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original number for butty needed


Steve kitchen
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hi guys, my name is Steve, in the late seventy`s I had three years on hire to British waterways on the grand union and it made a major impact on me and all these years later iv`e bought a 55 foot 70`s built butty? oh dear!! I here you say well this is where I need help ,I want to try to trace its original number iv`e got more information if anyone is interested. thanks Steve.

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hi Pete, your an absolute gem that's just confirmed the number I got from the guy on the day trip boats at stoke Bruene (witch is where I was based in the 70`s) I'm converting the butty into motor boat but that's another long story, but if there's any more information to there whereabouts after Willow Wren would be greatly appreciated, by the way I bought the boat from off the river soar at barrow upon soar, and the other thing was they made by willow wren.thanks

ROSE OF BRECON's hull was certainly built by Hancock & Lane, Daventry and I am pretty sure ABERGAVENNY CASTLE's was as well. Both hulls had wooden cabins built by 'Willow Wren', Rugby and I have the build date of both boats as 1975 and originally named ROSE and CASTLE - but this caused confusion with their full length hotel pair of the same names. 'Willow Wren' sold ROSE OF BRECON and ABERGAVENNY CASTLE in 1984, but they continued to operated as hotel boats for at least another 14 years.

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Steve ....hiya matey.

........you're going to have to give us a lot more information than that, plus what do you mean by original number? It will only have had a Commercial or Fleet number or Reg at ..... No. if it's an original heritage boat accepted into the Inland Waterways & Docks Executive ( subsequently BWB) after Nationalisation in the late 40s or BWB in 60s.

 

If it is as you say it was built 70s then it will have been given a BWB number for licencing purposes which is the current number it should be displaying unless it's spent years on the bank or off C&RT waters like The Thames.

Have you photos, builder etc. ?????

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very well done Pete, Abergavenny still supports wooden cabins today and i'm torn into whether I should leave or to replace with steel, but anyway that's my problem. the hull is still in good order but I am replacing the thin quarter plate bottom with 10 mill plate, i'm leaving the butty style stern to keep the character of the boat after all that's why I bought her, i'v also created a ten foot swim.so thanks a lot my friend that's got me a helover good start

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very well done Pete, Abergavenny still supports wooden cabins today and i'm torn into whether I should leave or to replace with steel, but anyway that's my problem. the hull is still in good order but I am replacing the thin quarter plate bottom with 10 mill plate, i'm leaving the butty style stern to keep the character of the boat after all that's why I bought her, i'v also created a ten foot swim.so thanks a lot my friend that's got me a helover good start

You can skin wooden cabins in steel, if done carefully it can give you the best of both- a weathertight steel outer, with a beautiful wooden interior.

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I ran Rose of Brecon and Abergavenny Castle for a season on the Mon and Brec in 1993 the final season that Chris and Andy Newman owned them.

Looking through some photos there doesn't seem to be an index plate on the butty but the motor's number is 64911.

There used to be metal guards over the handrails on the front of the boats to protect against the very low Ashford tunnel - don't know if they are still screwed on?

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This thread was moved yesterday evening from the 'New to Boating?' section, the original thread being titled 'Are you new to boating?? CLICK HERE' - the relevant posts being 1543 to 1551 inclusive. Post number 1 in this thread was previously post number 1543 and post number 2 in this thread was post number 1549 (I think). The post numbers in the other thread have now all moved up one number and the whole thing has become a little disjointed.

 

http://www.canalworld.net/forums/index.php?showtopic=428

 

For those who are interested there is additional information in the previous thread as not all of the related posts were moved, including the number that was requested for ABERGAVENNY CASTLE captain.gif

Edited by pete harrison
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This thread was moved yesterday evening from the 'New to Boating?' section, the original thread being titled 'Are you new to boating?? CLICK HERE' - the relevant posts being 1543 to 1551 inclusive.

