Water not coming through

[brian1042]

When I got my boat (a very old Bourne 35), I had a very thorough introduction from the guy at the boatyard. There is a lot to remember!

 

To cut a long story short, I won't be able to get hold of anyone at the boatyard till after Christmas, and having put water in the tank, nothing is coming through at the taps.

 

The pump is working in the sense that I can hear it and I can feel it.

 

I lifted the panel where the pump is located, and there is very little water in the glass inspection bowl that is right next to the pump.

 

I am wondering various things.

 

Is there some kind of stopcock somewhere? I have a feeling the guy said there is not, but my memory could be faulty.

 

Is there a draincock that could still be open? Again, I think he said there is not and the tank is drained by running the water through the taps.

 

I maybe did not fill the tank full enough. The hosepipe I have is not that large a diameter and the water from the tap does not come out at a huge rate. I wonder if I was too impatient and should have really made sure the tank was properly filled.

 

When I first put the pump switch on some water came out of one of the taps in a gush, but it was just a splash really.

 

I am wary of running the punp for too long with no water coming through, as I think it may need the water for lubtrication, but I am not sure.

 

Any thoughts as to what I could do to get the water coming through please?

 

Am I missing something that may be obvious to more experienced hands?

 

Thank you.

Edited December 23, 2012 by brian1042

[Dave_P]

Does the pump come on automatically when you turn on taps, or do you have turn the pump on at a switch? If its the latter it sounds like there's a stopcock. If your tank is in the bow, the stopcock should be immediately after the water tank outlet, probably near where the water pipe enters the main cabin. Mine is in the void under the front deck. I think you'll need to do some crawling about to trace the run of the pipes.

[brian1042]

Does the pump come on automatically when you turn on taps, or do you have turn the pump on at a switch? If its the latter it sounds like there's a stopcock. If your tank is in the bow, the stopcock should be immediately after the water tank outlet, probably near where the water pipe enters the main cabin. Mine is in the void under the front deck. I think you'll need to do some crawling about to trace the run of the pipes.

 

Thanks for your reply.

 

I have an electric toggle switch that has to be turned on manually to get the punp going.

 

The water filler cap is on the starboard beam. I am assuming the tank is somewhere in that location, but I do not know for sure. I searched in the area all around the pump for a stopcock, but no joy. I shall look again.

 

By the way, not sure if this matters, but hot water is via a calorifier.

Edited December 23, 2012 by brian1042

[Naughty Cal]

I would let your tank fully full first. There should be an overflow somewhere so you can't overfill it.

 

If the tank has been drained prior to you buying it there may not be enough water in there for the pump to work efficiently. It may be trying to pump air.

[brian1042]

I would let your tank fully full first. There should be an overflow somewhere so you can't overfill it.

 

If the tank has been drained prior to you buying it there may not be enough water in there for the pump to work efficiently. It may be trying to pump air.

 

Thanks, I shall give that a go.

 

I guess the water will eventually flow out of the filler once full.

[Naughty Cal]

Thanks, I shall give that a go.

 

I guess the water will eventually flow out of the filler once full.

 

Either that or there will be an overflow. Ours comes out of an overflow in the hull side first, some come out of the filler as an overflow.

[Rebotco]

Either that or there will be an overflow. Ours comes out of an overflow in the hull side first, some come out of the filler as an overflow.

 

 

From what you've said so far, your best bet is to keep hunting until you find the stop cock near the outlet of your water tank. If this was closed (highly likely) when you bought the boat, obviously the pump would have nothing to pump! The initial gush you referred to could have been just the amount of water already in the pipework after the stop cock.

 

Sorry, this wasn't meant to be a reply to Naughty Cal, just a general answer!

Edited December 23, 2012 by Rebotco

[DeanS]

Here's what you need to check:

 

1. Your water tank is quite full.

2. The stopcock after the water tank (before the input to the pump) is open. Normally situated directly on the water tank outlet.

