Chertsey latest

[alan_fincher]

As for me - we're far to slow for Jam 'Oling

Get that butty cabin patched up and habitable, then ask for some extra, faster, volunteer crew!

 

It would be nice to see some pairs on the Jam 'Ole recreations, (even if the butty has a top on!). The last one was all motors, I think, and it didn't really give the impression of a traffic that was largely done with pairs.....

 

If I were involved with and Nutfield and Raymond, I'd be moving heaven and earth to try and make it one event not to be missed. I don't know what the background is to them not doing at least the last one, but if a pair of boats should be on it, surely they are it ?

[Chertsey]

Get that butty cabin patched up and habitable, then ask for some extra, faster, volunteer crew!

 

It would be nice to see some pairs on the Jam 'Ole recreations, (even if the butty has a top on!). The last one was all motors, I think, and it didn't really give the impression of a traffic that was largely done with pairs.....

 

If I were involved with and Nutfield and Raymond, I'd be moving heaven and earth to try and make it one event not to be missed. I don't know what the background is to them not doing at least the last one, but if a pair of boats should be on it, surely they are it ?

 

Hmmm....

[Proper Job]

That'd be a rare old ploughing match along the Oxford - Tirfors at dawn?

 

.................

Sounds like a damn fine plan.

 

It's only a problem when you meet someone coming the other way and they don't understand why you don't move over

 

Supplementary crew could be placed at bridge holes (I marked the ones were I came to a stop last summer in my Nicholson's)

 

It would be like navigating the Bradley Arm on the BCN Challenge

[pete harrison]

It might be a run via the Thames if not - which would be interesting. I don't suspect the traffic stopped if the GU route was blocked?

 

Mike

 

This traffic did stop "if the GU route was blocked". The difference back then was that the maintenance yards were properly resourced and there was plenty of labour, meaning a stoppage was very short lived. Larger repairs were scheduled during public or industrial holidays when factories could afford to loose canal transport for a short time.

 

There are loads of period photographs demonstrating short term stoppages on the Grand Junction / Grand Union Canal.

Edited January 31, 2012 by pete harrison

[pete harrison]

If I were involved with and Nutfield and Raymond, I'd be moving heaven and earth to try and make it one event not to be missed. I don't know what the background is to them not doing at least the last one, but if a pair of boats should be on it, surely they are it ?

 

I am a steerer for Friends of Raymond and I would move heaven and earth NOT to take them on the "Jam 'ole Run".

 

In my opinion (which is not necessarily the same as the Trustees of Friends of Raymond) this event has nothing whatsoever to do with this traffic and almost always generates negative publicity towards former working narrow boats. From what I have seen most of the boating on this event is of poor quality and is in no way reflective of the high standards demonstrated by the highly respected boat families that worked on this traffic until its end. Clearly I would prefer the modern interpretation of the "Jam 'ole Run" to become a bad memory rather than continuing in any format.

[Chertsey]

I am a steerer for Friends of Raymond and I would move heaven and earth NOT to take them on the "Jam 'ole Run".

 

In my opinion (which is not necessarily the same as the Trustees of Friends of Raymond) this event has nothing whatsoever to do with this traffic and almost always generates negative publicity towards former working narrow boats. From what I have seen most of the boating on this event is of poor quality and is in no way reflective of the high standards demonstrated by the highly respected boat families that worked on this traffic until its end. Clearly I would prefer the modern interpretation of the "Jam 'ole Run" to become a bad memory rather than continuing in any format.

Wouldn't it be even better though to put together a really good crew and show how it really should be/would have been done? That is something I would travel a long way to see.

[alan_fincher]

I am a steerer for Friends of Raymond and I would move heaven and earth NOT to take them on the "Jam 'ole Run".

 

In my opinion (which is not necessarily the same as the Trustees of Friends of Raymond) this event has nothing whatsoever to do with this traffic and almost always generates negative publicity towards former working narrow boats. From what I have seen most of the boating on this event is of poor quality and is in no way reflective of the high standards demonstrated by the highly respected boat families that worked on this traffic until its end. Clearly I would prefer the modern interpretation of the "Jam 'ole Run" to become a bad memory rather than continuing in any format.

