What boat do you need?

[jonk]

There are two extremes in the use of narrowboats - Full Time Moored and Full Time Cruising. Most people lie somewhere between, 6 months moored and 6 months cruising for example.

From what I have experienced and read, the conclusions that I have reached for the best narrowboat in the above cases are as follows. (No doubt some will disagree with some of my conclusions but it is my personal opinion that I set forth.)

I see that the two extremes mentioned above require different types of narrowboats, so I put both cases alongside each other, you have decide which is better suited for your own case.

In most cases there are very adequate alternatives to what I have stated but I put my personal preference.

 

The Hull:

Length - 45ft - 57ft cruising, 'as long as possible - up to 72ft' moored.

Engine - Beta

Gearbox - PRM

Prop - Axiom is nice but expensive so Crowther in general

Aquadrive or equivalent - good to have but not essential

Bowthruster - opinions vary on this - I would say nice to have but not essential

Stern - Cruiser for cruising and Trad for moored (semi-trad only if you want to use it as a 'pen' for kids or pets.)

Windows - rectangular for living area(s) and portholes for other areas, all preferably double glazed

Side hatches - useful in all cases

Steel - generally 10/6/4 and that is perfectly adequate if built properly

Hull coating – ‘Zinga’ Zinc coating is ideal but traditional coatings are fine

Insulation – spray foam

Galvanic Isolator if any mains power will be used at any time

Silencer – ‘hospital’ type if diesel noise bothers you

 

Layout:

Front bedroom and rear lounge for a cruiser, rear bedroom and front lounge for a trad

Bathroom to have a glass door separate shower and should be between the bedroom and other makeup bed area (if any)

Toilet - opinions vary but I would opt for both – pump-out for general use and cassette for back-up and for areas where there is a problem with pump-out facilities. The use of facilities in pubs and/or supermarkets while cruising, or moored, is highly recommended.

Access to the boat from outside is best via the rear for a cruiser and front for a trad

 

Heating:

Solid multi-fuel fire (Morso) plus central heating by radiators heated by Calorifier and/or gas (oil fired central heating is generally not recommended)

The fire should be as near the centre of the boat as possible and preferably have the chimney on the port side of the boat.

Water heated by Calorifier plus gas if cruising, mains immersion heater if moored (probably in the Calorifier). Possibly also radiator(s) from back-boiler on the fire.

 

Cooking:

Gas hob and oven when cruising, same for moored (or perhaps mains equipment).

Small Microwave - run off an inverter when cruising, mains if moored.

Gas kettle cruising, mains if moored. Top-of-fire kettle possible in some cases, as an extra source of hot water.

Refrigerator - as large as possible – 12v cruising (don’t think that gas powered are now available), mains if moored.

An extractor over the cooking area is useful.

 

Bed

Most people find the normal 4ft width adequate but alternatives such as ‘cross’ beds or ‘fold out flaps’ can be used if required, but watch where any join falls if you opt for a sectional bed!

 

Flooring

This depends upon the use – are there dogs aboard etc. Normally a ‘wood’ floor in the working areas and carpets in the bedroom and lounge are acceptable. Tiles are too cold. Laminate is good, but not for a wet area such as a bathroom - cork could be a good option.

 

Cratch and cover

Not essential but provides good, quiet, sheltered seating in sun or rain when cruising and acts as an ‘entrance porch’ for trad boats.

 

Pram hood

This rear cover is either loved or hated it would seem! If cruising in winter it provides shelter and warmth, and allows for wet items to be taken off before entry to the boat. For a trad it probably isn’t necessary since the tiller man stands ‘inside’ the boat.

 

 

Lighting

12v LEDS are becoming a good choice and are available in ‘warm’ colours now - but this a very personal decision. I would just say have as many lights as possible – you can always turn them off!

Headlight for tunnels.

 

Batteries etc.

A separate starter battery is almost essential. In addition I would want probably 4 more and an inverter (proper sine wave) to run a small microwave, laptop etc.

