Lock etiquette on the Lee and the Stort

[Ernie]

Many times on the Lee and the Stort over the last couple of weeks we arrive at a lock to find the gates open.

 

This morning we met up with a group on a hire boat at one of the locks. They asked us if we leave lock gates open when we leave a lock, we replied that we don’t. They told us that their hire boat company told them that they should leave the gates open behind them. We are now not sure what the lock etiquette is on the Lee and the Stort but we are in the habit of closing the gates behind us and will continue to do so – also, it’s good exercise!!!

One of the locks we passed through today actually had a sign up requesting that the lock be left with all gates closed. Is the hire boat company giving out bad advise ???

 

I remember when on the Wey a few years back, it was standard practice to leave the gates open behind you.

[alan_fincher]

Many times on the Lee and the Stort over the last couple of weeks we arrive at a lock to find the gates open.

 

This morning we met up with a group on a hire boat at one of the locks. They asked us if we leave lock gates open when we leave a lock, we replied that we don’t. They told us that their hire boat company told them that they should leave the gates open behind them. We are now not sure what the lock etiquette is on the Lee and the Stort but we are in the habit of closing the gates behind us and will continue to do so – also, it’s good exercise!!!

One of the locks we passed through today actually had a sign up requesting that the lock be left with all gates closed. Is the hire boat company giving out bad advise ???

 

I remember when on the Wey a few years back, it was standard practice to leave the gates open behind you.

We were told by several boaters on the Lee and Stort that gates should be left open - supported by the fact that we found many in that state.

 

I checked this with two different sets of BW length-men, both of whom said, "yes - leave them open".

 

However Lady Muck will tell you that her pound can suffer low levels, if both sets of gates are not closed at the electric lock at it's lower end. (Stonebridge, possibly ?).

 

We generally left open at manual locks, and tried to close up at the electric ones, but found the gates of the electric ones often re-open by a foot or so as soon as you take your finger off the button.

 

Another conundrum, that I've mentioned before.

 

Many of the locks on the Regents are explicitly marked that top gates must always be left shut. OK to leave bottom ones open, it would appear, (they blow open at quite a number of them anyway, even if you do shut them!).

[FredDrift]

Frequently walking length of the Stort as I do, I have rarely seen both sets of gates closed on any of the locks. Parndon lock was recently iirc wearing a label requesting that the top gates are left closed as the bottom pair are leaking quite badly.

 

Is it not the accepted (if unwritten) rule on river navigations that the departure end of the lock is left open unless specifically requested otherwise.

 

We passed Ten Bob Note last Sunday - a veritable armada of noisily excited youngsters afloat in/on canoes and rafts alongside as we (Lady and Fido Nomad and I) went by on Sunday afternoon constitutional.

 

HN

[Ernie]

We passed Ten Bob Note last Sunday - a veritable armada of noisily excited youngsters afloat in/on canoes and rafts alongside as we (Lady and Fido Nomad and I) went by on Sunday afternoon constitutional.

 

HN

Hi HN,

You should have knocked on the door and said hello.

 

We had great entertainment watching the kids at play over the weekend.

 

A couple of photos taken on Sunday can be found here:

 

http://www.erniesplace.com/TBN/_BoatingDia...17_Cheshunt.php

Edited May 19, 2010 by Ernie

[rallyfan]

I have run a canal business on the Lea for the last 35 years. It was always traditional to leave gates open on leaving a lock with the slackers (paddles) down. However, 35 years ago there were very few visiting boats on the L&S, but with the increase in boats from the rest of the system, this tradition has largely disappeared. Along with this, there are very few of the "old timers" on BW now and the newer staff will tell you to close gates.