 

http://www.canalworld.net/forums/index.php?showtopic=428

 

For those who are interested there is additional information in the previous thread as not all of the related posts were moved, including the number for ABERGAVENNY CASTLE captain.gif

 

As has been said, welcome back Pete, hope you're staying on again, as I've always been very interested in what your endless documentation and your incredible memory could add to all sorts of questions on the forum especially about the historic topics.

 

Peter.

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hi emm, I've had great feedback from the forum its really brought my boat alive but what would make it better would be to see pictures of the pair as they were so I can draw some inspiration, ( this is not something I could do) but i'm sure you would be good at - now if that's not creeping I don't know what is? kitchmekanic@aol.com many thanks steve

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hi pete, you have done it again I've just blown that picture up to A4 and WOW i'm really excited now, I know it's not a historic boat but it's still a old working boat and for that reason I will keep it externally the way it was, so if any body's got a side view of the boat so I can get the format +design I would be grateful thanks

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hi guys, I've had some good pictures sent to me of the Rose of Brecon towing Abergavenny-Castle and there's several others, I will post one as she was and one as she is now but its not something I can do, it just ties the head into a knot, but with the help of my son-in-law we will have it done bare with me - thanks

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This is why I have a soft spot for 1970's Willow Wren built pleasure boats. I operated this pair from 1979 to 1985, motor built in 1976 (hull by Hancock and Lane) and butty built in 1972 (hull by John Pinder / Hopwood Craft). Interestingly beneath the back deck of the butty was a conventional butty's hatches arrangement, but if this set up had been used the steerer would not have been able to see over the cabin. On the motor the engine was beneath the steerers feet with a back cabin in front, simlilar to a 'Severner'.

 

post-7931-0-72779700-1450390389_thumb.jpg

 

post-7931-0-19452700-1450389638_thumb.jpg

 

These photographs are from 1984 and the girl steering became my wife a year later.

Edited by pete harrison
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There must be something about modern built butties. 'Ash' has the same issue with the hatches. I'm 6ft 3 and steering I can't see over the cabin top. For a design which hasn't really evolved I'm intrigued as to why builders get this most crucial aspect wrong.

Dan

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There must be something about modern built butties. 'Ash' has the same issue with the hatches. I'm 6ft 3 and steering I can't see over the cabin top. For a design which hasn't really evolved I'm intrigued as to why builders get this most crucial aspect wrong.

Dan

Because modern butty cabins are much taller than their working boat antecedants.

 

My father owned the motorised butty Leam in the 70s. That retained part of the original back cabin, but with a higher full length conversion cabin forward of that. At the time of the conversion the back cabin had been shortened and a raised deck provided - higher than the original (which remained below) but below the gunwales. And presumably for the same reason.

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Because modern butty cabins are much taller than their working boat antecedants.

 

 

My father owned the motorised butty Leam in the 70s. That retained part of the original back cabin, but with a higher full length conversion cabin forward of that. At the time of the conversion the back cabin had been shortened and a raised deck provided - higher than the original (which remained below) but below the gunwales. And presumably for the same reason.

Our butty cabin is the correct height but the hatches floor is too low by at least 6 inches. The accommodation cabin is higher but no higher than a top plank would be.

Dan

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  • 2 weeks later...

hi guys I've not abandoned the forum we are struggling to post pictures, we can not shrink the pictures enough to get on, so we are getting advice tomorrow, but to continue, the cabin on Abergavenny castle at the stern is also tall I'm 6-ft-2 and although I can see it would be quite daunting for the wife at 5-ft-4 perhaps its something I should address or just get her a box to stand on

  • Greenie 1
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hi guys, I've not abandoned the forum I'm struggling to post pictures we can not shrink the pictures enough to get on, so we are getting advice tomorrow but to continue , the cabin on Abergavenny castle at the stern is also quite tall I'm 6-ft-2 and although I can see over, it would be quite daunting for the wife at 5-ft-4 perhaps its something I should address or just get her a box to stand on!!

 

 

 

 

Just upload the pictures to photo bucket or similar. Then put the link into the text as you type on the forum and the photo appears when you click on "post"

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