Where are all the boaters?

[Arthur Marshall]

14 hours ago, MtB said:

 

In which case my apologies! 

 

I still think you've mentioned from time to time being a tax inspector. Do I have that wrong? 

Part time tax bod for twenty years, then part time accountant (both 2 days a week, the minimum I could get away with ). I was registered self-employed at the same time, from about 1970. Whether anyone considers running a working band for thirty years is a business, could, I supose, be a bit moot, but that's how we (and the Revenue & my accountant) saw it and managing musicians is probably both harder and weirder than dealing with normal employees! Making a decent income out of it isn't easy, either. As far as I was concerned it was a job. It's rather nice these days to just have it as a hobby and mostly play for fun, not money, though the latter's nice when it comes along.

Two of my kids are professional musicians, one runs a successful music school, the other writes film scores among his other stuff.

[Tacet]

On 25/04/2024 at 19:19, Alan de Enfield said:

 

By enlarge the tow paths are private land, although there are some lengths of towpaths that are rights of way (footpaths).

The owners (BW / C&RT) have granted access to the 'other towpaths' under what is called 'a permissive footpath' which basically means that the land owner has given permission for you to walk on their land.

 

There is an important distinction between a public footpath (a highway over which public has a right to pass on foot) and a private right of way (over which specific persons have a right to pass).

[IanD]

8 hours ago, Ronaldo47 said:

Only partly true. Electric bikes with throttles that are limited to no more than 12mph under power and bought before the law changed, are still legal to use on public roads. We have two Powabyke Shopper bikes with throttles,  the first bought some 20 years ago. The legislation prohibiting throttles as from its date of coming ino force, specifically provides that older bikes like ours that were road-legal when bought,  remain legal. 

Literally true, but in reality I bet 100% of the speeding oiks bought theirs in the last few years so this get-out doesn't apply... 😞

[Higgs]

4 minutes ago, IanD said:

Literally true, but in reality I bet 100% of the speeding oiks bought theirs in the last few years so this get-out doesn't apply... 😞

 

That's what he said. 

 

 

Edited April 28 by Higgs

[Grassman]

19 hours ago, Rob-M said:

Plenty of boats in Stone, we were fortunate to get the last space on the visitor moorings and everyone is moored close with no git gaps.

 

I've never known Stone so busy. We've managed to get on a private towpath mooring (with permission!) opposite Canal Cruising as we're booked in there for blacking tomorrow. Barlaston was particularly busy the other day too.

[Rob-M]

1 hour ago, Grassman said:

 

I've never known Stone so busy. We've managed to get on a private towpath mooring (with permission!) opposite Canal Cruising as we're booked in there for blacking tomorrow. Barlaston was particularly busy the other day too.

Are you the one on Marquis mooring, we walked past last night on the way to Proven Pizzeria, one of our favourite pizza restaurants.

[Grassman]

1 minute ago, Rob-M said:

Are you the one on Marquis mooring, we walked past last night on the way to Proven Pizzeria, one of our favourite pizza restaurants.

 

Yes that's us.

[peterboat]

On 27/04/2024 at 08:42, Naughty Cal said:

Remind me again how much inflation we have had in the UK since 2020? 

We have a lovely place to go to 15 a night includes buffet breakfast for 2, dog friendly do book otherwise you could be disappointed. Also bus to Skipton cheap as well

[Naughty Cal]

2 hours ago, peterboat said:

We have a lovely place to go to 15 a night includes buffet breakfast for 2, dog friendly do book otherwise you could be disappointed. Also bus to Skipton cheap as well

Sounds alright.Will give it a try when we are out that way.

 

We are off up to North Yorkshire next weekend. Not spending a great deal on parking. First night is a free stopover in a market town car park, second night £15 in a cattle market car park and third night free at a pub we are eating in.

 

There are still cheap alternatives available if paying campsite prices isn't an option. We tend to mix it up a bit. Don't mind paying campsite prices if we want to be in a particular place but equally happy to kip at the side of the road.

 

We have been up at Castleton this weekend. Great free parking and plenty of pubs to visit.

[peterboat]

1 hour ago, Naughty Cal said:

Sounds alright.Will give it a try when we are out that way.

