Looking for fuses

[magnetman]

Jabsco water puppy. 

 

More likely to be a shower tray evacuation pump than a bilge pump. 

 

This pump is known to blow fuses. 

 

What happens is that it gets used irregularly and the impeller gets blocked. It is a brushed motor so there can be commutator issues depending on where the rotor stops after use. 

 

Regular use can sort this out. 

 

Striking the body of the motor with a piece of firewood can work. 

 

Never use hammers. 

 

 

[Jason322]

6 hours ago, BEngo said:

The manual hand pump should have no connection to the electrics.  If it doesn't work you will need to find and dismantle and clean it.  Check also that its overboard discharge is clear.

 

I think the fuses for your bilge pumps, (and everything else) may be integral with the switches.  Each switch is a circuit breaker. They all appear to be in the OFF position.

 

The Rule a matic device pictured is an automatic switch to start the bilge pump if the water level rises.  They are renowned for failing.  I suspect this has failed and the pumps have run dry and also failed.

Doesxeverything else (horn etc.on the switch panel work? If not a main fuse, which should be located near the battery has possibly failed, or the battery isolator is OFF.

 

Do you have a multimeter? If not, you should  get one.  They are not dear and are essential for fault finding electrical kit.  Then check the voltages at the pump connections with the bilge pump switches ON.  Come back with the results.

N

14  volts coming through neutral wire (blue) and 0 volts through live 

[MtB]

12 minutes ago, magnetman said:

This pump is known to blow fuses. 

 

More commonly, the vanes all break off inside the brass casting so the motor whizzes round, but no puming occurs.

 

Impeller is supposed to be replaced annually because of this 'feature'.

 

 

[magnetman]

One of mine tends to blow fuses. Impeller is alright something funny with the motor I think. Or possibly the wiring. Or the fuse. 

Both of the Boats have these pumps for the showers but as it is incredibly rare for me to do forced water body washing procedures they don't get used much. One is seized one isn't. 

 

 

The one which is seized is exactly like the pump pictured about. Very similar. 

[Jason322]

3 hours ago, Tony Brooks said:

 

I think we agree on that possibility until the OP clarifies.

Hi the switch is not working because the switch trips whenever I try to run the pump at the fore. The water will just build up slowly until I remove water so I don’t think the sensor switch is working 

[magnetman]

Maybe not identical. 

54 minutes ago, Jason322 said:

 

 

This is not the type of pump usually associated with removal of bilge water. 

[Jason322]

4 minutes ago, magnetman said:

Maybe not identical. 

 

 

This is not the type of pump usually associated with removal of bilge water. 

Looks similar so just need to locate fuse then and check this first 

[magnetman]

I think it is the same pump. This one is for evacuation of the shower tray. 

 

It might work as a bilge pump but its not what one would usually see.

 

I've had problems with this pump due to irregular use (soap dodger). 

 

Even so it shouldn't really just seize and stop working. As mentioned above there can be impeller issues with these but thats normally an ageing thing or lots of use. There is a brass plate on the front with about a dozen brass machine screws. One can remove this for inspection. 

 

I found that ageing without use (life ambition) can cause hardness in the impeller and reduce pumping effectiveness whereas excess use (not life ambition) can cause breakage of impeller vanes leading to all sorts of trouble. 

 

Moral: don't use the shower. 

[agg221]

2 minutes ago, magnetman said:

I think it is the same pump. This one is for evacuation of the shower tray. 

 

It might work as a bilge pump but its not what one would usually see.

 

I've had problems with this pump due to irregular use (soap dodger). 

 

Even so it shouldn't really just seize and stop working. As mentioned above there can be impeller issues with these but thats normally an ageing thing or lots of use. There is a brass plate on the front with about a dozen brass machine screws. One can remove this for inspection. 

 

I found that ageing without use (life ambition) can cause hardness in the impeller and reduce pumping effectiveness whereas excess use (not life ambition) can cause breakage of impeller vanes leading to all sorts of trouble. 

 

Moral: don't use the shower. 

The general conclusion is, the most likely problem if this pump has actually been fitted as a bilge pump is to unscrew the brass plate from the front and see what state the impeller is in. If it is stuck, they can be freed off (usually by removing the crud from around the impeller with a small screwdriver) and if the impeller blades have snapped off then a new one is in order. Either way, from memory, it is a good idea to get the service kit as there is a seal which is best changed at the same time rather than re-used I think.

 

Alec

[MtB]

31 minutes ago, magnetman said:

There is a brass plate on the front with about a dozen brass machine screws.

 

Three screws usually! 

 

 

[magnetman]

27 minutes ago, MtB said:

 

Three screws usually! 

 

 

Its the glasses. And the made in China thing. 

[Alan de Enfield]

1 hour ago, MtB said:

 

Three screws usually! 

 

 

 

6 screws usually (on the Johnson pumps)

 

 

About £850 each

 

I have one on each engine.

[Tony Brooks]

6 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

 

6 screws usually (on the Johnson pumps)

 

snip

 

and on the larger Jabsco electric pumps unless Jabsco have redesigned them. Only the smallest used three screws.

[magnetman]

39 minutes ago, Tony Brooks said:

 

and on the larger Jabsco electric pumps unless Jabsco have redesigned them. Only the smallest used three screws.

I checked. 

 

Mine has 3 screws. 

 

The same will be the case for the pump imaged by the OP earlier on which is relatively recent Jabsco water puppy. 

 

The number of screws is actually discernible in the image.