A generator is only required if the boat needs mains type power when cruising, and the engine cannot provide sufficient.

 

Tanks

One or two diesel tanks at the rear. Two if you use diesel for heating/cooking purposes can make life easier but is not essential.

Bulk clean water tank at the front – inbuilt.

Potable water tank, fitted where convenient, made of Stainless steel and easily accessible for cleaning. Not essential but can be very useful should the main tank get fouled in any way.

 

Ropes

I would have three good quality ropes attached plus a couple of spares inside. The front rope would be too short to reach the prop should it fall in the water. The rear would be the same length. There would also be a centre rope accessible to both sides of the boat, this length would be about half the length of the other two.

 

Anchor

A Danforth anchor of sufficient size should be available for emergency use – make sure the end of the rope is attached to the boat!

 

Emergency equipment

Gas detector, smoke detector, fire blankets, extinguishers, First Aid box and so on.

 

The above is not comprehensive but I hope that it is of help, or at least interest, to someone!

 

John

Edited July 22, 2010 by jonk

[stewey]

There are two extremes in the use of narrowboats - Full Time Moored and Full Time Cruising. Most people lie somewhere between, 6 months moored and 6 months cruising for example.

From what I have experienced and read, the conclusions that I have reached for the best narrowboat in the above cases are as follows. (No doubt some will disagree with some of my conclusions but it is my personal opinion that I set forth.)

I see that the two extremes mentioned above require different types of narrowboats, so I put both cases alongside each other, you have decide which is better suited for your own case.

In most cases there are very adequate alternatives to what I have stated but I put my personal preference.

 

The Hull:

Length - 45ft - 57ft cruising, 'as long as possible - up to 72ft' moored.

Engine - Beta

Gearbox - PRM

Prop - Axiom is nice but expensive so Crowther in general

Aquadrive or equivalent - good to have but not essential

Bowthruster - opinions vary on this - I would say nice to have but not essential

Stern - Cruiser for cruising and Trad for moored (semi-trad only if you want to use it as a 'pen' for kids or pets.)

Windows - rectangular for living area(s) and portholes for other areas, all preferably double glazed

Side hatches - useful in all cases

Steel - generally 10/8/6 and that is perfectly adequate if built properly

Hull coating – 'Zinga' Zinc coating is ideal but traditional coatings are fine

Insulation – spray foam

Anodes if any mains power will be used at any time

Silencer – 'hospital' type if diesel noise bothers you

 

Layout:

Front bedroom and rear lounge for a cruiser, rear bedroom and front lounge for a trad

Bathroom to have a glass door separate shower and should be between the bedroom and other makeup bed area (if any)

Toilet - opinions vary but I would opt for both – pump-out for general use and cassette for back-up and for areas where there is a problem with pump-out facilities. The use of facilities in pubs and/or supermarkets while cruising, or moored, is highly recommended.

Access to the boat from outside is best via the rear for a cruiser and front for a trad

 

Heating:

Solid multi-fuel fire (Morso) plus central heating by radiators heated by Calorifier and gas (oil fired central heating is generally not recommended)

The fire should be as near the centre of the boat as possible and preferably have the chimney on the port side of the boat.

Water heated by Calorifier plus gas if cruising, mains immersion heater if moored (probably in the Calorifier). Possibly also radiator(s) from back-boiler on the fire.

 

Cooking:

Gas hob and oven when cruising, same for moored (or perhaps mains equipment).

Small Microwave - run off an inverter when cruising, mains if moored.

Gas kettle cruising, mains if moored. Top-of-fire kettle possible in some cases, as an extra source of hot water.

Refrigerator - as large as possible – 12v cruising (don't think that gas powered are now available), mains if moored.

An extractor over the cooking area is useful.

 

Bed

Most people find the normal 4ft width adequate but alternatives such as 'cross' beds or 'fold out flaps' can be used if required, but watch where any join falls if you opt for a sectional bed!