 

To sum up, leave them open or, alternatively, close them, both are correct

[Phoenix_V]

Those of us who boat on the lee and Stort always leave them open including the workboats and patrol boat, the gates are heavy and you will not be welcome if you shut them, we abide by local custom when in the midlands so it would be appreciated if visitors to our area reciprocated

[Lady Muck]

I have run a canal business on the Lea for the last 35 years. It was always traditional to leave gates open on leaving a lock with the slackers (paddles) down. However, 35 years ago there were very few visiting boats on the L&S, but with the increase in boats from the rest of the system, this tradition has largely disappeared. Along with this, there are very few of the "old timers" on BW now and the newer staff will tell you to close gates.

 

To sum up, leave them open or, alternatively, close them, both are correct

 

We used to close them because we thought it was the 'done thing' now we know different, however three years ago, our boat looked like this when the gates on the electric side were left open at Stonebridge....

 

 

Now fixed. it wasn't fun that summer, we couldn't boat (or keep any of the cupboards or drawers closed on one side of the boat) and if anyone came through the lock in the evening or late at night (!)I'd have to dash out there to make sure they shut it.

 

So, if theres a notice on the lock asking you to close up, please heed it. The boaters moored in the pound above might thank you for it.

Edited May 19, 2010 by Lady Muck

[WJM]

Why close them on a river? Water loss is not an issue. By closing them you only make work for yourself and others! - Yes, do the maths, closing up makes more work. If you want exercise then do it in a way that does not inconvenience others - try closing up and re-opening!

[alan_fincher]

Along with this, there are very few of the "old timers" on BW now and the newer staff will tell you to close gates.

I couldn't class either of the BW blokes who told us to leave them open as being "old timers", as neither was particularly old.

 

If the tradition has changed to "close them", why did so many boaters tell us "you don't close gates on here" ?

[Keeping Up]

...

Is it not the accepted (if unwritten) rule on river navigations that the departure end of the lock is left open unless specifically requested otherwise.

...

That's how I've always understood it too.

[NB Willawaw]

We moored Willawaw on the Stort for a while when she was new and we still have a house locally.

 

It is a lovely river navigation, but don't tell anybody.

 

As has been said before, the gates are usually left open when you depart (paddles down), unless specifically requested due to leaking gates etc.

 

You only make work for yourself by closing them behind you and and local boats finding a level lock with the gates closed will curse you under their breath.

 

I didn't realise that the BW workboat "Roydon" had sunk, Ernie (reference to Ernie's pics) - looks like it was taken where the Lee and Stort join.

[Ernie]

I didn't realise that the BW workboat "Roydon" had sunk, Ernie (reference to Ernie's pics) - looks like it was taken where the Lee and Stort join.

Hi Mark,

 

Yes, the photo was taken at the junction of the Lee and the Stort.

 

 

Why close them on a river? Water loss is not an issue. By closing them you only make work for yourself and others! - Yes, do the maths, closing up makes more work. If you want exercise then do it in a way that does not inconvenience others - try closing up and re-opening!

(do the maths) Oh dear, looks like I have to be a mathematician to go boating now!!!!

 

Agreed, leaving the gates open gives any boat arriving at the lock from the open direction less work to do but then, any boater arriving from the other direction will have more work to do…..

 

Also, if water loss is not an issue, why do some of the locks on both Lee and Stort have signs up stating that water loss can be a problem and that all gates should be left closed ??

[magpie patrick]

Hi Mark,

 

Yes, the photo was taken at the junction of the Lee and the Stort.

 

 

 

(do the maths) Oh dear, looks like I have to be a mathematician to go boating now!!!!

 

Agreed, leaving the gates open gives any boat arriving at the lock from the open direction less work to do but then, any boater arriving from the other direction will have more work to do…..

 

Also, if water loss is not an issue, why do some of the locks on both Lee and Stort have signs up stating that water loss can be a problem and that all gates should be left closed ??