Fair enough Pete, that is your observation......

 

The last run I observed closely featured IIRC boats Towcester, Swallow, Corona, Stanton (Corrected!) and Warbler, and all the boatmanship I felt was of a very high standard that I saw. Julia Cook on Towcester is in my view one of the best handlers of these boats, and it was a rare pleasure to see her precise handling with minimal use of power, but still always in exactly the right place at the right time. I have never yet observed her anywhere other than being a total professional, (in my view,of course!).

 

I know previous years, (which I did not observe) generated some bad press, but the one I shadowed and lock wheeled for for quite a few miles demonstrated a far higher degree of professionalism than I have yet seen from and of the well know pairs owned by trusts.

 

I can only call as I see!

 

EDIT: To correct "Stamford" too "Stanton" - another appropriate boat, being one of the Blue Line boats used on that traffic....

Edited January 31, 2012 by alan_fincher

[Liam]

For Stamford read Stanton

[pete harrison]

From what I have seen most of the boating on this event is of poor quality and is in no way reflective of the high standards demonstrated by the highly respected boat families that worked on this traffic until its end.

 

I was very careful to include the word "most" in this sentence as I can think of a handful of people that take part in this event who clearly do demonstrate higher levels of boating practice and professionalism.

[alan_fincher]

For Stamford read Stanton

Indeed! - Corrected!

 

Pretty certain all bad press was from earlier years, but happy to be corrected if not.

[pete harrison]

Wouldn't it be even better though to put together a really good crew and show how it really should be/would have been done? That is something I would travel a long way to see.

 

Hopefully Ms. Cook will do this now that she has TOWCESTER and BIDEFORD.

 

Putting together a good crew is very difficult for the "Trusts" as they only have a limited membership from which the crews are drawn from, and usually all crew must be members if they wish to handle the boats. I think it fair to say that most 'proper experienced' boaters have no desire to join these "Trusts" for reasons published within these threads on numerous occasions.

[alan_fincher]

I was very careful to include the word "most" in this sentence as I can think of a handful of people that take part in this event who clearly do demonstrate higher levels of boating practice and professionalism.

And some of them have undoubtedly been handing working boats now for numbers of years easily equivalent to some of the original crews, of course.

 

It is easy to forget, too, as you look back at pictures of some of those last deliveries by Willow Wren, for example, that some of the boatmen involved had a bit of a reputation as cowboys, and as engine wreckers!

 

But I agree, the final three Blue Line crews must surely have been some of the most highly regarded, so people crashing around incompetently in their memory is probably not such a great idea!

[Chertsey]

I was going to say that I concur with Pete, that re-enactments should embody the highest and most historically accurate standards of boating (bearing in mind though that even the best historically accurate practice might well look wrong to the modern boaters from whom many of the bad reports and complaints in previous years came). But thinking about it I am a bit torn. On the other hand, why shouldn't people with old boats get together for a jolly in the name of remembering a significant event in carrying history?

 

But to sway towards Pete's position, one of the reasons I'll not be Jam 'Oling this year at least is simply because I'm not good enough. I probably (almost certainly) never will be up to the standards Pete talks about; right now I know I wouldn't even be able to keep up at any price.

 

BUT what I would like to do at some point is retrace the Gopsall - Croxley route, which finished only a few months before the Jam 'Ole, in August 1970, and on which Chertsey was one of the last boats, unloading two days before the very last one. It would be brilliant especially to do that in the company of some of the other boats and people who were involved with Ashby Canal Transport. And as they were largely not longstanding boaters, but young enthusiasts, perhaps standards need not be quite as high...

[tug-major]

It might be a run via the Thames if not - which would be interesting. I don't suspect the traffic stopped if the GU route was blocked?

 

Mike

 

 

now that b well good i am up for that

 

 

 

 

 

seh looking well good now

[pete harrison]

On the other hand, why shouldn't people with old boats get together for a jolly in the name of remembering a significant event in carrying history?