 

Flooring

This depends upon the use – are there dogs aboard etc. Normally a 'wood' floor in the working areas and carpets in the bedroom and lounge are acceptable. Tiles are too cold. Laminate is good, but not for a wet area such as a bathroom - cork could be a good option.

 

Cratch and cover

Not essential but provides good, quiet, sheltered seating in sun or rain when cruising and acts as an 'entrance porch' for trad boats.

 

Pram hood

This rear cover is either loved or hated it would seem! If cruising in winter it provides shelter and warmth, and allows for wet items to be taken off before entry to the boat. For a trad it probably isn't necessary since the tiller man stands 'inside' the boat.

 

 

Lighting

12v LEDS are becoming a good choice and are available in 'warm' colours now - but this a very personal decision. I would just say have as many lights as possible – you can always turn them off!

Headlight for tunnels.

 

Batteries etc.

A separate starter battery is almost essential. In addition I would want probably 4 more and an inverter (proper sine wave) to run a small microwave, laptop etc.

A generator is only required if the boat needs mains type power when cruising, and the engine cannot provide sufficient.

 

Tanks

One or two diesel tanks at the rear. Two if you use diesel for heating/cooking purposes can make life easier but is not essential.

Bulk clean water tank at the front – inbuilt.

Potable water tank, fitted where convenient, made of Stainless steel and easily accessible for cleaning. Not essential but can be very useful should the main tank get fouled in any way.

 

Ropes

I would have three good quality ropes attached plus a couple of spares inside. The front rope would be too short to reach the prop should it fall in the water. The rear would be the same length. There would also be a centre rope accessible to both sides of the boat, this length would be about half the length of the other two.

 

Anchor

A Danforth anchor of sufficient size should be available for emergency use – make sure the end of the rope is attached to the boat!

 

Emergency equipment

Gas detector, smoke detector, fire blankets, extinguishers, First Aid box and so on.

 

The above is not comprehensive but I hope that it is of help, or at least interest, to someone!

 

John

Interesting post.

 

You should also add uinder "Tanks" one for the pumpout!

 

Have hired cruisers which in one case had the bedroom at the front, lounge at the back and the other bedroom at the back with the lounge at the front. Much preferred the latter as you can sit and look out through the front of the boat.

 

I look forward to reading other posts on this thread!

 

Stewey

[JamesFrance]

I would choose the full length boat for cruising. Trad for when it rains and is cold and so that you are not both permanently together. No bowthruster which you only need in a marina, a full length boat should negotiate any narrow canal bend without help and using the pole occasionally is good exercise for the crew. A tug deck is great for crossing the bow in locks.

 

I think pumpouts are unpleasant to live with and expensive, so would use a cassette which you can easily empty when cruising.

 

If you never move you could be better in a house.

[carlt]

What boat do you need?

 

I need a Nurser motor.

[Naughty Cal]

Im quite happy with Naughty-Cal. Dont want a narrowboat thanks

[Machpoint005]

I would choose the full length boat for cruising. Trad for when it rains and is cold and so that you are not both permanently together. No bowthruster which you only need in a marina, a full length boat should negotiate any narrow canal bend without help and using the pole occasionally is good exercise for the crew. A tug deck is great for crossing the bow in locks.

 

Presume you mean 58ft/60ft, not 'real' full length which is arguably 70ft or 72ft.

I disagree: if there are only two of you, a shorter boat is easier to handle, cheaper to maintain, and fits into smaller moorings - very useful if you're a late arrival at a popular inline spot.

 

I think pumpouts are unpleasant to live with and expensive, so would use a cassette which you can easily empty when cruising.

 

Cassettes can be inconvenient when cruising in areas where facilities are sparse: and it's a pain having to plan your journeys around poo suitcase emptyings. For that reason alone, we are in the process of fitting a macerator and self pumpout. We should then be able to go a bit further between sanitary stops!

 

If you never move you could be better in a house.

Agreed!

