Boat dwellers to be able to claim the £400 energy allowance.

[IanD]

52 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

 

I have not received mine yet - although I have an emails saying it is coming this week.

 

Are C&RT saying that the rules / law about CCing requirements are changing - and to what ?

 

Peter's saying it's "skewed to get the answers CART wanted" because it includes questions about whether widebeams like his should be charged more (e.g. charging by boat area)... 😉

 

I haven't seen it yet either, but going by the FAQs the "skew" is an inbuilt assumption that the average license fee will go up -- which should come as no great surprise to anyone, and CART explain why this is necessary.

 

On top of that it's asking whether this should be done by increasing all fees by the same percentage, or changing the fee structure so some boaters -- with bigger/wider boats, or CCers who use the system more -- should pay a bigger increase. Many people think that's fair -- except for those who would pay more, who mostly don't.

 

However since wideboats are greatly outnumbered by narrowboats and CCers by those with a home mooring, it seems likely that there will be a big majority in favour of differential pricing, because most people would rather that other people paid more instead of them... 😉

 

(actually it's likely that everyone will pay more, but some will pay more than others -- Animal Farm, anyone?)

 

AFAIK it's all about fee increases, there's nothing about changing the CC rules even though this might make sense -- but then they're so widely flouted nowadays by CMers there's no point changing the rules without effective enforcement, which isn't happening.

[Higgs]

1 minute ago, Paul C said:

Exactly.

 

Just to avoid possible confusing - I think the governments haven't done well. 

 

 

[Arthur Marshall]

If there are only 5,500 continuous cruisers, as I've seen quoted somewhere, doubling their costs is going to be a drop in the wet stuff. Won't make much difference to CRTs income.

[Higgs]

2 minutes ago, Arthur Marshall said:

If there are only 5,500 continuous cruisers, as I've seen quoted somewhere, doubling their costs is going to be a drop in the wet stuff. Won't make much difference to CRTs income.

 

Doubling the cost is likely to lead to a protest and blockages. 

 

 

[IanD]

5 minutes ago, Arthur Marshall said:

If there are only 5,500 continuous cruisers, as I've seen quoted somewhere, doubling their costs is going to be a drop in the wet stuff. Won't make much difference to CRTs income.

 

If 20% of boaters have their license fee doubled that increases CARTs license fee income by 10%, without affecting the other 80% of boaters.

 

Or look at it the other way -- however much CART increase the overall license fee, those with a home mooring get a 10% discount off this increase thanks to the increased CC fees... 😉

Edited March 7, 2023 by IanD

[Higgs]

1 minute ago, IanD said:

 

If 20% of boaters have their license fee doubled that increases CARTs license fee income by 10%, without affecting the other 80% of boaters.

 

Or look at it the other way -- however much CART increase the overall license fee, those with a home mooring get a 10% discount thanks to the increased CC fees... 😉

 

No, I'd quite like to see your licence doubled. 

 

 

[Paul C]

5 minutes ago, Higgs said:

 

Doubling the cost is likely to lead to a protest and blockages. 

 

 

That will be interesting (the attempted blockages, not the protests).

1 minute ago, Higgs said:

 

No, I'd quite like to see your licence doubled. 

 

 

Fill the consultation form in then, I bet it not chosen as an option. Maybe increasing it for CCers won’t be neither, and it’s all put onto wide beams.

[Higgs]

6 minutes ago, Paul C said:

That will be interesting (the attempted blockages, not the protests).

Fill the consultation form in then, I bet it not chosen as an option. Maybe increasing it for CCers won’t be neither, and it’s all put onto wide beams.

 

We will have to see.

 

 

[Paul C]

4 minutes ago, Higgs said:

 

We will have to see.

 

 

Hopefully it’s as successful as your campaign for marinas not to insist on mooring boats having a CRT licence.

[Arthur Marshall]

9 minutes ago, Paul C said:

That will be interesting (the attempted blockages, not the protests).

Fill the consultation form in then, I bet it not chosen as an option. Maybe increasing it for CCers won’t be neither, and it’s all put onto wide beams.

It's already been mentioned informally by CRT that a new CC licence will be coming in. There's no point if it's the same price as the standard one. Maybe a new fatboat licence, too.

[IanD]

14 minutes ago, Paul C said:

That will be interesting (the attempted blockages, not the protests).

Fill the consultation form in then, I bet it not chosen as an option. Maybe increasing it for CCers won’t be neither, and it’s all put onto wide beams.

 

Isn't it fascinating how some people think that if 52% of people are in favour of something they agree with the other 48% should just shut up and accept it and *definitely* not protest, but when (for example) 80% of boaters are in favour of something *they* disagree with (charging widebeams and/or CCers more) it's OK for the 20% to start blockading the canals? 😉

Edited March 7, 2023 by IanD

[Paul C]

Protesting without actually blocking the canals is fine.

[Higgs]

Just now, Paul C said:

Protesting without actually blocking the canals is fine.

