Rochdale Canal

[dmr]

4 minutes ago, IanD said:

 

I assume you mean the other way round (close it in winter), since most boaters want to move in summer?

 

Still doesn't help if the money to do the desired maintenance isn't in the kitty though... 😞

 

I suspect CRT have a lot of maintenance resources under used in summer. Also the days are longer and weather better so doing "winter maintenance" all year round would make better use of limited funding. I think CRT are looking into this.

A lot of boaters won't use the Rochdale for fear of getting stuck so if an early spring or late autum passage had a good chance of success then it might really help.  It would take some organising as through passage would need co-ordination with other waterway stoppages, possibly including the Bridgewater.

[Adam]

Something needs to be done to tempt boats up there, at minimum cheap winter moorings or extending the 14 day rule to 28 to get the Cmers flocking, or at a maximum giving some dispensations out to marina operators / private investors to entice them into the area. 

 

Both would require much better maintenance, note the "calder valley" facebook page of the CRT lads that maintain the Western HNC & Rochdale is always filled with posts of them fixing the HNC, something tells me the resources are being concentrated.

 

Do we have have figures for passages over the Rochdale?  

[dmr]

1 hour ago, Adam said:

Something needs to be done to tempt boats up there, at minimum cheap winter moorings or extending the 14 day rule to 28 to get the Cmers flocking, or at a maximum giving some dispensations out to marina operators / private investors to entice them into the area. 

 

Both would require much better maintenance, note the "calder valley" facebook page of the CRT lads that maintain the Western HNC & Rochdale is always filled with posts of them fixing the HNC, something tells me the resources are being concentrated.

 

Do we have have figures for passages over the Rochdale?  

 

CRT can't really extend the 14 day rule but they could do a lot to help. The whole of Hebden bridge, possibly the jewel in the Crown of the Rochdale, is signed as 24 hours though most boats ignore this. The visitor moorings either end of the summit are 48 hours (I think). After all that slog up through Manchester boats really need the option of spending several weeks in the good Yorkshire bits.

It would be difficult to temp anybody to build a marina due to the water shortages though there have been a couple of potential schemes.

Winter moorings are a good idea, they already do them in Tod and it looks like there are no takers this year but have been in previous years.

You can get a fair estimate of passages from the CRT lockage report.

[Midnight]

1 hour ago, Adam said:

Something needs to be done to tempt boats up there, at minimum cheap winter moorings or extending the 14 day rule to 28 to get the Cmers flocking, or at a maximum giving some dispensations out to marina operators / private investors to entice them into the area. 

 

Both would require much better maintenance, note the "calder valley" facebook page of the CRT lads that maintain the Western HNC & Rochdale is always filled with posts of them fixing the HNC, something tells me the resources are being concentrated.

 

Do we have have figures for passages over the Rochdale?  

All that needs to be done is better maintenance and a clean up in Manchester. I get the feeling C&RT aren't trying very hard. If it wasn't for Shire Cruisers I believe it would even less reliable, if that's possible

[dmr]

deleted

 

Edited January 26 by dmr
deleted as somehow it got posted twice

[Pluto]

A couple of images, first a map of the reservoirs in 1913, and the second is a plan of Todmorden Lock lower gates from 1863, when the gates were first altered when the bridge was widened. They were removed when the bridge was widened again, and the current lifting gate installed. Both images from the Rochdale Canal records in the Greater Manchester Record Office.

[dmr]

Seeing the resevoir capacities in terms of lockfulls really does drive home how much has been lost.  Alll that is left, I believe, is a share in Lower Chelburn which is the smallest of the resevoirs, though I think there are little additional feeds from Hollingworth and Warland.

[Midnight]

1 hour ago, dmr said:

Seeing the resevoir capacities in terms of lockfulls really does drive home how much has been lost.  Alll that is left, I believe, is a share in Lower Chelburn which is the smallest of the resevoirs, though I think there are little additional feeds from Hollingworth and Warland.

I believe it is 1 lockfull per day but it rolls over if they don't use it.

[dmr]

9 minutes ago, Midnight said:

I believe it is 1 lockfull per day but it rolls over if they don't use it.

I heard a figure of so many megalitres per month but I can't remember the number 😀

It takes two lockfulls to get a boat over the summit so 1 lockfull is a bit mean, but averaged over a year is maybe not so bad, but then it has to keep the whole Littleborough flight and the two Warland pounds topped up too.

[Midnight]

10 hours ago, dmr said:

I heard a figure of so many megalitres per month but I can't remember the number 😀

It takes two lockfulls to get a boat over the summit so 1 lockfull is a bit mean, but averaged over a year is maybe not so bad, but then it has to keep the whole Littleborough flight and the two Warland pounds topped up too.

Your figuring makes more sense than what I was told by Ray the Summit lockie about 2006. Leakage must make dent in the allowance. Coming up from Littleborough last year there were huge quantities of water cascading over top gates until we reached Punchbowl then the pounds above were very low. It was only touch and go that Billy allowed us to proceed over Summit.

[dmr]

I think something went wrong in the last couple of years as this is my observation too, a load of water leaves the summit but then gets lost somewhere.

CRT have just done a lot of work on lock 36 (East summit) to make it fully watertight but maybe they should have sorted out the Littleborough flight water loss???. I suspect that a little bit of fixing could save a significant amount of precious summit water. The "on the ground team" (especially Billy) are well aware of the situation but as always funding is limited.

[Pluto]

On 28/01/2024 at 21:24, dmr said:

Seeing the resevoir capacities in terms of lockfulls really does drive home how much has been lost.  Alll that is left, I believe, is a share in Lower Chelburn which is the smallest of the resevoirs, though I think there are little additional feeds from Hollingworth and Warland.

Historically, canal engineer almost always thought and calculated in lockfulls, which made it much easier for non-engineering people to understand what was happening. After writing an historical account on Winterburn Reservoir, I did suggest the BWs water engineers that they should revert to this method of measurement, but to no avail. On researching the report, it was interesting to note that canal-related discussion used lockfulls, while the compensation water required by other authorities to keep Eshton Beck flowing, was in engineering units.

[Ronaldo47]

There's probably some legal requirement to use metric units in official documents. 

[Jim Riley]

1 hour ago, Ronaldo47 said:

There's probably some legal requirement to use metric units in official documents. 

Nah, it's been changed to Pints now😂

[IanD]

1 hour ago, Jim Riley said:

Nah, it's been changed to Pints now😂

Hoorah, a B***** benefit at last !!!

[dmr]

6 hours ago, Pluto said:

Historically, canal engineer almost always thought and calculated in lockfulls, which made it much easier for non-engineering people to understand what was happening. After writing an historical account on Winterburn Reservoir, I did suggest the BWs water engineers that they should revert to this method of measurement, but to no avail. On researching the report, it was interesting to note that canal-related discussion used lockfulls, while the compensation water required by other authorities to keep Eshton Beck flowing, was in engineering units.

 

The local CRT man was telling me how many mega litres he is allowed to take and it meant very little to me without going home and doing the sums. Lockfulls would be a much better unit.