 

 

Water loss is not a problem on most rivers, however sections of the lee and stort are effectively canals with limited water supply

 

as for the Math ("do the Math" is an american saying, not a brit one)

 

lock agin you, close gate (1) open paddles (2) open gates (3) Close gates (4) open paddles (5) open gates (6) close paddles (7) off ye go

 

Lock for you close gates (1) open paddles (2) open gates (3) close paddles (4)

 

so 7 one way or 4 the other average 5.5

 

gates closed

 

lock agin you open paddles (1) open gates (2) Close gates (3) open paddles (4) open gates (5) close paddles (6) Close gates (7) off ye go having stopped for crew 8?

 

Lock for you close gates (1) open paddles (2) open gates (3) close paddles (4) Close gates (5) pick up crew (as you can't in the lock?) 6?

 

so 7 one way and 5 the other average 6

 

it is no more work operating a lock against you with the gates open, as you simply switch one clsing of gates with another, but it adds one gate operation when its for you and any slight leak adds opening the paddles as well

Edited May 20, 2010 by magpie patrick

[jenlyn]

Many times on the Lee and the Stort over the last couple of weeks we arrive at a lock to find the gates open.

 

This morning we met up with a group on a hire boat at one of the locks. They asked us if we leave lock gates open when we leave a lock, we replied that we don’t. They told us that their hire boat company told them that they should leave the gates open behind them. We are now not sure what the lock etiquette is on the Lee and the Stort but we are in the habit of closing the gates behind us and will continue to do so – also, it’s good exercise!!!

One of the locks we passed through today actually had a sign up requesting that the lock be left with all gates closed. Is the hire boat company giving out bad advise ???

 

I remember when on the Wey a few years back, it was standard practice to leave the gates open behind you.

 

brilliant to see your web page up again . . . very informative, i quite fancy a trip up the lee now. you should call it ernies bible . . .

[Ernie]

brilliant to see your web page up again . . . very informative, i quite fancy a trip up the lee now. you should call it ernies bible . . .

 

Go for it, we thoroughly enjoyed the trip.

[Lady Muck]

Water loss is not a problem on most rivers, however sections of the lee and stort are effectively canals with limited water supply

 

This is what a BW worker (happy Mike?) told me when I asked the question - you can clearly see that the river does flow, further upstream where there are many large weirs (really fast flow at Carthagena lock for instance).

 

But further down, where we are and on the pounds surrounding us, there is no flow at all (the Lee Valley flood defences seem to take this flowing water and not the canal) and pounds can and do rapidly dewater if there is a problem (leaky gates, blocked weir etc). The pound below us dewatered yesterday for some reason and water had to be let down via several pounds.

[Phoenix_V]

This is what a BW worker (happy Mike?) told me when I asked the question - you can clearly see that the river does flow, further upstream where there are many large weirs (really fast flow at Carthagena lock for instance).

 

But further down, where we are and on the pounds surrounding us, there is no flow at all (the Lee Valley flood defences seem to take this flowing water and not the canal) and pounds can and do rapidly dewater if there is a problem (leaky gates, blocked weir etc). The pound below us dewatered yesterday for some reason and water had to be let down via several pounds.

 

There are particular problems with the electric locks and their pounds, no doubt BW will solve these like before by switching the locks off off rather than getting to the root cause, but there is really no need to shut all gates above the last electric at Ponders End, all these canal sections now have a feed from the river.

[Lady Muck]

There are particular problems with the electric locks and their pounds, no doubt BW will solve these like before by switching the locks off off rather than getting to the root cause, but there is really no need to shut all gates above the last electric at Ponders End, all these canal sections now have a feed from the river.

 

I think you'll find that I don't close any of the gates anymore

 

I will always close up if theres a notice asking me to though, after my rotten summer of no boating and living life at a slant a few years ago. I don't want anyone else to suffer the same...

Edited May 21, 2010 by Lady Muck

[WJM]

Here is the maths - if everybody leaves their exit gate open then everybody will either do 3 movements (open / close / open ), or two (close / open). This will average at 2.5 gate movements per lock. By closing up you condemn everyone to always doing four movements (open / close / open / close) - almost doubling the workload for you and everyone else. Simple!