 

I am not trying to stop the modern "Jam 'ole Run", I am just saying that I do not support it and would not want to take any part in it. I have no problem with owners doing whatever they like with their boats (even converting them), after all it is them paying out their money - not me

[Chertsey]

I am not trying to stop the modern "Jam 'ole Run", I am just saying that I do not support it and would not want to take any part in it. I have no problem with owners doing whatever they like with their boats (even converting them), after all it is them paying out their money - not me

I was only pondering; taken out of context it looks a bit confrontational. Part of me thinks it is important to do things 'properly' but the woolly liberal always wins out in the end.

 

My main reason for not participating is that I know I wouldn't stand the pace

[fanshaft]

Firstly - Chertsey is looking great - well done!

 

On subject Jam 'Ole - I 'paired' (as it were) with Julia Cook on one run, and can attest to the high standard of her boating, all done with no fuss, and little unnecessary communication. I enjoyed it very much. I thought the general standard of boating was good, from what I could see.

 

I can say that in the absence of Tom Stewart (who has other interests these days) Tim Coghlan has agreed to organise this year's event, as far as it needs organising.

 

I have no problem at all with the event celebrating the last regular long distance contract on the GU main line (though I do sympathise also with Pete's comments) but it is a pity that the Croxley traffic which, as has been said, finished only just before the Jam 'Ole, is often overlooked even though in terms of tonnage it was far more important. Also the lime juice, and Thurmaston-Syston traffics did keep narrow boat cargo carrying going over a number of years, as did the post 1970 longer distance coal traffics of Ashby Canal Transport Ltd. As Nick Hill tells us the object of carrying coal for re-sale was to keep traffic on the Ashby Canal, and to try and keep long distance narrow boat carrying alive. Today, with some exceptions, most of the coal retail carrying is fairly short haul - though still welcome. On the subject of UK long distance canal carrying (involving river navigations admittedly) Besthorpe to Whitwood must, at 87 miles, be the longest currently?

 

Regards

 

David L

Swallow

[ditchcrawler]

Fair enough Pete, that is your observation......

 

The last run I observed closely featured IIRC boats Towcester, Swallow, Corona, Stanton (Corrected!) and Warbler, and all the boatmanship I felt was of a very high standard that I saw. Julia Cook on Towcester is in my view one of the best handlers of these boats, and it was a rare pleasure to see her precise handling with minimal use of power, but still always in exactly the right place at the right time. I have never yet observed her anywhere other than being a total professional, (in my view,of course!).

 

I know previous years, (which I did not observe) generated some bad press, but the one I shadowed and lock wheeled for for quite a few miles demonstrated a far higher degree of professionalism than I have yet seen from and of the well know pairs owned by trusts.

 

I can only call as I see!

 

EDIT: To correct "Stamford" too "Stanton" - another appropriate boat, being one of the Blue Line boats used on that traffic....

I watched her wind a fully loaded boat at Braunston. There must be a very close relationship between good boat handling and ballet.

[Guest]

I watched her wind a fully loaded boat at Braunston. There must be a very close relationship between good boat handling and ballet.

 

Nice quote - there is I agree - unfortunately my first attempt at winding there was more like a clog dance as I completely messed it up and got wedged across the cut right out side Midland Chandlers....

 

Unusually for that spot not a gongoozler in sight....

[mykaskin]

I am not trying to stop the modern "Jam 'ole Run", I am just saying that I do not support it and would not want to take any part in it.

 

Well, that's your right - but I must say I'm a little disappointed in your attitude.

 

If it's the quality of boating you object too - remember we are now nearly all enthusiasts with only a couple of professional boaters in the last couple of times.

 

If it's the "complaints" that it seems to have caused in previous years I refer you to the lack of complains in the last two which didn't have any long distance professional boaters in them. Read into that as you want.

 

If it's the reason - perhaps a reminder of why the canals were built, and how they were used until very recently is a good thing.

 

If it's the sentiment - don't try and make it out to be trying to bigger than it is. The first was just thought to be a "good idea", a bit of fun, and to remember the boatmen past by surviving boatmen who used to do the job themselves.

