Barby Moorings and the Trade Description Act!!!!??

[sebrof]

 

Sebrof - whilst I understand your defence of the laws and principles of limited companies, this (and the other threads on this forum) has nothing to do with someone acting or running their business lawfully or ethically- this is all about dishonesty and fraud which, I believe, cannot be justified under any circumstances. Where individuals deliberately hide behind the law and continue to profit by doing so they should not be protected.

 

I don't disagree with you. In my view, if a company goes bust, then the directors should be barred from holding directorships and from buying the assets of the bankrupt company unless and until they can demonstrate that they acted properly.

 

It's the failure to investigate and punish directors who act improperly that is the problem, and which causes so much (justified) anger.

 

We have to accept, however, that companies will go bust from time to time. And we should not penalise those who in many cases did their best and will have lost a lot of money.

[journeyperson]

Debt-factoring companies work by buying invoiced debt. If they were chasing you early, it was because the builder had invoiced early. There is no point in a factor wasting his time on debts that aren't due. And if they hadn't been invoiced, the factor wouldn't know what to collect.

 

Blame the right party!

 

I knew the contractor was invoicing early and told them, I also told them who the client was but they never took any notice. If you keep getting red notices from someone you blame them for not keeping on top of their client and not knowing their client's client. I could have binned all the notices for all the threat they were to us; it was in their own interests to identify the right parties.

[sebrof]

I knew the contractor was invoicing early and told them, I also told them who the client was but they never took any notice. If you keep getting red notices from someone you blame them for not keeping on top of their client and not knowing their client's client. I could have binned all the notices for all the threat they were to us; it was in their own interests to identify the right parties.

 

You have confirmed what I said. It was the contractor to blame. And the problem is that the factor would have heard all your "excuses" before - except that this time they were justified.

 

But I admit, they do seem to have been a bit dim.

[Slim]

I'm another individual who has fallen foul of Barby Moorings.

 

I first came across them in August 2010 at IWA Festival at Beale Park. I visited the site in September 2010 when I decided to wait before committing myself. At the time I was told it would be up and running by January 2011. I visited them again in Early 2011 when I was told that work had been delayed by the bad winter. In April I visited once more and was told that excavation was complete, that some pontoons were going in within a couple of weeks with the rest to follow as soon as it was filled with water. At the time I was assured that my allocated mooring would be available for occupancy from late July. I was also told that the services (centrally metered electricity, inclusive wired Internet, inclusive wired Freeview TV, inclusive self service pump out and individual water point would all be available (note, the term free was was much used but I prefer the word inclusive!) I was told that the proposed facilities building housing things such as the shower/laundry facilities would be completed "by the end of the year". As my existing moorings agreement was approaching renewal I decided to reserve a berth from mid/late September 2011 and paid my £400 non returnable deposit.

 

Over the following months I monitored progress via their website and made a couple of phone calls when I was given nothing but assurances. I also tried to speak to them at Crick but their stand was unmanned.

In the third week of August I dropped in on my way up the North Oxford during a two month cruise and was shocked to see how little progress had been made. The bankside staging was in place but no pontoons, no buildings (or foundations), part completed services 'posts', hardcore (type1) paths/roadway/parking areas and a bridge still supported by formwork. Once again I was told that everything was a matter of weeks away from completion I was assured that when I came in in mid September a serviced pontoon berth would be available. To be fair I was told it might not be my allocated one. I specifically asked about the pumpout and was told it was going to be connected up the following Tuesday.

 

During my trip my built in generator caught fire and my 2000watt inverter failed (separate incidents) This left me with just a small inverter and restricted 230v. I then made an absolutely stupid mistake whilst at Napton which resulted in partly flooding the boat with several hundred gallons of best canal water. It also knocked out my phone, laptop and small inverter. At this stage all I wanted to do was dry the boat out, pack up and go home. As a result I decided to head for Barby for a berth and electricity.

 

On arriving at Barby (after phoning to confirm) I was directed to a stern on mooring in the middle of about ten boats. Like someone else in this topic I was tackled for the balance of a quarters moorings within minutes. At the time I was unsure whether to stay but I had little option. I did suggest to Tony McMaster that in view of the lack of facilities a discount was appropriate. Sufficient to say he could not be swayed. He claimed that much of the work would be completed within weeks. He also proudly told me that he was not charging for electricity. He didn't tell me it was only on from 9 am to 9 pm. After complaining about the stern on mooring he agreed to move me to a bankside mooring on a temporary basis (little did I know how temporary) I was moved the following day and after spending 48 hours sorting things out I went home.