 

We are off up to North Yorkshire next weekend. Not spending a great deal on parking. First night is a free stopover in a market town car park, second night £15 in a cattle market car park and third night free at a pub we are eating in.

 

There are still cheap alternatives available if paying campsite prices isn't an option. We tend to mix it up a bit. Don't mind paying campsite prices if we want to be in a particular place but equally happy to kip at the side of the road.

 

We have been up at Castleton this weekend. Great free parking and plenty of pubs to visit.

Yes we go out that way as well, always had free parking but its getting crowded I am afraid 

[Naughty Cal]

17 minutes ago, peterboat said:

Yes we go out that way as well, always had free parking but its getting crowded I am afraid 

It was fairly busy yesterday but still plenty of parking available at the bottom of the broken road.

 

The pubs were busy last night which was nice to see. 

[Naughty Cal]

Turns out it was three years today we had our first night out in the van 😀

 

 

[Dave123]

On 24/04/2024 at 13:20, MtB said:

"Where are all the boaters?"

 

I'd say they are all moored up for free on the public towpath. 

 

Given that CRT appears to have ceased all enforcement activity.

I don't think so, Cropredy was empty the other week, hardly any moored boats or moving ones!

[peterboat]

Maybe we are paying that much out to own a boat we can't afford to use them anymore?

[IanD]

10 hours ago, peterboat said:

Maybe we are paying that much out to own a boat we can't afford to use them anymore?

Given that the vast majority of the cost of a boat are the fixed costs of owning it and that moving around costs little in comparison, that seems unlikely -- if people can't afford to use them they can't afford to own them either and would sell up.

 

Or if that's a thinly-disguised dig at CRT's increased license fees, these are still very low and are only a small fraction of the annual cost of owning/running a boat -- probably less than 20% for someone CCing on an old (not-depreciating-much) boat, less than 10% for someone with a newer boat on a home mooring, probably less than 5% for someone with a new (or relatively new) boat moored in a marina where depreciation is the biggest (disguised) expense, just like most cars.

Edited April 29 by IanD

[Lady M]

Of course, for those of us who have owned their boats for a longer time, the cost of taking the boat out has increased significantly.  For us, it used to be almost pennies per day now it is £'s per hour.  My boat would sell for the same number of £'s that it cost.  (Yes, of course, inflation will have had an effect but I don't worry about depreciation.)

[Arthur Marshall]

33 minutes ago, IanD said:

Given that the vast majority of the cost of a boat are the fixed costs of owning it and that moving around costs little in comparison, that seems unlikely -- if people can't afford to use them they can't afford to own them either and would sell up.

 

Or if that's a thinly-disguised dig at CRT's increased license fees, these are still very low and are only a small fraction of the annual cost of owning/running a boat -- probably less than 20% for someone CCing on an old (not-depreciating-much) boat, less than 10% for someone with a newer boat on a home mooring, probably less than 5% for someone with a new (or relatively new) boat moored in a marina where depreciation is the biggest (disguised) expense, just like most cars.

I think Peterboat has a point. A few years ago I didn't have to think twice about trundling off for eight weeks. Now it's down to five in the summer, because I can't afford the diesel and gas, and ditto in the rest of the year because of the price of coal . The fixed costs of licence and mooring have almost doubled (probably more in the case of marina dwellers) and so have running costs. My blacking cost has risen by over 100%, safety certificate is now a ridiculous price (and some idiots, probably mostly examiners, now want it annually).

You can understand why some continuous cruisers don't move as often as they used to and why leisure boaters go for shorter trips and shorter days. A lot of the attraction for short holiday boaters was pub hopping, too, and stacks of them are shut and, again, prices are through the roof.

[IanD]

8 minutes ago, Lady M said:

Of course, for those of us who have owned their boats for a longer time, the cost of taking the boat out has increased significantly.  For us, it used to be almost pennies per day now it is £'s per hour.  My boat would sell for the same number of £'s that it cost.  (Yes, of course, inflation will have had an effect but I don't worry about depreciation.)

 

Exaggeration for effect, methinks -- yes lots of boating costs have gone up over the years, just like everything else in life. What has gone up so much faster for boaters than "normal" people?

