Hooked after a week, what next????

[Jo and Paul]

Hi all,

 

I know I should probably post in the introductions section, I will get around to that I promise.

 

Just got back from a weeks rental, went from middlewich to manchester, back to barbridge junction then back to middlewich again. Middle of winter on a traditional style boat, snow and all but I... err i mean we loved it. I think we may rent in the summer to make sure the crowds that are supposed to be around in the high season dont put us off but I still think we will be buying one of these beauties in the near future.

 

I have looked all over this site (great one btw) but can find any idiot guides to buying a boat. Dont think we are quite in the market to buy new, have heard about a boat survey (sounds like a must) but dont know where to go to get one done. Bought a couple of mags whilst we were out and even looked at a boat at one of the marinas we came across (took loads of willpower not to pull the checkbook out and offer a downpayment there and then, before going to the bank manager to grovel for the rest )

 

 

Any help, advice, warnings etc that any of you ever so friendly seeming people could offer woul be much appreciated.

 

In turn, I will offer any help I can wherever I can (I am a trained aircraft electrician, so any of you with fast boats....) or if not will insult, condemn, shootdown, agree or disagree, or just contribute to any discussions that I caome across until such time as I am told to butt out

 

Looking forward to becaming part of the community that has grown here, and eventually out on the waterways.

 

Cheers

 

Paul.... and Jo

[Amicus]

Nice post.

Welcome, y'all two.

[DHutch]

Welcome PAUL (and Jo)

- I dont know much about buying boats, but this is certainly place to ask!

 

Daniel (the weirdo with a steam boat)

[bottle]

(I am a trained aircraft electrician, so any of you with fast boats....) 

 

Paul.... and Jo

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

 

Welcome

 

Here is your first warning watch out for Maffi, he plays with 'planes as well

Edited February 27, 2005 by bottle

[Guest st170dw]

Welcome,

 

Fast boats may be a problem but I am sure you can reduce your knowledge from 400 mph+ to 4 mph and still be ahead.

 

Dave

[maffi mushkila]

Welcome

Here is your first warning watch out for Maffi, he plays with 'planes as well

 

I am pierced through the heart with that ungrounded remark.

 

You have flabbered my ghast.

 

I'm of to sulk.

[maffi mushkila]

Hi you guys

 

Welcome to the Canal World Forum

 

You missed the "Buying a boat" bit

 

http://www.canalworld.net/forums/index.php?showtopic=30

 

Take no notice of Bottle he's just jealous coz hes is paying my fat service pension cheque out of his taxes

Edited February 27, 2005 by maffi mushkila

[Jo and Paul]

Thanks for all your kind words, looks like I will fit in here nicely, and maffi, thanks for digging that out for me, I spent most of last night cruising these forums so dont know how I missed it. Must have gotten bogged down cracking up at all the banter that seems to go on round here.

 

I look forward to taknig part in the next round of snideness (is that really a word, i dunno ) once i fuigure out which raw nerves to jump on

 

Talk to you all soon,

 

J&P

[NB Willawaw]

The canals are very addictive.

 

Driving these days, with the advent and widespread use of motorways, has become very predictable and regulated. Most motorways avoid interesting scenery and are just designed to get people from A to B as fast as possble (don't start on about the traffic jams).

 

However, canals are the complete opposite. Every day something different happens on a cruise and even if you cover the same stretch each day, the passage is marked by a different event; different boats seen, different anglers remonstrated with, a wide and varied range of objects cleared from the prop, different lock gates jammed, etc only joking.

 

Seriously though, canals are the opposite of most things we do today in so-called modern living. The speed forces us to take time to speak to people and they are not built for profit or efficiency (not by 21st century rules anyway) - this is why I think they appeal so much.

[Amicus]

Hi Paul and Jo, couple of sites you might enjoy.

http://www.snecklifter.com/index.htm

http://www.nblibertybelle.co.uk/index.html

cheersandgone

[Paul Evans]

The best bit of advice I can offer is don't jump at the first boat you see and fancy. If you are looking to buy a used boat, look at as many as you can. Layouts, fit outs, styles vary enormously. If you can wait a little while, hire another 2 or 3 times from different hire companies to give you a broader view of what can be done. Stalk the canals and have the bare faced cheek to talk to other boaters. If they know you are really interested, they will certainly tell you about their pride and joy and may offer a guided tour.

 

Try this link to Waterways Directory. There is a list of brokers many of whom have websites with details of boats for sale. This will give you an idea of what is out there and what sort of price you can expect to pay. But remember - nothing beats personal inspection!

 

Finally, when you have found the boat of your dreams - pay a refundable deposit subject to survey and find a surveyor. You will find some listed in Waterways Directory and others advertise in the waterways press. You will have to pay the docking and survey fees but that is better than finding out that the boat is the boat of your nightmares. If you can, ask the seller to get a new Boat Safety Certificate, particularly if the current one is close to its expiry date.

 

Good luck and welcome to the pocket draining world of narrowboats.

[John Orentas]

As you seem to be a practical hands on type, don't forget there are many ways of getting a boat, you could opt for a new one and do some /all of the fitting out or even more for yourself and save a lot of money.