 

The following Saturday I returned to Barby to spend a couple of days sorting things out properly. On the Monday morning two of Tony's men (very nice fellows) came up to me and told me they were going to move me alongside another boat (it may have been Cape Clear). When asked why they simply said Tony had told them to move me. I immediately went to Tony to find out what was happening. His reply was that his men were mistaken (yer!!) and that I was being moved to the engineering area so that a couple of boats coming in could have their allocated bankside moorings. I was told that there would be staging so that I could get on and off my boat easily. He also mentioned that it would make it easier for me to remove my generator (about 80-85 kilos). I was put into a space on a sloping bank where I'm aground with a full 1 metre between me and the shore. The only way on and off the boat is via a gangplank, in fact a length of pontoon, about 800mm wide perched on top of forward cockpit gunwale. It's already played havoc with the paintwork and non slip patches.

 

I've since been back to the boat once following heavy winds when I put out another two mooring lines (didn't mention it's just hanging on mooring pins and that any Barby Moorings supplied ones are just reinforcing rod) Going back again at the weekend but don't expect to find much has changed.

 

Finally can anyone suggest any alternative moorings in the area, secure, with electricity and a pumpout facility nearby.

 

 

 

Frank

[Bob18]

Sorry to hear your tale of woe and hope you manage to get control of the situation soon.

 

How nearby is nearby?

Wigrams Turn had a few spaces a couple of weeks ago, and is up and running, also has an active on-site engineer/fitter who may be able to help with your problems. Obviously that's down near Napton which you may consider to be a bit too far.

Nearer? Have you tried Braunston, they may have some service moorings available.

The nearest, Blue Haven/Hillmorton Wharf hasn't any serviced moorings left.

[grey tug]

Sorry to hear about yet another awful experience - will Mr Mcmaster never realise how much harm he is doing to his moorers, and to his own reputation and standing? It is a desperate situation for those obliged to stay in what seems to be a really grotty, muddy hole with the prospect of having to cope with a long, cold nasty winter ahead. No or little electricity, sanitary facilities, water, not even a proper place to tie up to!!

 

Re alternative moorings, apart from those already suggested, how about Brinklow or Calcutt, or a bit further afield - Gayton.

 

Do hope you manage to get sorted out soon.

Edited October 18, 2011 by grey tug

[Guest]

 

Finally can anyone suggest any alternative moorings in the area, secure, with electricity and a pumpout facility nearby.

 

Frank

 

You are only a short distance from Braunston Marina.

 

Last time I looked at their web site they had spaces. Likely to be a bit pricier though given the location.

[Bob18]

I've just opened an email from the ASA.

Following my complaint, and their investigation they have instructed the ads for Barby Moorings (to give the place its "correct" name) to be reworded to reflect the current state of the services offered, with immediate effect. Thus ads being placed should now reflect that a number of the promised services promised in older ads (water, electricity, TV, WiFi, wharfage) are not functioning as described.

We wait and see if this instruction is complied with, so eyes and ears open boys and girls, both on the press and the water...

 

Now if in a couple off months time the ads are still appearing, and the services missing the ASA will be "somewhat disappointed" to put it mildly (I've not had a chance to see what sanctions they can impose).

 

Even this first ruling may help those who are trying to get money back as money gained as a result of miss-selling or miss-advertising is "quite a serious matter" in the eyes of the courts.

 

 

I should add that the ruling will be published on the 26th of October on the ASA's website.

Edited October 18, 2011 by Bob18

[Geoff Taylor]

Hi,We are Moored at Calcutt,beautiful peaceful Marina,I think they have spaces,very competitive pricing etc,you will certainly not get messed about here!!

Hope this helps,

Regards

Geoff

[ditchcrawler]

I've just opened an email from the ASA.

Following my complaint, and their investigation they have instructed the ads for Barby Moorings (to give the place its "correct" name) to be reworded to reflect the current state of the services offered, with immediate effect. Thus ads being placed should now reflect that a number of the promised services promised in older ads (water, electricity, TV, WiFi, wharfage) are not functioning as described.

We wait and see if this instruction is complied with, so eyes and ears open boys and girls, both on the press and the water...

 

Now if in a couple off months time the ads are still appearing, and the services missing the ASA will be "somewhat disappointed" to put it mildly (I've not had a chance to see what sanctions they can impose).