3. Sometimes the pump can get an air bubble in it.

4. Most pumps have an inbuilt pressure switch that switches the pump on if the downline pressure is low (eg when a tap opens)

5. The toggle switch you are using might actually be an additional safety isolator switch.

6. If you have done 1 and 2, and still get nothing out the pump, you may need to try a few things involving some tools.

 

7. You could disconnect the pipe on the input to the pump. You should get a flow from the water tank, but I wouldnt do this unless you have a stop cock to stop it once you have proven there's water getting to the pump.

 

 

That's about it for starters?

[brian1042]

Here's what you need to check:

 

1. Your water tank is quite full.

2. The stopcock after the water tank (before the input to the pump) is open. Normally situated directly on the water tank outlet.

3. Sometimes the pump can get an air bubble in it.

4. Most pumps have an inbuilt pressure switch that switches the pump on if the downline pressure is low (eg when a tap opens)

5. The toggle switch you are using might actually be an additional safety isolator switch.

6. If you have done 1 and 2, and still get nothing out the pump, you may need to try a few things involving some tools.

 

7. You could disconnect the pipe on the input to the pump. You should get a flow from the water tank, but I wouldnt do this unless you have a stop cock to stop it once you have proven there's water getting to the pump.

 

 

That's about it for starters?

 

Thanks, that is all very helpful.

 

I just seem unable to find a stopcock. I shall keep looking.

[Chris Pink]

If it was me I'd probably pull the inlet off the pump, see if there's water in it. Bit damp but if you're quick and keep your thumb over it, it's the easiest way to find out if the pump's getting water.

[brian1042]

If it was me I'd probably pull the inlet off the pump, see if there's water in it. Bit damp but if you're quick and keep your thumb over it, it's the easiest way to find out if the pump's getting water.

 

Thanks. I am pretty sure there is no water going into the pump. There is no water movement through the glass inspection bowl next to the pump through which water would have to flow if all were working well.

 

From the comments received above I think I have to look at three things: a stopcock (could be an inline type that looks like a screw slot I guess); a draincock; making sure the tank really has enough water in it.

[ditchcrawler]

Thanks. I am pretty sure there is no water going into the pump. There is no water movement through the glass inspection bowl next to the pump through which water would have to flow if all were working well.

 

From the comments received above I think I have to look at three things: a stopcock (could be an inline type that looks like a screw slot I guess); a draincock; making sure the tank really has enough water in it.

The clear top should unscrew so that would give a good indication. Might pay to try and follow the pipework back to the tank from the pump.

[brian1042]

The clear top should unscrew so that would give a good indication. Might pay to try and follow the pipework back to the tank from the pump.

 

Thanks, I shall try those.

[Dave_P]

Any update? Did you find a stopcock? Did you fill your tank completely?

[Richard10002]

Is there a filter - between the tank and the pump, usually pretty close to the pump. These get clogged with lumps of limestone, (I think). Can you trace the pipe work from the pump to the tank. Hard to believe there won't be a stop tap somewhere. Mine is close to the pump, before the filter.

[IanM]

lumps of limestone,

 

 

 

 

 

 

hehehe

[brian1042]

Any update? Did you find a stopcock? Did you fill your tank completely?

 

Update

 

I was waiting till I had something to add before updating.

 

The short version is there is nothing to add.

 

The longer version is ... longer ...

 

 

I tried everything that people very kindly suggested on here. After failing to find anything that would cause a problem, I contacted someone who was recommended to me as a boat repairman and who also is a boat person. He very kindly came and looked during the holiday period and he also could find nothing wrong at that time. To be fair, he came at quite short notice and had limited time. He will be coming back and he is fairly confident of finding the problem.

 

 

What has been found so far?

 

As mentioned before, the pump is turning.

 

Dsspite filling the tank (the overflow came into play) detaching the inlet pipe to the pump results in no more than a drip and the tank sounds empty when tapped. This is odd, as there appears to be no leak from the tank. My repairman is going to take the top of the tank to check content. I think it is then a matter of checking for a blockage.

 

Thank you to all who replied, for the helpful copmments and for the useful contacts (in some cases by pm).