 

One can draw conclusions despite the viewing angle. 

 

 

I was a little surprised too as have not had the cover orf this one. 

 

 

The relentless March of Modernity conveniently dressed up as 'improvements'. 

 

Oh dear !

 

The other Boat has an older version of the same pump which does have 6 screws. 

 

The Maxi Puppy (presumably this is a coded reference to a large infant canine such as a dogo argentino) could be quite dangerous and has 4 screws! 

 

 

Also a very attractive body casting on that one. LG2 bronze I suspect. 

[Stroudwater1]

2 hours ago, Alan de Enfield said:

 

6 screws usually (on the Johnson pumps)

 

 

About £850 each

 

I have one on each engine.

Isn’t that a  pump for the water coolant in the engine though and not a shower pump. Unless you have two showers that need to discharge shower waste across the Bristol Channel?  
 

Like magnetman our shower Jabsco whale gulper has 3 screws. It also has a tendency to fuse/ not start occasionally . 
 

It seems more prone to fuse in cold weather and I’m sure it needs the impeller looking at. 
 

Our fuse is placed in a screw in holder along the wire leading out from the back of the pump around 9 inches away. 15amp glass. https://www.amazon.co.uk/18AWG-Inline-Screw-Fuse-Holder/dp/B0848JYKKT

How does the shower waste work for the OPs boat though? It’s a 1979 boat. Shower trays have come a long way since then.  Do some early showers drain into the bilge area? 
 

Despite it being a bit intermittent ours always does work once started. It’s the best shower pump we’ve had. It’s so powerful it clears out the water very fast so it needs switching on and off during a shower once or twice. 

 

 

[magnetman]

5 minutes ago, Stroudwater1 said:

 

Like magnetman our shower Jabsco whale gulper has 3 screws. It also has a tendency to fuse/ not start occasionally . 
 

 

Point of Order here. 

 

Jabsco and Whale are two different pump makers. 

 

A Whale gulper is a diaphragm pump and a very good one too. 

 

The Jabsco pump is a Water Puppy. This is a rubber impeller in a non circular bronze housing. It is quite a different pump. 

 

Both are positive displacement but one is a rotary impeller and the other is a reciprocating diaphragm.

 

The Whale Gulper is technically a superior pump for shower tray evacuation purposes. 

 

I quite like the way the Jabsco pump shrieks when the tray is empty as it is a reminder to switch it orf. A Whale gulper just quietly carries on doing its work whether there is water to be pumped or not. 

 

 

[Tony Brooks]

9 hours ago, magnetman said:

I checked. 

 

Mine has 3 screws. 

 

The same will be the case for the pump imaged by the OP earlier on which is relatively recent Jabsco water puppy. 

 

The number of screws is actually discernible in the image.

 

One can draw conclusions despite the viewing angle. 

 

 

 

I was a little surprised too as have not had the cover orf this one. 

 

 

 

The relentless March of Modernity conveniently dressed up as 'improvements'. 

 

Oh dear !

 

The other Boat has an older version of the same pump which does have 6 screws. 

 

The Maxi Puppy (presumably this is a coded reference to a large infant canine such as a dogo argentino) could be quite dangerous and has 4 screws! 

 

 

 

Also a very attractive body casting on that one. LG2 bronze I suspect. 

 

Now you post the brighter image, I agree, I originally thought the image was of the brush end of the motor with a pipe fitting close by.

 

I wonder how the OP's Water Puppies are orientated. We found that if they were fitted horizontally, then water from a leaking pump seal would get into the motor a seize it up. That is despite the drain holes in the pump casting. We always mounted them with the pump lower than the motor to prevent this.

[Stroudwater1]

It looks like they sell the water puppy as a bilge pump which seems to add to the confusion I’ve already added with the “whale pump” which as Magnetman rightly points out is a water puppy. Ours is a puppy but It pumps out more like a whale tbf  

 

 

https://foxschandlery.com/products/jabsco-water-puppy-bilge-pump-23680-400312v?variant=43333680201964&dfw_tracker=160376-43333680201964&nbt=nb%3Aadwords%3Ax%3A19584317185%3A%3A&nb_adtype=pla&nb_kwd=&nb_ti=&nb_mi=9405570&nb_pc=online&nb_pi=43333680201964&nb_ppi=&nb_placement=&nb_li_ms=&nb_lp_ms=&nb_fii=&nb_ap=&nb_mt=&gad_source=1&gbraid=0AAAAAD1x3fBz0es9a7yoaPZzQVfGuksju&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIl5L1sp25gwMVJ5JQBh0fuAH6EAQYAiABEgJynfD_BwE

[Jason322]

On 30/12/2023 at 19:02, Jason322 said:

14  volts coming through neutral wire (blue) and 0 volts through live 

So here is pump but I don’t think it’s working as dry as a bone and put inlet pipe in bucket of water and is not sucking up water so that explains that. There is current going to electric pump but shorts when gets to pump so will take pump off and check if it is working 

[Tony Brooks]

I think that you know, but unless the hinged cover on the manual pump is clamped back against the pump body, it will not pump.

 

It looks as if the cover seals to the body by a rubber O ring, make sure this joint is clean and the rubber O rind still flexible.

 

[GreenHeaven]

On 30/12/2023 at 21:18, Jason322 said:

Yes all other electronics work and engine starts so don’t think it’s the battery. Picture of pump added

Thats a very fine Jabsco 23680 pump I use for primary pump on watermaker. does draw some power tho

needs think leads and an inline fuse