim of anyone driving a 15mt plus vehicle should be control, with the niceties coming a close second.

 

Is there a large unused stretch of water somewhere to practice on?

Edited August 20, 2008 by Ron

[John Orentas]

One of the hardest things to do with a narrowboat, manoeuvring without making headway.

 

I always tell people, when you find yourself in a basin without too many other boats around practise getting a rotation of the boat without moving forward, most boats will do it.. Use the throttle in a series of half/full power blips on full tiller interspersed by similar in reverse with no tiller.

 

With practise you will find that you can get the boat rotating in it's own length.

 

The other manoeuvre people have problems with is bringing the boat to a stop in a narrow channel at the same time maintaining direction and staying in the same spot.. The technique is very similar to the above... Short blips of throttle.

 

Of course when you are playing about in that basin; Make an utter mess of it and there will be a coach party watching your efforts, get it right, there won't be a soul.

[Ron]

One of the hardest things to do with a narrowboat, manoeuvring without making headway.

 

Of course when you are playing about in that basin; Make an utter mess of it and there will be a coach party watching your efforts, get it right, there won't be a soul.

 

... the spectators are mandatory as are the fishermen!

 

My apologies to the young fisherman at Ellesmere a week back, who thought I was aiming for him personally when turning the boat.

(I'm half convince they deliberately stake out the most inconvenient places to plant themeselves)

 

... though for once I got it right, and even got complimented on the performance!

 

There's a good feeling to not embarrassing yourself in front of the crowd!

[RLWP]

One of the hardest things to do with a narrowboat, manoeuvring without making headway.

 

It is also one of the most satisfying things to do when you get it right.

 

Another place to practice is while waiting for your crew to set up a lock for you. I very very rarely tie up at a lock, it only wastes time and gets the ropes dirty. Generally I will either hover in mid stream or allow the boat to get completely out of shape until the gate opens. Then put the boat back in the right place ready to go.

 

Richard

[MoominPapa]

Generally I will either hover in mid stream or allow the boat to get completely out of shape until the gate opens.

This known in Moomin circles as "lurking". There's nothing more irritating than seeing the gates start to open and setting off to get into the lock with perfect timing, then finding that the relevant shore crew is too busy yakking and doesn't get the other gate open in time.

 

MP.

[gaggle]

a boat came round a bend at pace and i went into full reverse while pressing the horn , the man tried his best but his stern gave us a good wallop as it swung round on full throttle.

noticed later two tiles had fell off around the fire. he did say he was very sorry.

[alan_fincher]

There's nothing more irritating than seeing the gates start to open and setting off to get into the lock with perfect timing, then finding that the relevant shore crew is too busy yakking and doesn't get the other gate open in time.

 

Been there, done that!.....

 

My shore crew tells me that the social aspects of meeting and chatting to other boaters, (and patiently listening to their response), outweigh any need to move along smartly.

 

I kind of accept that, but when you thought you were making a perfectly timed approach, only to have to throw it in reverse, and see the bow slew off course, what was going to be a virtuoso move suddenly instead makes you look a complete plonker.

 

Another of our frequent differences of approach results from OH being a largely "glass half full" person, whereas I'm (definitely!), "glass half empty".

 

Seeing a lock that appears that it might push open with no paddle winding, Cath will always try that first, then 90% of the time find there is a marginal difference in levels, and windlass is required. Again, I've often wrongly anticipated little delay, and end up having to pull up, often wasting more time than if I hadn't wrongly predicted lock opening point.

 

Me, unless I can see a physical gap between the gates, I always draw a paddle before attempting to open them.

[DHutch]

It is also one of the most satisfying things to do when you get it right.

Yeah exactly!

- As john says its all about short, but not too harsh, drives in each direction, with the rudder in optimal possition, not to flattened, and a far moregentle angle in reverse. And just cross your fingars and make it look like your a pro.

 

If you do a really good job, it has deffonatly been know for people to cheer...

 

 

Daniel

[Keithtug]

Thought I'd add my bit..

 

You're coming upto a blind bend with a bridge. You've already slowed down as it's common sense to do that when you can't see where you're going! You get lined up for the bridge and then you're able to see someone else has done the same.

 

I too often see the other boat slam it into reverse and rev the arse off it, and as john says, alot of smoke, alot of noise and no action. Nine times out of 10 the other boat will just carry on going, slowling just a little, whilst the back end kicks out - as John says alot of smoke, a lot of noise but no action.

 

When I'm in this position I'd swing the tiller to straighten the boat up again whilst still going ahead and then slowly reverse to slow right down or even stop the boat. If you need to stop quickly, I find short sharp blasts of reverse is better than just slamming it into reverse and watching the boat go all over.

 

I'v driven alsorts of boats ranging from a 17" cruiser to a Leeds Liverpool Longboat, and the following applies for all of them..... You put it in reverse and it may stop in a boats length if you're lucky, but swinging the tiller and putting the revs on swings the bows away (or towards) where you want to go alot more quickly and also slows the boat anyway.

 

I foolishly cruised northwards along the Trent & Mersey from Middlewich towards Dutton on a Saturday afternoon as there's 3 hire bases around there and all of the hire boats just stuck into reverse, which means although they were slowing down, just carried on in a straight line when going round corners instead of getting the revs up and pushing the tiller over avoiding wasting time.

 

Sorry for the belated reply to this post, but I've only just seen it!

I'd love to see a 17" cruiser!!!! Have you got a photo? Do you need 2? One for each foot!!!

 

[Yakbird]

Sorry for the belated reply to this post, but I've only just seen it!

I'd love to see a 17" cruiser!!!! Have you got a photo? Do you need 2? One for each foot!!!

 

 

Cool idea, these mini diesel-powered water skis! You not got any yet?