 

If it's the apparent lack of sentiment now - where else are boatmen of old remembered (especially in a way that it gives precipitants an idea of what they went through)

 

If it's the lack of credibility of the event (remember the last jam 'ole was all motor boats BTW), then perhaps you'd like to come up with a better idea. It's both convenient, and covers much of the road other traffics did.

 

There are people willing to organise it, and people willing to join in.

 

It's hard work, there are long days, and certainly not a place for beginners, but for people to get some idea of what the next level of professional boating might look like, and what the boatmen coped with week in, week out, through all weathers, dark, cold, rain, snow, ice you can't get a better idea.

 

It's not a race, it's a group participation event where everyone helps each other out, so slower boats will be given more crew if someone is mob handed, or as much help as possible.

 

...plus it's great fun!

 

Some boats require crew, and so even if you don't think you could do it with your own boat, you could join in with someone else.

 

Cheers,

 

Mike

Edited February 1, 2012 by mykaskin

[Tiggers]

Well, that's your right - but I must say I'm a little disappointed in your attitude.

 

If it's the quality of boating you object too - remember we are now nearly all enthusiasts with only a couple of professional boaters in the last couple of times.

 

If it's the "complaints" that it seems to have caused in previous years I refer you to the lack of complains in the last two which didn't have any long distance professional boaters in them. Read into that as you want.

 

If it's the reason - perhaps a reminder of why the canals were built, and how they were used until very recently is a good thing.

 

If it's the sentiment - don't try and make it out to be trying to bigger than it is. The first was just thought to be a "good idea", a bit of fun, and to remember the boatmen past by surviving boatmen who used to do the job themselves.

 

If it's the apparent lack of sentiment now - where else are boatmen of old remembered (especially in a way that it gives precipitants an idea of what they went through)

 

If it's the lack of credibility of the event (remember the last jam 'ole was all motor boats BTW), then perhaps you'd like to come up with a better idea. It's both convenient, and covers much of the road other traffics did.

 

There are people willing to organise it, and people willing to join in.

 

It's hard work, there are long days, and certainly not a place for beginners, but for people to get some idea of what the next level of professional boating might look like, and what the boatmen coped with week in, week out, through all weathers, dark, cold, rain, snow, ice you can't get a better idea.

 

It's not a race, it's a group participation event where everyone helps each other out, so slower boats will be given more crew if someone is mob handed, or as much help as possible.

 

...plus it's great fun!

 

Some boats require crew, and so even if you don't think you could do it with your own boat, you could join in with someone else.

 

Cheers,

 

Mike

 

Well said Mike.

 

I think I would rather go on the Jam Ole run than Braunston this year. Saying that, I don't think I would help the view of incompetent boaters... :S

 

Edited to add that Chertsey is looking wonderful, passed her a couple of weeks back, unfortunately in the dark, but it didnt stop me from getting all doughy eyed

Edited February 2, 2012 by Tiggers

[pete harrison]

Well, that's your right - but I must say I'm a little disappointed in your attitude.

 

I do not understand why when I have stated that I am not trying to stop this event, and I have also stated on several occasions that in my opinion owners should do what they like with their 'historic' boats.

 

I do of course expect you to be vigorous in your support of this 're-enactment' as you are a participant.

[Guest]

 

Some boats require crew, and so even if you don't think you could do it with your own boat, you could join in with someone else.

 

Cheers,

 

Mike

 

Which is what prompted me to ask this...

 

http://www.canalworld.net/forums/index.php?showtopic=44371&view=findpost&p=819792

 

Happy to crew...

[soldthehouse]

I was only pondering; taken out of context it looks a bit confrontational. Part of me thinks it is important to do things 'properly' but the woolly liberal always wins out in the end.

 

My main reason for not participating is that I know I wouldn't stand the pace

"Its not the winning but the taking part" and the possibility that "others" may benefit from seeing such a beautiful boat.

[Chertsey]

"Its not the winning but the taking part" and the possibility that "others" may benefit from seeing such a beautiful boat.

But taking part does require the ability to keep up with the other participants!