Delta 30 output shaft oil seal replacement

[Tony Brooks]

31 minutes ago, David Mutch said:

Doesn't look like it's necessary to disconnect the water side of the oil cooler in my case, so hopefully won't be a problem, but thanks for the heads up 🙂

 

It depends on where the oil cooler is mounted. Sometimes it is on the gearbox so may be removed with the box.

[john.k]

You may also need a Speedi Sleeve if the shaft is grooved at the seal contact.......if you do fit a Speedi Sleeve the groove must be filled to make a heat sink ,or the plastic will burn.

[Tracy D'arth]

52 minutes ago, john.k said:

....if you do fit a Speedi Sleeve the groove must be filled to make a heat sink ,or the plastic will burn.

Interesting, I have never done that.  Where did you get that instruction from?

[john.k]

I think its on the speedi sleeve packet ..........you are supposed to use epoxy,but I just use Loctite blue .......its for sure if the space is empty both sleeve and seal will fail in short order..............another strike against polymer seals ......the old leather seals never damaged shafts ....Sometimes there is provision to install the seal a bit out of position ,and on an unworn shaft surface.

[David Mutch]

Hi all. Well, thanks to your help, I think I've got it licked. It was a bit more involved than I had imagined, in particular removal and refitting of the rear bearing. The output shaft had a visible score line where the seal sat, but you couldn't actually feel it with a nail. It was also slightly corroded, but not where the seal sits. Managed to clean it up ok with some wet and dry and very careful use of a Dremel. The new seal is of a different design and so naturally sits in a different spot, so decided there was no need to sleeve. So far no leaks, but time will tell.

 

I say no leaks, but actually now there's a different leak, coming from between B2 and B1 on the attached. Am I right in thinking that this just houses a repair kit for the oil pump, and can be removed and resealed independently of the rest of the oil pump assembly?

 

Thanks 🙂

[Tony Brooks]

From my reading of the image, it has nothing to do with housing a repair kit, the repair kit items list has no image number. I think it is some form of intermediate plate, but from the image I can not work out what it is supposed to do. It seems the wrong inner shape for a gear type pump. I am surprised there are no gaskets or O rings between B1, B2 and B7.

[Steve56]

What you are showing there is the oil pump assembly. The repair kit you mention is just the gears and spindle for the pump. The pump and the plate you mentioned is just a machined plate with metal to metal sealing.  From what I remember PRM don't use any sealant on these joints. Personally if I was rebuilding one I may be inclined to use a smear of Wellseal on the faces. Just as a matter of interest did you remove the oil pump assembly when you did the work. Some of the bolts that hold the pump assembly to the gearbox also hold the pump together. So quite important to torque these up evenly and to correct torque.

[Tony Brooks]

15 minutes ago, Steve56 said:

What you are showing there is the oil pump assembly. The repair kit you mention is just the gears and spindle for the pump. The pump and the plate you mentioned is just a machined plate with metal to metal sealing.  From what I remember PRM don't use any sealant on these joints. Personally if I was rebuilding one I may be inclined to use a smear of Wellseal on the faces. Just as a matter of interest did you remove the oil pump assembly when you did the work. Some of the bolts that hold the pump assembly to the gearbox also hold the pump together. So quite important to torque these up evenly and to correct torque.

 

Thanks, I agree with the thin film of sealer but would not say that unless confirmed.

[David Mutch]

17 minutes ago, Steve56 said:

What you are showing there is the oil pump assembly. The repair kit you mention is just the gears and spindle for the pump. The pump and the plate you mentioned is just a machined plate with metal to metal sealing.  From what I remember PRM don't use any sealant on these joints. Personally if I was rebuilding one I may be inclined to use a smear of Wellseal on the faces. Just as a matter of interest did you remove the oil pump assembly when you did the work. Some of the bolts that hold the pump assembly to the gearbox also hold the pump together. So quite important to torque these up evenly and to correct torque.

D'Oh! That makes a lot more sense! 🤭 

 

It's obviously had some sort of sealant on it before. I didn't remove the pump to do the rear oil seal. I suspect the leak is just showing up now because the box finally has the right amount of oil in it!

 

What I can't work out is how I'm supposed to get a spanner/socket on the two recessed bolts (pic attached). What am I missing?

Edited May 13, 2023 by David Mutch

[Tony Brooks]

Get a quality 3/8 drive socket that will fit into the recess around the hexagon. A quality 1/2" drive one may well also fit. I don't know the torque required, but a 1/4" drive socket may well work, but at the risk of it splitting if the torque is too high.

[Steve56]

3 minutes ago, David Mutch said:

D'Oh! That makes a lot more sense! 🤭 

 

It's obviously had some sort of sealant on it before. I didn't remove the pump to do the rear oil seal. I suspect the leak is just showing up now because the box finally has the right amount of oil in it!

 

What I can't work out is how I'm supposed to get a spanner/socket on the two recessed bolts (pic attached). What am I missing?

There should be enough clearance around the bolt heads to use a socket. Especially if you use a smaller 3/8 drive socket. On the lower bolt the coupling may get in the way. That's the reason the output coupling has cutouts on it. You may have to unbolt the R&D coupling and slide the shaft back to get some space.

[David Mutch]

8 minutes ago, Tony Brooks said:

Get a quality 3/8 drive socket that will fit into the recess around the hexagon. A quality 1/2" drive one may well also fit. I don't know the torque required, but a 1/4" drive socket may well work, but at the risk of it splitting if the torque is too high.

D'Oh! I'm being a little slow this morning. My 1/4" fits. Was assuming it had to be a 1/2"! Thanks!

[bizzard]

The pump cover bolts should have copper washers on em or they will leak oil. As not all of them screw into blind holes but into the oil space.

[David Mutch]

7 minutes ago, Steve56 said:

There should be enough clearance around the bolt heads to use a socket. Especially if you use a smaller 3/8 drive socket. On the lower bolt the coupling may get in the way. That's the reason the output coupling has cutouts on it. You may have to unbolt the R&D coupling and slide the shaft back to get some space.

Thanks. I'll have a go and report back 🙂

Just now, bizzard said:

The pump cover bolts should have copper washers on em or they will leak oil. As not all of them screw into blind holes but into the oil space.

Thanks. Not leaking round the bolts so far as I can see. Looks like it's leaking at the joint. I'm hoping a new coating of RTV will fix the problem (at least temporarily)

[Steve56]

1 minute ago, bizzard said:

The pump cover bolts should have copper washers on em or they will leak oil. As not all of them screw into blind holes but into the oil space.

Normally from new they would have been fitted with Dowty Seals.

[Tony Brooks]

4 minutes ago, Steve56 said:

Normally from new they would have been fitted with Dowty Seals.

and that might have raised the hexagons high enough to get a cheap socket on.

 

It looks as if some may still have Dowty washers on.

 

PS, Sockets often have a taper on the inner bore at the "top", carefully grinding the socket down so the face is still square but without the taper may work for you.

15 minutes ago, David Mutch said:

. I'm hoping a new coating of RTV will fix the problem (at least temporarily)

 

Make it a very thin coating and leave a few mm uncoated around the middle of the face. The last thing you want is chunks of sealer moving through the hydraulic drillings and clutches.

Edited May 13, 2023 by Tony Brooks