 

As Paul says, make a nuisance of yourself with boat owners, if they sense that you are genuinely interested they won't mind a bit. (most of them anyway)

Edited February 27, 2005 by John Orentas

[Jo and Paul]

As you seem to be a practical hands on type, don't forget there are many ways of getting a boat, you could opt for a new one and do some /all of the fitting out or even more for yourself and save a lot of money.

 

Hmmm got me a thinking there, seen the 'sailaway' boats for sale, I presume it is as the name states, a sailable shell of a boat??? I can t believe the price difference.

 

Surely the parts required for a fit-out must be very expensive as it seems to be the more expensive part of the boat from what I have seen so far.

 

Quick question, I can see the sources for all the bits needed, but not the actual urm cabinets, panelling and interior 'walls' Are they some special type of marine sort or would a normal timber merchant be sufficient for sourcing materials to fit out the internals of a boat???

[DHutch]

Hmmm got me a thinking there, seen the 'sailaway' boats for sale, I presume it is as the name states, a sailable shell of a boat??? I can t believe the price difference.

 

Yes, a basic "sail-away" is the bear-minimum that is required for the boat to move under its own power. Its a tax dodging thing.

 

- But you can get almost any leval of completion, a sailway, with the floor down, floor and sprayfoam, floor, sides and roof pannels in, etc etc.

 

daniel

[NB Willawaw]

Hmmm got me a thinking there, seen the 'sailaway' boats for sale, I presume it is as the name states, a sailable shell of a boat??? I can t believe the price difference.

 

Surely the parts required for a fit-out must be very expensive as it seems to be the more expensive part of the boat from what I have seen so far.

 

Quick question, I can see the sources for all the bits needed, but not the actual urm cabinets, panelling and interior 'walls'  Are they some special type of marine sort or would a normal timber merchant be sufficient for sourcing materials to fit out the internals of a boat???

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

After the hull, a large part of the value of the boat is labour. Many people buy a sailaway, which means that the boat is actually usable ( a bit like camping in a boat). You can then sail the boat back to your mooring or fitting-out base and then add lining, bulkheads and all the equipment.

 

As my boating colleague mentioned, you can buy them at different stages of fit-out. For example, you can buy the boat already lined out.

 

Have at look at the threads of Stuart who has bought his own sailaway (NB Dusk to Dawn) from Liverpool Boats and is doing a great job of fitting her out in the B'ham area

[John Orentas]

Jo & Paul

 

Not so poular for some reason these days, but you can go the whole hog and buy a mountain of bits and pieces including a big black intimidating shell and an engine and put them all together.

 

As has been said the interior cabin components are invariably hand made and fitted, very labour intensive hence the high costs, don't forget the ballasting, flooring, electrics, lighting, plumbing, upholstery........ it goes on forever, but If you do not mind 3 or 4 years of unremitting toil it could be for you.

[steveh]

Mr Dhutch mentioned something about taxing dodging sailaways. Can someone explain a little more please

 

Cheers

[Jon]

I would ask that this doesn't repeat the whole VAT thread again, and again, and again!

 

Steve, have a look at http://www.canalworld.net/forums/index.php?showtopic=541 and ask any questions in there.

 

Cheers

 

Jon

[dor]

"Mr Dhutch mentioned something about taxing dodging sailaways. Can someone explain a little more please"

 

As far as I am aware, there is no tax dodge in buying a sailaway, nor to the best of my knowledge has there been (at least not for sometime.)

 

I don't think sailaway came into it as far as the VAT thing was concerned.

 

You could save some vat if you found a supplier of bits tat wasn't vat registered, but that is unlikely.

[David Schweizer]

Mr Dhutch mentioned something about taxing dodging sailaways. Can someone explain a little more please

 

Cheers

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

As far as I understand it there has been a recent definitive ruling on VAT for liveaboard boats. in brief the only boats that are excempt from VAT are Houseboats which have no engine and no practial means of being moved. That seems to rule out almost every boat.

[Jon]

Sorry guys, we're drifting a little again as usual!

 

Please use the VAT thread as stated above for any VAT related discussion. It keeps everything in one place and makes it much easier to search and moderate.

 

Many thanks

 

Jon

[Sam]

Maybe you should go on another holiday before jumping in and buying your own boat - what if you found after a while cruising you dont want to or can't carry on with cruising?

 

In my opinion i would try boating in another part of the country and see how you get on!

[Jo and Paul]

Thanks for all your opinions, both on and off topic

 

After some initial research I/we have decided to put off the buying of a boat till this time next year and go on a few more holidays this summer to see if the crowded waterways that we hve heard of deter or encourage us.

 

We also need to decide on exactly what type/style of boat we need so will carry on researching for the next 12 months or so.

 

Still undecided as to weather to go for second hand, new fully fitted or sailaway. Think a build from hull is a little ambitious for me/us but you never know.

 

Thanks again to all, talk to you all soon,

 

Paul & Jo

[Sam]

I think that is a good idea Well done with your decision

[DHutch]

Yeah, theres no point rushing into it, becuase your'l only end up building "the wrong boat"

 

- Use diffrencte hire companys, and try and work out what you do/dont like about there boats.

- But keep in touch here, then you learn form our mistakes as well!

 

daneil