 

Well, I wouldn't suggest blocking the M25.

 

 

[magnetman]

Blockading water points?

People could aggressively apply plumbers' pipe freezers to the water supplies and deny access..

"What do we want? Free Coal. When do we want it ? Now". 

 

 

[Higgs]

2 minutes ago, magnetman said:

Blockading water points?

People could aggressively apply plumbers' pipe freezers to the water supplies and deny access..

"What do we want? Free Coal. When do we want it ? Now". 

 

 

 

In the winter?

 

 

[magnetman]

I'm happy to have free coal any time. 

 

I'll use it in winter but I want it now. 

[Paul C]

10 minutes ago, Higgs said:

 

Well, I wouldn't suggest blocking the M25.

 

 

It would get more publicity.

[Higgs]

Just now, Paul C said:

It would get more publicity.

 

But totally unrelated to the protest. 

 

 

[IanD]

2 minutes ago, Paul C said:

It would get more publicity.

Especially if you did it with a narrowboat across all three lanes... 😉

[magnetman]

you could combine the two by getting protesters to glue themselves the surface and underside of motorway bridges over canals. 

 

Also important to blockade the waterway by making two human dams and bailing out the section between with buckets. 

That'll show 'em that paying £1000 a year to be able to use all of the CRT waterways is far too expensive. 

[beerbeerbeerbeerbeer]

21 hours ago, Alan de Enfield said:

 

Do you ever walk on the pavement ?
Do you ever go out in the dark and are grateful for street lighting ?

Do you feel safer because the Police and Fire sevices are out there ?

Did you or your children ever go to school ?

 

If you are not paying CT then you are getting these 'for free' - why should you ?

 

Yep, I get them for free too. 
I love this country, the opportunities for freeloading are great. 
 

And sometimes I put my chip wrapper in someone else’s bin.

 

it’s win win win. 
 

 

[Higgs]

2 minutes ago, magnetman said:

you could combine the two by getting protesters to glue themselves the surface and underside of motorway bridges over canals. 

 

Also important to blockade the waterway by making two human dams and bailing out the section between with buckets. 

That'll show 'em that paying £1000 a year to be able to use all of the CRT waterways is far too expensive. 

 

My licence is a little over that now. I don't mind in the least, paying that. £2,000 - I would be peeved. 

 

 

[Arthur Marshall]

4 minutes ago, Higgs said:

 

My licence is a little over that now. I don't mind in the least, paying that. £2,000 - I would be peeved. 

 

 

For a forty foot boat, I now pay about £1900 a year for the privilege of being on the canal. I don't see why you shouldn't pay the equivalent rate - you moor up as often as I do, just in different places a bit more often.

I haven't noticed anyone suggesting my mooring fee of about £800 should be halved because I spend half the year cruising.

[peterboat]

55 minutes ago, IanD said:

 

Peter's saying it's "skewed to get the answers CART wanted" because it includes questions about whether widebeams like his should be charged more (e.g. charging by boat area)... 😉

 

I haven't seen it yet either, but going by the FAQs the "skew" is an inbuilt assumption that the average license fee will go up -- which should come as no great surprise to anyone, and CART explain why this is necessary.

 

On top of that it's asking whether this should be done by increasing all fees by the same percentage, or changing the fee structure so some boaters -- with bigger/wider boats, or CCers who use the system more -- should pay a bigger increase. Many people think that's fair -- except for those who would pay more, who mostly don't.

 

However since wideboats are greatly outnumbered by narrowboats and CCers by those with a home mooring, it seems likely that there will be a big majority in favour of differential pricing, because most people would rather that other people paid more instead of them... 😉

 

(actually it's likely that everyone will pay more, but some will pay more than others -- Animal Farm, anyone?)

 

AFAIK it's all about fee increases, there's nothing about changing the CC rules even though this might make sense -- but then they're so widely flouted nowadays by CMers there's no point changing the rules without effective enforcement, which isn't happening.

I have said before I won't be paying for a CRT license so it doesn't matter, however I did the consultation you haven't its definitely skewed to give the answer CRT wants. You are right they are going to increase widebeams and CCers a lot I would expect and sewer tubes will get hit as well to a lesser extent. As I said I have a mooring secured off CRT waters how many others will follow suit? If enough get scrapped and enough move it will have a negative outcome for CRT, meaning more will have to be charged next year.

I have had years of watching the waterways decline nothing is going to change that until managers start managing 

[Higgs]

3 minutes ago, Arthur Marshall said:

For a forty foot boat, I now pay about £1900 a year for the privilege of being on the canal. I don't see why you shouldn't pay the equivalent rate - you moor up as often as I do, just in different places a bit more often.

I haven't noticed anyone suggesting my mooring fee of about £800 should be halved because I spend half the year cruising.

 

I haven't noticed anyone complaining of marina moorers, that never use the canal, paying a licence fee for others privilege, and a connection fee. And your mooring fee is a personal choice to have. 

 

 

Edited March 7, 2023 by Higgs