[Phoenix_V]

I think you'll find that I don't close any of the gates anymore

 

I will always close up if theres a notice asking me to though, after my rotten summer of no boating and living life at a slant a few years ago. I don't want anyone else to suffer the same...

 

fair enough

[Tim]

Having just cruised up the Lee, we found notices at all of the locks as far as (and including) Enfield Lock. However gates were open at many of those.

[Bob M]

Here is the maths - if everybody leaves their exit gate open then everybody will either do 3 movements (open / close / open ), or two (close / open). This will average at 2.5 gate movements per lock. By closing up you condemn everyone to always doing four movements (open / close / open / close) - almost doubling the workload for you and everyone else. Simple!

I believe your maths do not take into account a boat following you in the same directionand the usual occurance of finding both gates open.

This would result in myself walking along the lock to close one side, then back to cross balance beam and walk along the other side to close the

other side (thats two already). Then cycle the lock to my favour, open 1 gate and go fetch boat. Bring boat in and close gate( thats 4 now) then cycle water again and open gate (5) move out and do the decent thing and close up ( thats 6 if your maths can go that far). I regularly travel

the GU south of Marsworth and ignorant people that leave two gates open can add hours to my journey. I pulled up at Ricky lock in April to find two boats just pulling out without closing the gates, I shouted at them to close them and just got a wave, between there and Hemel I only had 3 locks in my favour, every other one I had to close both top gates. I caught them up at Hemel and lectured them, but they were both hired from Harefield for the weekend and were just doing what Hillingdon told them.

Iwould ask that if you must leave a gate open on a wide lock it is MOST important to leave the one on the towpath side only, none of us has the right to expect other people to cross over gates, I boat at night, in rain/snow and if on my own in bad conditions I often only work 1 side of the lock

so would not be amused if I had to continually keep crossing over to close gates that some lazy ********* could not be bothered to close.

Also wish to add to those that feel it is unessesary to close gates because you believe there is a 50/50 chance you could meet a boat coming the other way, how many locks would you go through without passing a boat before the odds become greater that a boat will be coming in the same direction as you.

1 more point about the CANALISED RIVER Lee, yes its not a true river navigation, is how many boaters do not close the gates EVEN when they see a boat coming behind them, surely if you see a boat coming up behind, and most sections are straight you would close the gates if you are civilised

thanks, moan over

[GUMPY]

I regularly travel the GU south of Marsworth and ignorant people that leave two gates open can add hours to my journey.

 

It always was the convention south of the summit not to shut gates that's just the way it is despite what BW say.

I struggled up from Brentford a week or so ago and all the locks were against us but that's life.

Better to find a lock full and the gates open against you than for you with 6inches of water in it.

[Lady Muck]

Having just cruised up the Lee, we found notices at all of the locks as far as (and including) Enfield Lock. However gates were open at many of those.

 

Good point, these notices seem to appear when locks become leaky, but they remain long after the repair, I guess the answer is - if the lock resembles Niagra Falls, it might be wise to close up, Enfield Lock is one of those, often has a notice on the top gates (not there this time).

 

Whatever you do, there'll be someone, somewhere on the River that is upset about what you did.

[Phoenix_V]

Good point, these notices seem to appear when locks become leaky, but they remain long after the repair, I guess the answer is - if the lock resembles Niagra Falls, it might be wise to close up, Enfield Lock is one of those, often has a notice on the top gates (not there this time).

 

Whatever you do, there'll be someone, somewhere on the River that is upset about what you did.

 

I think this was part of the problem at your lock, there may have been a "shut the gate " sign but it was ignored because there was no obvious reason for it, a case of boy crying wolf, if they had troubled to explain the problem and what they were doing about it it would have been a different story.

 

There is no reason to shut the gate at Enfield as it is a river section but there was a time when the lock had to be left empty as when full it was flooding the lock house, presumably that is now fixed.

 

Agree custom on southern GU is to leave gates and of course they self open on the Regents