 

Even this first ruling may help those who are trying to get money back as money gained as a result of miss-selling or miss-advertising is "quite a serious matter" in the eyes of the courts.

 

 

I should add that the ruling will be published on the 26th of October on the ASA's website.

Trouble is, you can only get money back if they have any to give you.Whatever the law says

[DaveG]

I've just opened an email from the ASA.

Following my complaint, and their investigation they have instructed the ads for Barby Moorings (to give the place its "correct" name) to be reworded to reflect the current state of the services offered, with immediate effect. Thus ads being placed should now reflect that a number of the promised services promised in older ads (water, electricity, TV, WiFi, wharfage) are not functioning as described.

Unfortunately this is now like an internet "worm" so the chances of getting these claims out of circulation is minimal. There is one "blog", for instance, the writers of which claim to be "committed Christians" which is carrying a testimonial and an advertising link for Barby, written just 6 days ago, as follows:

 

"One of the delights of living on a boat is that you can move from one area to another with very little effort. After getting iced in last winter at Thrupp (not that the residents of Thrupp aren’t delightful ) we thought we would moor up in a marina this year. After examining some possibilities we chose Barby Moorings near Rugby. This is a a new marina development on the Oxford canal 2 miles from Hillmorton locks and just 5 miles from Braunston Junction. The owners have an innovative approach with plans for a Solar Farm and a Wind Turbine to supply the site’s electricity and a whole range of other amenities are to be added in the coming months. There are some bankside moorings with little gardens and others on prefabricated pontoons, each mooring is fully serviced with electrical power, water, wired internet and digital ready TV aerial socket. What luxury!"

 

I accept that my next statement will upset some people, but why would someone professing to be a "committed Christian" write a testimonial like this which is clearly yet another fabrication?? What luxury ??? For goodness sake!! Furthermore, the writer of this nonsense claims to have visited Barby!! If so, why would they write what is clearly an advertising puff for this muddy puddle?

 

Truly decent and trusting people have been lied to and have lost money to this company. To read this rubbish simply rubs salt further into the wound. My partner, who genuinely is a "committed Christian", could not believe the utter tosh written in this blog. Disgraceful!

Edited October 19, 2011 by DaveG

[Wiggins]

I read that blog entry via a link somewhere - they seem, like some others here, to have believed the advertising. And not to have seen the adverse comments.

 

A couple of people have made comments to the entry to which they have responded.

 

 

I do not see what their religion has to do with this.

[DaveG]

I read that blog entry via a link somewhere - they seem, like some others here, to have believed the advertising. And not to have seen the adverse comments.

 

A couple of people have made comments to the entry to which they have responded.

 

 

I do not see what their religion has to do with this.

Please read the full blog - the narrative combined with the date and time stamps on their "blog" indicate they visited the marina before they wrote the "what luxury!" entry. They also shrug off (and in some cases have deleted) the adverse comments.

 

Maybe I have high expectations, but one would not expect a "committed Christian" (their words) to publish and link to something so blatantly untrue as the Barby facilities.

Edited October 19, 2011 by DaveG

[adam1uk]

Please read the full blog - the narrative combined with the date and time stamps on their "blog" indicate they visited the marina before they wrote the "what luxury!" entry. They also shrug off (and in some cases have deleted) the adverse comments.

 

Maybe I have high expectations, but one would not expect a "committed Christian" (their words) to publish and link to something so blatantly untrue as the Barby facilities.

 

They have also, according to this thread, booked a BW winter mooring. So they've clearly had second thoughts, even if the blog is a bit behind.

[grey tug]

They have also, according to this thread, booked a BW winter mooring. So they've clearly had second thoughts, even if the blog is a bit behind.

 

 

Glad to see that they have saved themselves from an unpleasant and difficult experience, but it would have been better if they could also update their 'praises' for Barby Moorings, as other unsuspecting reader/seeker of moorings could easily be misled. I wonder what has happened to all the other potential moorers, as I read earlier, in this thread I think, that there was an 85% uptake on the capacity!

[Athy]

I like the line "The owners have an innovative approach".

Aye, advertise the services, pocket the money, don't provide the services. "Innovative" is perhaps too polite an adjective.

[Bob18]

One blog doth not make the truth, let thy eyes perceive the truth.

 

 

It is perfectly true that if an organisation owes you money but doesn't have any you won't get your money back.