 

I shall let you know progress - the next phase will be on Monday 7 January.

Edited December 31, 2012 by brian1042

[bizzard]

Update

 

I was waiting till I had something to add before updating.

 

The short version is there is nothing to add.

 

The longer version is ... longer ...

 

 

I tried everything that people very kindly suggested on here. After failing to find anything that would cause a problem, I contacted someone who was recommended to me as a boat repairman and who also is a boat person. He very kindly came and looked during the holiday period and he also could find nothing wrong at that time. To be fair, he came at quite short notice and had limited time. He will be coming back and he is fairly confident of finding the problem.

 

 

What has been found so far?

 

As mentioned before, the pump is turning.

 

Dsspite filling the tank (the overflow came into play) detaching the inlet pipe to the pump results in no more than a drip and the tank sounds empty when tapped. This is odd, as there appears to be no leak from the tank. My repairman is going to take the top of the tank to check content. I think it is then a matter of checking for a blockage.

 

Thank you to all who replied, for the helpful copmments and for the useful contacts (in some cases by pm).

 

I shall let you know progress - the next phase will be on Monday 7 January.

Remove the tanks filler cap and station someone there with their ear pressed to the orifice listening. Pull pumps inlet pipe off and blow hard down it, there will be resistance which might bring on a little dizzyness but blow on regardless and if no blockage will either blow air into the tank if empty or bubbles if full, either of which will be heard by your helper, as long as you didn't pick a deaf'n.

[brian1042]

Remove the tanks filler cap and station someone there with their ear pressed to the orifice listening. Pull pumps inlet pipe off and blow hard down it, there will be resistance which might bring on a little dizzyness but blow on regardless and if no blockage will either blow air into the tank if empty or bubbles if full, either of which will be heard by your helper, as long as you didn't pick a deaf'n.

 

Thanks.

 

I am now letting the repair guy deal with it. Even if I do the tests I still do not know how to fix the problem. If there are bubbles, but no water comimg through, I have no idea what to do. The blowing could unblock something, in which case great, but if not, back to square one. If there are no no bubbles, and the tank seems to be empty, I am at a loss as to what to do.

 

Blowing through the inlet pipe is not a realistic option for me anyway. Maybe when I was young and fit. The inlet pipe is located below a floor panel, so I would be lying on the floor with my head in the bilge. All a bit too athletic for me nowadays :<(

 

Over to the repairman and I shall learn from the experience.

Edited December 31, 2012 by brian1042

[ditchcrawler]

Thanks.

 

I am now letting the repair guy deal with it. TheEven if I do the tests I still do not know how to fix the problem. If bubbles, but no water comimg through, I have no idea what to do. The blowing could unblock something, in which case great, but if not, back to square one. If no bubbles, and tank seems to be empty, I am at a loss as to what to do.

 

Blowing through the inlet pipe is not a realistic option for me anyway. Maybe when I was young and fit. The inlet pipe is located below a floor panel, so I would be lying on the floor with head in the bilge. All a bit too athletic for me nowadays :<(

 

Over to the repairman and I shall learn from the experience.

Maybe you have two tanks and have filled the wrong one.

[brian1042]

Maybe you have two tanks and have filled the wrong one.

 

Maybe. Only one tank is labelled 'Water'. The other three empying / filling holes are not for water. I would think that means just one place to fill water.

 

I have just one water pump with one inlet hose coming from one tank. What would you suggest?

 

I will keep suggestions stored for now.

Edited December 31, 2012 by brian1042

[bizzard]

Thanks.

 

I am now letting the repair guy deal with it. TheEven if I do the tests I still do not know how to fix the problem. If bubbles, but no water comimg through, I have no idea what to do. The blowing could unblock something, in which case great, but if not, back to square one. If no bubbles, and tank seems to be empty, I am at a loss as to what to do.

 

Blowing through the inlet pipe is not a realistic option for me anyway. Maybe when I was young and fit. The inlet pipe is located below a floor panel, so I would be lying on the floor with head in the bilge. All a bit too athletic for me nowadays :<(

 

Over to the repairman and I shall learn from the experience.

