Tragedy at Cropredy

[nb Innisfree]

This was a freak accident because it was the head injury that killed the poor woman, not drowning, being crushed of minced by the prop. She suffered a fatal injury falling probably no more than her body height. It was a freak that this killed her.

 

Not many accidents are reported with any distressing details of injuries, we don't know the details of this latest incident but rumours are circulating already, hopefully they are just that having experienced some bizarre rumours myself in some unusual circumstances. Having said that rumours are quite often factual.

[blackrose]

I think tiller tie things can be rigged up. I have seen a sort of catch on a trad which the tiller can be clicked into. When I was planning a single handed trip, which did not take place in the end, I rigged up strings which looped around the end of the tiller, these were attached to the lockers each side. the idea was when the boat was in the lock the tiller would not swing because it was anchored centrally, held in place by the strings on each side, these were slipped off again when I needed to steer.

Thanks, but it's a solution to a problem that (at least in my case) doesn't exist. I've never worried about the position of the tiller when the boat is in a lock or any other time I'm not on deck.

Edited August 2, 2009 by blackrose

[PhilR]

Thanks, but it's a solution to a problem that (at least in my case) doesn't exist. I've never worried about the position of the tiller when the boat is in a lock or any other time I'm not on deck.

 

Some balanced rudders will swing fully over to port or starboard when in forward gear. Tiller restraints can be very handy when single-handing locks with a rudder like mine.

[Guest]

Not many accidents are reported with any distressing details of injuries, we don't know the details of this latest incident but rumours are circulating already, hopefully they are just that having experienced some bizarre rumours myself in some unusual circumstances. Having said that rumours are quite often factual.

 

Nicely put....

I was going to post something about speculation and rumor but this post summed it all up.

[ditchcrawler]

I saw a boat a couple of weeks back whose tiller folded in half to allow movement on the stern whilst in the lock. Thought it was a great idea. Any thoughts to the contrary...or otherwise?

I have seen a nasty cut head due to one of them, when it was lifted there was a bit protruding from the joint, the chap got up from the weed hatch and head butted the end.

From my point of view I don't want a joint in the tiller, I want it solid, but that is no indication that folding is not best.

[Byeckerslike]

I can't see how you could stand behind the tiller on a trad; you would be perching on the button or tipcat fender!

When folk refer to standing in front of the tiller, they are referring to standing in front of the tiller handle, NOT, the actual tiller!

[magpie patrick]

Not many accidents are reported with any distressing details of injuries, we don't know the details of this latest incident but rumours are circulating already, hopefully they are just that having experienced some bizarre rumours myself in some unusual circumstances. Having said that rumours are quite often factual.

 

Yes, but to you (and the others) who are taking this line and then embellishing your elfin safety arguments. Report one by the BBC stated that the woman died of a head injury, the Banbury Guardian report that she died of her injuries not from drowning. These are not "facts" I agree but the BBC at least try and avoid sensationalism.

 

And a spokesman for Thames Valley Police appears (assuming you can believe the press) to have described it as a freak accident. Which roughly means they don't see many like it.

 

When the bloke was killed at Alrewas on a Canal Time boat it was clear that a lack of awareness of the risks coupled with a somewhat cavalier attitude to boat handling had contributed to the accident, better briefing was required. In this case about the only briefing possible is "if you fall you might hit your head"

 

Of course, if you want to make out that cruiser sterns are a death trap you can, but I see far more dangerous behaviour on trads (of which there are far fewer around), and this thread isn't about that anyway

[nb Innisfree]

Yes, but to you (and the others) who are taking this line and then embellishing your elfin safety arguments. Report one by the BBC stated that the woman died of a head injury, the Banbury Guardian report that she died of her injuries not from drowning. These are not "facts" I agree but the BBC at least try and avoid sensationalism.

 

And a spokesman for Thames Valley Police appears (assuming you can believe the press) to have described it as a freak accident. Which roughly means they don't see many like it.

 

When the bloke was killed at Alrewas on a Canal Time boat it was clear that a lack of awareness of the risks coupled with a somewhat cavalier attitude to boat handling had contributed to the accident, better briefing was required. In this case about the only briefing possible is "if you fall you might hit your head"

 

Of course, if you want to make out that cruiser sterns are a death trap you can, but I see far more dangerous behaviour on trads (of which there are far fewer around), and this thread isn't about that anyway

 

I haven't singled out cruiser sterns, but included all types, read my posts + it's not sensationalism but a genuine concern for each others safety and a desire to try and find out the circumstances of this and other tragedies to try and make people aware of risks. As for health and safety I have never seen anywhere ref. to risks associated with props in reverse, never mind embellishing them. As for "if you fall you might hit your head", how dismissive and simplistic is that? no mention of if you are in reverse the danger is multiplied. You are guilty of simplifying risks which to my mind is worse than embellishing.

[Midnight Rider]

The picture in the BBC report shows Broadmoor Lock No 24 about a mile north of Cropredy but the general concensus is that the accident may have occured at Varney's Lock No 23 which is about half a mile further. All I know is that there was a commotion last night as three fire engines, police cars and para-medics streamed through the village. This morning the boat is tied up and cordoned off at Cropredy Wharf with the Police still in attendance. The word on the street is that the boat will be lifted out for further investigation. However the back of the vessel is covered with an awning and an undertaker's van has just arrived - I draw no conclusion from this and I do not know how the boat was brought back to Cropredy.

 

Additional information: the boat is red and named 'Harry' the occupants being a family of four including two teenage children.