[JamesFrance]

Presume you mean 58ft/60ft, not 'real' full length which is arguably 70ft or 72ft.

I disagree: if there are only two of you, a shorter boat is easier to handle, cheaper to maintain, and fits into smaller moorings - very useful if you're a late arrival at a popular inline spot.

 

No I did mean 70ft which is what the narrow system was built for. Once you are in a lock with the bow on the gate the boat will look after itself and a heavy boat will be unaffected by the wind. I agree with you about mooring spaces though as often smaller boats are reluctant to make a space.

[carlt]

I need a wooden Yorkshire Keel.

[alan_fincher]

Stern - Cruiser for cruising and Trad for moored (semi-trad only if you want to use it as a 'pen' for kids or pets.)

Cruiser stern may be fine for cruising in nice weather, but for all year / all weather cruising.

 

Steel - generally 10/8/6 and that is perfectly adequate if built properly

6 mm topsides seems excessive, and will lead to unnecessary instability.

 

Anodes if any mains power will be used at any time

If you think anodes are only needed if you use mains power, you don't understand why they are fitted.

 

Heating:

Solid multi-fuel fire (Morso) plus central heating by radiators heated by Calorifier and gas (oil fired central heating is generally not recommended)

Calorifiers don't normally heat radiators, (although some people do manage to extract some excess engine heat by connecting a second coil to radiators).

Gas fired central heating is incredibly expensive to run, even though the new generation of gas boilers are more efficient than older ones. Would not be a sensible solution for a live-aboard boat.

 

Refrigerator - as large as possible – 12v cruising (don’t think that gas powered are now available), mains if moored.

Gas fridges are still available, though "discouraged" in new builds.

 

Bulk clean water tank at the front – inbuilt.

Potable water tank, fitted where convenient, made of Stainless steel and easily accessible for cleaning. Not essential but can be very useful should the main tank get fouled in any way.

Multiple fresh water tanks for different purposes would be pretty unusual.

[jonk]

Cruiser stern may be fine for cruising in nice weather, but for all year / all weather cruising.

 

 

6 mm topsides seems excessive, and will lead to unnecessary instability.

 

 

If you think anodes are only needed if you use mains power, you don't understand why they are fitted.

 

 

Calorifiers don't normally heat radiators, (although some people do manage to extract some excess engine heat by connecting a second coil to radiators).

Gas fired central heating is incredibly expensive to run, even though the new generation of gas boilers are more efficient than older ones. Would not be a sensible solution for a live-aboard boat.

 

 

Gas fridges are still available, though "discouraged" in new builds.

 

 

Multiple fresh water tanks for different purposes would be pretty unusual.

 

Thanks for these comments!

Should be 10/6/4 - thanks, don't know where I got 10/8/6 from

Cruiser stern with Pram Hood for all year cruising is my recommendation.

Did I mean Galvanic isolator?

Gas is expensive but from all the posts and my research it is the most efficient and reliable way to go, Alde is constantly mentioned as being very good. There are endless complaints about oil-fired systems. Solid fuel and backburner is OK but relies on the fire being lit all the time, I prefer multiple systems to cover a breakdown in one system and this is often emphasised in posts.

Multiple fresh water tanks are not common but bottles of water are, to me it makes more sense to have a small tank placed in a convenient place rather than have big bottles of water getting in the way and having to be decanted. Of course most people are happy with the water from the main tank, but I still would go for multiple systems.

Thanks again,

John

Edited July 22, 2010 by jonk

[alan_fincher]

Of course most people are happy with the water from the main tank, but I still would go for multiple systems.

Would you also have duplicate pumps, pipework, and taps ?

 

I still maintain that unless you are rich an Alde is only a heating option for the occasional boater, not a full time live-aboard.

[Naughty Cal]

Thanks for these comments!

Should be 10/6/4 - thanks, don't know where I got 10/8/6 from

Cruiser stern with Pram Hood for all year cruising is my recommendation.