BUT if you don't ask for your money back you are unlikely to get it back even if they have it.

Start with a phone call, requesting your money back (or whatever portion of it you feel to be fair), then move on to a letter restating your case - brief and factual is better than verbose and emotional. Then move up with the threat (promise is a better word) of legal action, and finally reach for the small claims court (or its more recent, low cost equivalent).

Yes it does take time, yes it may not be paid, but you are far more likely to get paid than if you just sit around moaning.

Take legal steps (even that first phone call is a legal step) to get your money back.

 

Two other things: first is to keep records of all your contacts with that organisation, broken promises, and so on as these can be very useful if it comes to court; the second is to collect evidence of ongoing wrong.illegal activities, best post the date of your first grievance - this shows the court that the organisation is in some way acting in an improper manner (In the case of Barby Moorings/Marina the fact that the ASA has instructed them to stop using a misleading ad is a "vote in your favour", as you would have bought the services base, in part, on the ad.

[i love my narrowboat]

I am happy to say my cheque finally cleared, my friend was told she would get a cheque this week for her refund!! watch this space

 

I'm another individual who has fallen foul of Barby Moorings.

 

I first came across them in August 2010 at IWA Festival at Beale Park. I visited the site in September 2010 when I decided to wait before committing myself. At the time I was told it would be up and running by January 2011. I visited them again in Early 2011 when I was told that work had been delayed by the bad winter. In April I visited once more and was told that excavation was complete, that some pontoons were going in within a couple of weeks with the rest to follow as soon as it was filled with water. At the time I was assured that my allocated mooring would be available for occupancy from late July. I was also told that the services (centrally metered electricity, inclusive wired Internet, inclusive wired Freeview TV, inclusive self service pump out and individual water point would all be available (note, the term free was was much used but I prefer the word inclusive!) I was told that the proposed facilities building housing things such as the shower/laundry facilities would be completed "by the end of the year". As my existing moorings agreement was approaching renewal I decided to reserve a berth from mid/late September 2011 and paid my £400 non returnable deposit.

 

Over the following months I monitored progress via their website and made a couple of phone calls when I was given nothing but assurances. I also tried to speak to them at Crick but their stand was unmanned.

In the third week of August I dropped in on my way up the North Oxford during a two month cruise and was shocked to see how little progress had been made. The bankside staging was in place but no pontoons, no buildings (or foundations), part completed services 'posts', hardcore (type1) paths/roadway/parking areas and a bridge still supported by formwork. Once again I was told that everything was a matter of weeks away from completion I was assured that when I came in in mid September a serviced pontoon berth would be available. To be fair I was told it might not be my allocated one. I specifically asked about the pumpout and was told it was going to be connected up the following Tuesday.

 

During my trip my built in generator caught fire and my 2000watt inverter failed (separate incidents) This left me with just a small inverter and restricted 230v. I then made an absolutely stupid mistake whilst at Napton which resulted in partly flooding the boat with several hundred gallons of best canal water. It also knocked out my phone, laptop and small inverter. At this stage all I wanted to do was dry the boat out, pack up and go home. As a result I decided to head for Barby for a berth and electricity.

 

On arriving at Barby (after phoning to confirm) I was directed to a stern on mooring in the middle of about ten boats. Like someone else in this topic I was tackled for the balance of a quarters moorings within minutes. At the time I was unsure whether to stay but I had little option. I did suggest to Tony McMaster that in view of the lack of facilities a discount was appropriate. Sufficient to say he could not be swayed. He claimed that much of the work would be completed within weeks. He also proudly told me that he was not charging for electricity. He didn't tell me it was only on from 9 am to 9 pm. After complaining about the stern on mooring he agreed to move me to a bankside mooring on a temporary basis (little did I know how temporary) I was moved the following day and after spending 48 hours sorting things out I went home.

 

The following Saturday I returned to Barby to spend a couple of days sorting things out properly. On the Monday morning two of Tony's men (very nice fellows) came up to me and told me they were going to move me alongside another boat (it may have been Cape Clear). When asked why they simply said Tony had told them to move me. I immediately went to Tony to find out what was happening. His reply was that his men were mistaken (yer!!) and that I was being moved to the engineering area so that a couple of boats coming in could have their allocated bankside moorings. I was told that there would be staging so that I could get on and off my boat easily. He also mentioned that it would make it easier for me to remove my generator (about 80-85 kilos). I was put into a space on a sloping bank where I'm aground with a full 1 metre between me and the shore. The only way on and off the boat is via a gangplank, in fact a length of pontoon, about 800mm wide perched on top of forward cockpit gunwale. It's already played havoc with the paintwork and non slip patches.