 

I think it may be this one:

 

http://www.kateboats.co.uk/narrowboats/harry.htm

 

Boat details now confirmed as above.

 

A tragic accident & I don't suppose the full facts with be known before the inquest.

 

However, in view of Graham's post, it may be more than a simple fall.

 

Tony

[NB Willawaw]

Well the answer is probably to put some more signs up.

 

A notice on the stern rails of a cruiser stern - DON'T SIT HERE and

CAUTION - NARROWBOATING IS POTENTIALLY DANGEROUS KEEP A HAND FOR THE

BOAT AND ONE FOR YOURSELF.

 

A yellow line across the deck boards - Don't stand aft of here.

 

Spend an extra ten minutes cramming more facts in hirers heads even though they reached saturation and the glazed

eyes phase some time ago.

 

That should stop it ever happening again and everybody can demonstrate duty of care.

[nb Innisfree]

Well the answer is probably to put some more signs up.

 

A notice on the stern rails of a cruiser stern - DON'T SIT HERE and

CAUTION - NARROWBOATING IS POTENTIALLY DANGEROUS KEEP A HAND FOR THE

BOAT AND ONE FOR YOURSELF.

 

A yellow line across the deck boards - Don't stand aft of here.

 

Spend an extra ten minutes cramming more facts in hirers heads even though they reached saturation and the glazed

eyes phase some time ago.

 

That should stop it ever happening again and everybody can demonstrate duty of care.

 

You're trivialising an important subject which with proper attention could save a life in the future, perhaps spend less time on trivial instruction and more time on vital safety.

 

And less on ridiculing.

[NB Willawaw]

You are missing the point..

I don't agree. I don't believe it will save more lives. I don't believe people will take any notice.

They are already overloaded with rules, regulations and legislation in this country.

 

Accidents will still happen to those who don't exercise common sense or who make a momentary error or judgement

due to impairment from alcohol, drugs or a distraction of some sort.

[mayalld]

Well the answer is probably to put some more signs up.

 

A notice on the stern rails of a cruiser stern - DON'T SIT HERE and

CAUTION - NARROWBOATING IS POTENTIALLY DANGEROUS KEEP A HAND FOR THE

BOAT AND ONE FOR YOURSELF.

 

A yellow line across the deck boards - Don't stand aft of here.

 

Spend an extra ten minutes cramming more facts in hirers heads even though they reached saturation and the glazed

eyes phase some time ago.

 

That should stop it ever happening again and everybody can demonstrate duty of care.

 

Perhaps what is needed is a recognition that an hour (or less) of instruction to hirers who are champing at the bit to be off on their holiday will never cut the mustard, and that responsible hire companies should start to require a half day tuition before the holiday.

[RLWP]

OK I think it is about time this thread stopped. There's a lot of speculation and solutions being proposed, but we have no idea what happened to this poor woman. Until there has been an inquest the speculation and stuff is fun for those involved, but I'm not sure it is doing anything for the forum.

 

There's a family out there that has lost a loved one, and a hire boat company that will be having all kinds of problems.

 

How about leaving this subject alone?

 

Richard

[nb Innisfree]

You are missing the point..

I don't agree. I don't believe it will save more lives. I don't believe people will take any notice.

They are already overloaded with rules, regulations and legislation in this country.

 

Accidents will still happen to those who don't exercise common sense or who make a momentary error or judgement

due to impairment from alcohol, drugs or a distraction of some sort.

 

Actually when I have warned people of this particular risk they have responded with concern, normal common sense people who have not been aware of this risk but have listened to what I have said. People will listen to sensible and important advice if it is delivered in a reasonable and adult manner. People talk about the good old days but I remember those days in the building trade, men dying through falling off inadequate and dangerous scaffolding which due to pressure from health and safety people was made much safer. How is a family with no experience or knowledge of boating to know danger areas unique to boating without being told of them by people who know, or, should know?

 

I think it is you who is missing the point

[Guest]

OK I think it is about time this thread stopped. There's a lot of speculation and solutions being proposed, but we have no idea what happened to this poor woman. Until there has been an inquest the speculation and stuff is fun for those involved, but I'm not sure it is doing anything for the forum.

 

There's a family out there that has lost a loved one, and a hire boat company that will be having all kinds of problems.

 

How about leaving this subject alone?

 

Richard

 

Very well said...totally agree.

[NB Willawaw]

Innisfree - I think we are talking about slightly different things.

 

RLWP - I am talking generally about the way everytime there is an accident, people call for more protective counter-measures. I was not talking about this specific case, nor would I want to.

 

I have made the point I wanted to make. Maybe there should be a specific new topic to discuss whether increased legislation really does

improve safety on the canals. In deference to the title of this topic and out of respect for the people concerned at Cropredy, I will retire.

Edited August 2, 2009 by NB Willawaw

[kendo50]

Innisfree - I think we are talking about slightly different things.

 

RLWP - I am talking generally about the way everytime there is an accident, people call for more protective counter-measures. I was not talking about this specific case, nor would I want to.

 

I have made the point I wanted to make. Maybe there should be a specific new topic to discuss whether increased legislation really does

improve safety on the canals. In deference to the title of this topic and out of respect for the people concerned at Cropredy, I will retire.

 

 

i feel for the womans family i really do.

 

accidents will happen no matter how much legislation is passed and how much tutorial people have.

[NB Alnwick]

i feel for the womans family i really do.

 

accidents will happen no matter how much legislation is passed and how much tutorial people have.

 

I think we all feel the same on this. We can talk about where best to stand or what safety measures should or should not be proposed in a new topic. This topic is now closed.