Did I mean Galvanic isolator?

Gas is expensive but from all the posts and my research it is the most efficient and reliable way to go, Alde is constantly mentioned as being very good. There are endless complaints about oil-fired systems. Solid fuel and backburner is OK but relies on the fire being lit all the time, I prefer multiple systems to cover a breakdown in one system and this is often emphasised in posts.

Multiple fresh water tanks are not common but bottles of water are, to me it makes more sense to have a small tank placed in a convenient place rather than have big bottles of water getting in the way and having to be decanted. Of course most people are happy with the water from the main tank, but I still would go for multiple systems.

Thanks again,

John

 

Why would water in the main tank be any different to water in the second tank. Surely it will be filled from the same source.

[ymu]

Don't agree that a shorter boat is necessarily better for cruising - if you're living aboard, the extra space all the time might be a great deal more valuable than the ability to take in an extra handful of canals occasionally. I'd rather have the extra living/working space and be able to have the nephews and niecelets to stay and hire/boat-swap if we want to do the short-boat canals at some point.

 

Refrigerator should be as small as possible for cruising, IMO - unless it's gas powered. If you're a liveaboard, you're not going to be racing down the canal every day and burning diesel just to make electricity is expensive! Our new boat was on shore power for a couple of decades and was refitted by someone who'd never really cruised and it shows - huge TV, extra large freezer compartment in the fridge, 240v lighting, tiny water-tank...

Edited July 22, 2010 by ymu

[Lady Muck]

A genny is a must for me - don't use it THAT often but it provides a power back up for when we can't use the engine (for instance when we were away one year and needed to get the alternator on the engine fixed). I like to have more than one way to charge the batteries/heat hot water etc.

 

Another must for us is an extra cabin that can be used as a study /double bedroom/sulking 'ole (my dads terminology LOL). For this reason we prefer our saloon/back cabin furniture to not be fitted - so we can change things around. We have thick floor cushions stored under the gunwhales in the coridoor and a double futon and two single futons in the front (no frame, just stacked to make a couch). This means we can have three doubles or a double and four single berths on the boat if needs be. I do have a desk but it can be folded flat, as do most of my chairs, saloon table and stools. My saloon table can be opened out to make a dining table for six people! For this reason all of the boat builder/off the shelf new boats just wouldn't work for us - we were lucky to find this owner fit out which is spot-on!

 

I agree about the pram hood - I hate the way they look but would've killed for one when I was on the L&L in all that rain last summer. I agree about stern types too - my nieces and nephews are small and we have a dog - the semi trad keeps them all coralled in a safe space!

[ymu]

Another must for us is an extra cabin that can be used as a study /double bedroom/sulking 'ole (my dads terminology LOL). For this reason we prefer our saloon/back cabin furniture to not be fitted - so we can change things around.

Why the back cabin? OK, it's not such a good sulking 'ole if it's next to the kitchen/living room - but it can then also be used as a dining room (with a double-drop-leaf table and stacking stools to allow for other uses). My dream layout is kitchen/living room - dining room/study/second bedroom - bathroom - main bedroom. I'd also have a foldback bulkhead between kitchen and spare room so it can be open or closed depending on use. And no corridors!

 

We avoid fitted furniture as much as possible. Dinettes make uncomfortable tables, uncomfortable sofas and uncomfortable beds - hate them with a passion. Plus with too much fitted you can end up turning the entire boat into a corridor. We stayed on one where there were no passing points - we either had to carousel near the front door, or one of us would have to dive into the bathroom/onto a bed. Nightmare! We have a fitted bed at the moment because that's what the boat had when we bought it, but a futon-style bed makes for a much more spacious feel in the bedroom and gives you head-room for over-bed storage which is much easier to access than underbed storage. Plus you can have a full width bed without making it hard to get past it.