 

I've since been back to the boat once following heavy winds when I put out another two mooring lines (didn't mention it's just hanging on mooring pins and that any Barby Moorings supplied ones are just reinforcing rod) Going back again at the weekend but don't expect to find much has changed.

 

Finally can anyone suggest any alternative moorings in the area, secure, with electricity and a pumpout facility nearby.

 

 

 

Frank

 

 

hi Frank I boat is Cape Clear, however I left end of August having only been there for 3 days, I have managed to get all my mooring fees back, albeit having the cheque bounce and go through the second time..We are at Billing and love it. My friend is at Wigrams, and she likes it there, (she was going to Barby) but is now trying to get her deposit back...good luck in trying to find somewhere..Sue

 

Yes, I'm sure...just as they were "arriving next week" in April, June and August!! Last time I was there in September Mr McMasters teenaged son was trying to make them up on the bank.

 

 

When we were having a look round and their son was there helping, he and Penny who I assume is his mother were having a huge row and he was f###ing and blinding at her.. god help us if that is private education standard,it was awful and they didn't seem bothered that we were nearby listening to it all..

[carlt]

I like the line "The owners have an innovative approach".

Aye, advertise the services, pocket the money, don't provide the services. "Innovative" is perhaps too polite an adjective.

Presumably, though, if you had had a positive experience, with them, you'd be saying...

 

Members have made their points ad infinitum, and sometimes ad nauseam, but will not let this matter lie and move on to something else.

Then again, I have made my point too, which is that my experience of Harral's Barby Moorings was a good and positive one, so now I'll shut up and move on.

[DaveG]

The owners have an innovative approach with plans for a Solar Farm and a Wind Turbine to supply the site’s electricity

 

This is now being liberally bandied about by McMaster to hide the fact they cannot get connected to the National Grid. However, I have received the following from Catherine Camp, the clerk to the council:

 

There is no planning permission to construct a wind and solar electricity generating plant. This would require planning consent, and I have spoken to Daventry District Planning Department who say that there has been no pre-planning discussions about it either.

 

The Marina was granted planning permission on Appeal (ref APP/Y2810/A/09/2100581) on 11th September 2009. The application was for an 108 berth non-residential marina and no one can live on a boat at the marina for more than 72 hrs in any one week. I attach the appeal document for your information see point 14.

 

Happy Days

Edited October 19, 2011 by DaveG

[Athy]

Oooh, you cheeky monkey, Mr. T!

I have never visited Barby Moorings. I cruised past them last year, and did indeed move on.

Well done that man for finally getting your money back. I wonder where the Barby people found it? Maybe they have accepted a deposit from another rube and used that to reimburse you, who knows?

Edited October 19, 2011 by Athy

[DaveG]

Maybe they have accepted a deposit from another rube and used that to reimburse you, who knows?

 

It would seem that's exactly what has happened.

[i love my narrowboat]

Can anyone advise -

Has there been any work done in last week, or is it just as it was with no pontoons, facilities etc

 

Many thanks

 

one of my friends is still there and no change

[ditchcrawler]

one of my friends is still there and no change

I read that as NO CHARGE first time round.

Glad you got your money back

[Wiltshire Moonraker]

Glad to see that they have saved themselves from an unpleasant and difficult experience, but it would have been better if they could also update their 'praises' for Barby Moorings, as other unsuspecting reader/seeker of moorings could easily be misled. I wonder what has happened to all the other potential moorers, as I read earlier, in this thread I think, that there was an 85% uptake on the capacity!

 

I only wish that were true, I too was reeled in by the spiel and I paid a deposit back in September which I seem set to lose, if only I seen this thread before then.

 

My blog has now been edited to remove any factual inaccuracies (strikethrough so you can see what was written) you will note that it always has referred to plans for more facilities and was never intended as any kind of testimonial, how could it be?

 

It would have been helpful if all the people who contacted me via my blog identified themselves and their connection with the problems as it is sometimes difficult to sort out people who know the facts from those passing unsubstantiated comments.

 

As soon as I receive a response from Mr McMasters I will update it further and I am not going to respond to DaveG's personal comments as he is clearly very angry at the moment.

Edited October 19, 2011 by Wiltshire Moonraker