Done this all my life checking for blocked fuel lines ect on vehicle in the motor trade. Just push a bit of flexible hose over the inlet pipe to bring it up to a convenient height then and just blow steadily. If air blows into the tank it must be empty and if its leaked out the water it can only be in the bilge. If bubbles there's water there so if the tanks higher than the pump it should run back out of the inlet pipe. If nothing is heard at the tanks filler and the blowing resistance nearly pops your cheeks there is a serious blockage, possibly a stop cock. If bubbles are heard when blown and the water does not run back there could be a leaf in the tank for example acting as a one way valve ''common'' as people don't usually stand and watch the water filling up.

Very very simple checks which only takes a minute.

[brian1042]

Done this all my life checking for blocked fuel lines ect on vehicle in the motor trade. Just push a bit of flexible hose over the inlet pipe to bring it up to a convenient height then and just blow steadily. If air blows into the tank it must be empty and if its leaked out the water it can only be in the bilge. If bubbles there's water there so if the tanks higher than the pump it should run back out of the inlet pipe. If nothing is heard at the tanks filler and the blowing resistance nearly pops your cheeks there is a serious blockage, possibly a stop cock. If bubbles are heard when blown and the water does not run back there could be a leaf in the tank for example acting as a one way valve ''common'' as people don't usually stand and watch the water filling up.

Very very simple checks which only takes a minute.

 

Yes, appreciated, thank you.

 

This is why I am leaving it to the repairman now. If there is serious blockage I have no idea what to do. Neither I nor the repairman could find any kind of stopcock, and the investigation included taking pics under the tank.

 

I shall store your suggestions, as indicated previously.

 

Thanks again.

[Rebotco]

Maybe you have two tanks and have filled the wrong one.

 

 

Good bit of lateral thinking! It also got you a greenie, cos I clicked the wrong icon to reply!

But I'm sure you deserve it

[nb celestine]

Yes, appreciated, thank you.

 

This is why I am leaving it to the repairman now. If there is serious blockage I have no idea what to do. Neither I nor the repairman could find any kind of stopcock, and the investigation included taking pics under the tank.

 

I shall store your suggestions, as indicated previously.

 

Thanks again.

 

Hi Brian,

I started a thread a couple of years ago where I had the same problem. Very weak flow at the taps. All sorts of advice on here, like a leaf blocking the outlet of the tank. Lots of good advice, even to the point of getting a camera down the filler pipe and viewing the footage on a laptop.

 

I emptied the tank and dissconnected the pipework at the pump, connected a hosepipe and filled the tank from the pump side. So I thought nothing blocked but when I connected everything back together, still poor flow.

 

I then connected a compressor to the pipework at the pump and blew compressed air back into the tank. Bubbles everywhere when I listened at the filler cap. Connected everything again and still crap flow. Then emptied the tank and connected the compressor again. Air shooting out the filler cap. Filled the tank with water and again, poor flow.

I shoved a flexible pipe cleaner that you can get at any hardware shop, about 5mm dia, but it seemed to be getting stopped at the outlet of the tank.

 

I eventually fixed it by cutting a new outlet in the stainless steel tank and fitting an essex flange, again from advice on here. As I was about to cut into the tank after first cutting a hole in the bulkhead, there was 2 anglers who just happened to be fitters, fishing in front of the boat. Both said not to cut the flange in the tank as it will surely leak. When I filled the tank again the water flew out the taps. Having a shower, you could have heard me singing a mile away.

Then, a couple of days later, a chance remark from a lad on the towpath. He said could it have been a piece of limescale caught in the joint at the outlet of the tank. It budges just a bit so the tank can be filled from the pump side but when water tries to flow out of the outlet it might jam against the insert in the Hep20 joint. I was near Devizes at the time which is a hard water area and the kettle always had limescale in it.

 

I dont know what kind of pipework you,ve got but that is my story.

 

Good luck.