[Lady Muck]

Why the back cabin? OK, it's not such a good sulking 'ole if it's next to the kitchen/living room - but it can then also be used as a dining room (with a double-drop-leaf table and stacking stools to allow for other uses). My dream layout is kitchen/living room - dining room/study/second bedroom - bathroom - main bedroom. I'd also have a foldback bulkhead between kitchen and spare room so it can be open or closed depending on use. And no corridors!

 

If it was next to the Galley/Saloon it doesn't make as quiet a bedroom, you have to put up with me walking through there to take the dog out at 7. So I like where it is.

[ymu]

If it was next to the Galley/Saloon it doesn't make as quiet a bedroom, you have to put up with me walking through there to take the dog out at 7. So I like where it is.

Fair 'nuff. I rarely sleep at night, so it's better for my partner if our bed is as far away as possible from my night-time potterings. If we have guests, I drink myself into a coma to negate the issue.

 

Just another one of those "which compromise suits me best" things. There is no rigid formula that would suit everyone.

[deletedaccount]

A second bedroom is a must for me, given that lil deletedaccount stays 5 nights out of 14.

 

It's funny, but people always assume boats are for singles and couples and nobody else.

 

I'd add a massive water tank is essential for cruising, along with a big hot water tank if there's more than one of you. A backup genny is also ness, as is having more than one heating source. Just having diesel ch won't cut it on the cut.

 

Oh, and one last thing. I couldn't live without a dining table, although it's not just for dining. No dinette though, they annoy me no end.

[Mrs Tawny Owl]

Cruiser stern may be fine for cruising in nice weather, but for all year / all weather cruising.

 

If you think anodes are only needed if you use mains power, you don't understand why they are fitted.

 

What's wrong with a cruiser stern whatever the weather. Even with a trad most of you is still out in the weather. At least you can have some company in the rain so it's not such a lonely existance

I like company, so have never really understood tha attraction of trad or semi trad sterns, and this view is borne out by the fact that if there are loads of people on our boat, they are often all at the stern being sociable with the steerer.

 

I think he said gavlanic isolator for mains power, rather than anodes, which I believe is right, having no 240V or mains hook up I don't really know. We have decided not to have anodes anyway. Just seemed to cause trouble by coming loose and collecting floating rubbish. When we looked last time the baot was out they were only having an affect about 8 - 10 feet down the boat. As she's 70ft long most wasn't protected anyway, we'll just hope regular blacking does the trick!

 

BTW I agree there's nothing wrong with cruising in a 70ft boat on most canals. I like the feeling of handling a big boat, especially manouvering her well. And as she is a toy boat for holidays and days out with friends there's lots of room to socialise, or get just a bit away from each other

 

Sue

[deletedaccount]

I stick a halogen heater on the back of my cruiser during the winter and run it off the travelpower.

 

[Naughty Cal]

I stick a halogen heater on the back of my cruiser during the winter and run it off the travelpower.

 

 

I just turn the diesel heating on

[Chris-B]

Cabin range is already lit to provide,warmth and Tea

[JamesFrance]

If you shut the cabin doors and put up an umbrella, you can have warm and dry feet when steering a trad in the winter, which is a lot of the year in Britain. The warmth from the motor is very welcome then.

[jonk]

Would you also have duplicate pumps, pipework, and taps ?

 

I still maintain that unless you are rich an Alde is only a heating option for the occasional boater, not a full time live-aboard.

 

No - the drinking water would be by separate pump and tap, or gravity fed, or just a tap from the tank depending upon the position of the tank.

True about the cost of gas but the other option for 12 month liveaboard on a mooring with power would be backboiler, plus mains connection for immersion heater and perhaps mains powered heating as well. For cruising many boats don't even HAVE radiators, so for some the wood/anthracite fire is enough, but I would prefer the luxury of additional heat when required and gas would appear to be the best way of getting it.

 

Thanks again

John

[deletedaccount]

I've got engine hot water and diesel c/h heating hot water for backup. Stove cabin heat with diesel ch for backup.

 

gas ch is expensive to run by all accounts.