Edited April 29 by IanD

[Lady M]

Boat diesel for a start, with the addition of a duty charge for propulsion.  Also, as Arthur says, gas and coal - and beer!

[IanD]

6 minutes ago, Arthur Marshall said:

I think Peterboat has a point. A few years ago I didn't have to think twice about trundling off for eight weeks. Now it's down to five in the summer, because I can't afford the diesel and gas, and ditto in the rest of the year because of the price of coal . The fixed costs of licence and mooring have almost doubled (probably more in the case of marina dwellers) and so have running costs. My blacking cost has risen by over 100%, safety certificate is now a ridiculous price (and some idiots, probably mostly examiners, now want it annually).

You can understand why some continuous cruisers don't move as often as they used to and why leisure boaters go for shorter trips and shorter days. A lot of the attraction for short holiday boaters was pub hopping, too, and stacks of them are shut and, again, prices are through the roof.

 

Agree that lots of prices have gone up over the years, and pubs have closed, and beer and food prices have gone up. Just like they have for everybody else. License and mooring fees may have doubled (over what time?), but then housing costs/rent/utilities for land dwellers have probably gone up by more than this.

 

So yes, the cost of living on a boat has gone up -- just like the cost of not living on a boat... 😉 

[Lady M]

It used to be almost cheaper to go away on the boat than stay at home in the house!

[IanD]

9 minutes ago, Lady M said:

Boat diesel for a start, with the addition of a duty charge for propulsion.  Also, as Arthur says, gas and coal - and beer!

Gas and coal and beer have gone up for everyone, welcome to 2024... 😞 

 

Boat diesel has gone up like -- well, diesel. Fuel cost increases hit drivers much more than boaters. The duty change (getting rid of red diesel) was a genuine boater-only hit, but unless you travel long distances this increase is going to be tiny compared to all the others -- as are the recent license fee increases.

 

7 minutes ago, Lady M said:

It used to be almost cheaper to go away on the boat than stay at home in the house!

So what price increases specific to boaters have changed that?

 

Otherwise you're just complaining about general cost-of-living increases which have hit everybody -- some much more so than boaters (e.g. renters)... 😞 

 

And these also apply to boaters who don't go boating, staying at home (and maintaining that home) is also more expensive nowadays...

Edited April 29 by IanD

[Lady M]

The original question was 'why are there fewer boats about?'  Several of us have given you a response based on long term boat ownership used recreationally and, in some cases at least, their pensioner status.  Please consider why you are arguing with us.

[Stephen Sugg]

I just had a look on Waterways Holidays.com and for the same weekend that I am going to Belgium, I'd be looking at a minimum of £900, up to £1200 for a 4 berth, which is what I'd normally book. That is for a weekend. I then looked at Le Boat in France, more or less the same price. Has boating always been relatively expensive but I've not noticed it before?

[IanD]

26 minutes ago, Lady M said:

The original question was 'why are there fewer boats about?'  Several of us have given you a response based on long term boat ownership used recreationally and, in some cases at least, their pensioner status.  Please consider why you are arguing with us.

I'm arguing with your reasoning, which seems to be that boater costs have gone up much more than everybody else's costs -- and this doesn't seem to be true, *everybody* is paying more for almost *everything* nowadays, boaters aren't being especially hard done by. Unless you can come up with some specific cases -- like red diesel -- all the others are just a general cost-of-living complaint.

 

So making out that boaters are somehow a special type of victim (and it's all CART's fault...) doesn't stand up to scrutiny. Many other leisure activities have also seen fewer numbers recently, it's what happens when people's finances get squeezed. Blame the UK economic situation if you want a culprit.

 

14 minutes ago, Stephen Sugg said:

I just had a look on Waterways Holidays.com and for the same weekend that I am going to Belgium, I'd be looking at a minimum of £900, up to £1200 for a 4 berth, which is what I'd normally book. That is for a weekend. I then looked at Le Boat in France, more or less the same price. Has boating always been relatively expensive but I've not noticed it before?

I've been hiring narrowboats and holiday cottages for many years. They've both got considerably more expensive in recent years, by roughly the same amount.

Edited April 29 by IanD