My boat has sunk in Kingston (1939 ww2 wooden motor cruiser)

[RLWP]

Thanks guys! I actually need a water tank for the boat anyway... Do you think this one is too big?!

 

http://www.tanks-direct.co.uk/1000_litre_water_tanks

 

Is 1000l a bit over the top for a live aboard boat? I can't get my head around it?

 

Marcus

X

 

Much too big. You'd have to mount it somewhere on the centre line of the boat, towards the middle. If you put it anywhere else, Fairstar is going to list from side to side as you fill or empty it

 

Richard

[p6rob]

Is anyone willing to volunteer the use of a substantial pump? Also a work boat to be the base for pumps generators and compressors, Marcus has the loan of some submersible pumps but they are all electric so their use would mean a big generator, can anyone provide the use of a generator of say 10KVA -even better if it's on a boat or pontoon

 

Would several lower output generators be of more use than one honking big one? Not that I have any, just hoping for a positive outcome for Marcus. Presumably they, and the pumps can be hired if necessary.

Although I can't be there in person, I'd donate some money to a hire fund if it would help.

[Arthur Brown]

Marcus, if it doesn't float empty very well it's not going to float with an extra tonne inside it, Maybe find an internal space for a 210 litre tank or similar. Don't be surprised if you have to have one made to fit as timber boats have curves and frames that get in the way of a cuboid tank.

 

Probably a wise thing would be to find places to put 2 cubic metres of foam poly, for use as reserve buoyancy. Both the tank and the buoyancy need to be low to the keel and below the floor and symmetric about the keel line

[keble]

Hey Marcus_ I've been following your story from day one.

Wishing you all the best,rooting for you.

[Arthur Brown]

Current suggestions for the date include 16/17 aug and 23 24 25 august. I have two sets of divers organised either or both could raise the boat til the gunwales are out, after that it's down to pumping. Can anyone offer the use of a big pump or even several big pumps for any of those days please? What we can't borrow Marcus will have to hire. Can anyone offer the use of a work boat? (something that can hold generators compressors and pumps).

[Marcuswarry]

Thank for you all the continued support and enthusiasm, and sorry for my lack of updates recently!

 

Right. The re-float date is Saturday 16th August.

 

By then, my thumb will have largely healed, and the boat will be wrapped in polythene.

 

My friend on the island has a 2.7 generator... And a compressor (if needed)... And I'm working out with friends on the island which boats can be used to come alongside...

 

I have 4 pumps at the moment, that should together shift 400l a minute. When I get a idea of what else is available to borrow on Saturday... Then I'll buy some more if there's a shortfall. I'm aiming for at least 1000l a minute.

 

I'm hugely grateful for any time or items you're able to lend to the operation!!!

 

If you're able to come, then please confirm if you're able to bring pumps, generators, water tanks, inner tubes... And anything else that might be useful.

 

The main thing is pumps! As the strategy in adopting is as suggested by CarlT... Who isn't overly keen on the floatation devise option.

 

I'm on 07879 812 789

 

Marcus

X

[Marcuswarry]

I have a very large Dutch barge confirmed for Saturday 16th, to come alongside... It has a 7 kilowatt generator on it.

 

Going to try and firm up a large widebeam to come the other side now.

 

More updates soon!

 

Mx

[Wanted]

I have a very large Dutch barge confirmed for Saturday 16th, to come alongside... It has a 7 kilowatt generator on it.

 

Going to try and firm up a large widebeam to come the other side now.

 

More updates soon!

 

Mx

Marcus, I will be about on the 16th, I have 2 small lift pumps, will check what size when I get in, I don't thing the'll be big enough but every little helps.

 

Rob

[Marcuswarry]

Brilliant, thanks Rob!

[smileypete]

I'd probably look at booking a trash pump or similar from the local HSS on St Georges Estate, they do deals for online and weekend booking and might even lend you a flat trolley for an hour to bring it to the riverside.

 

If someone can supply a comparable pump nearer the time then I'm sure it's possible to cancel with reasonable notice, but at least you have something decent on the day. If Marcus simply can't afford it I'd be happy to chip in £10 say, maybe a few others would. I'd rather do that than bring a small pump and spend all day finding out there's not quite enough pumping capacity.

 

 

Yes, I didn't voice that we'll. I meant the poly gunnel that Marcus is trying to erect. I think that that is more trouble than worth, and could collapse mid recovery. Would covering the large holes with ply/film not be better?

 

If poss I'd look at bridging the big holes best I could with thick poly and evn battens, then staple over thin poly to help seal around the edges further. Maybe leave about 2-3" of thick poly loose around the edges then stuff/tuck the thin poly over and behind and staple through the thick stuff again to hold it. The poly around the gunnel could then act as insurance but it'd surely be better to have belt and braces.

 

cheers, Pete.

~smpt~

Edited August 9, 2014 by smileypete

[luctor et emergo]

I think it would be better to hire one or two decent big pumps, I too would chip in if necessary.

We have a lot of rain on the way, you don't want to be favving around with a lot of small pumps when the river has a lot of fresh coming down.

[Marcuswarry]

Yes I'm rather worried about the rain too...

 

I think my thames work could be a little hairy later this week.... But a fair sea never made a good sailor... As the saying goes... (Or something like that).

 

I have two big boats lined up to go alongside fairstar now... And will try hard to secure bigger pumps! Hss do one that shifts about 1300 L a minute... I think it's about £70 for the weekend...

 

So kind of you to offer to help towards the cost, but I would not feel right at all accepting that! I'm buy some fizz for the hopeful celebrations on Saturday night though!!!

 

Mx

[Peter X]

Bump! Marcus is not forgotten.

 

I hope Saturday night's rain isn't going to cause the river level to be too high on Saturday, I guess it doesn't vary hugely at Kingston because you're above Teddington Lock and the EA will use that to keep the level within a range. Anyway I imagine that rain falling all over the Thames valley will take varying lengths of time to flow down to you, so the impact on you of one heavy night of rainfall should be spread out over weeks.

 

Although Saturdays are generally an awkward day for me to be away from a computer for long because of my IT support work, it's the afternoon which is the busiest part. So I'm thinking of turning up to assist as best I can for about 10 till 1, with a supply of cakes and biscuits appropriate for the numbers of people you're expecting in the day. How many people would that be? The cakes may well have an emphasis on plums, as my tree has produced a glut this year.

 

As the week goes on and your plans for Saturday unfold, please post to inform us. An occasionally revised cast list along the lines of the BCN Challenge thread might be a good idea? Will one of the boats have a kitchen for the all-important supply of mugs of tea?

[isatis]

I hope all is no worse than it was before the weekend with the weather

[Marcus Warry]

Thanks Peter X, you're a legend. I think it's hard to say regarding numbers.. as some people may pop along for an hour, some maybe for the morning, some maybe all day.. frankly if anyone comes at all, I'll be tickled pink.. as I'm already overawed by all your help and support on this forum!

 

Here's a little update.

 

My thumb wound has given me thinking time, and I've come up with a more cunning way of wrapping her in polythene than my previous method. That is just as well, as apparently some of the polythene I've already fitted has wafted off due to the recent wind & rain. Ho hum.. anyway, it's all a learning curve..

 

I'm heading there tomorrow and will be in and out of the Thames all week until Friday, making sure the hull is secure, and the gunwales are above the water line.

 

HSS do a 3 inch petrol pump with in & out hoses for about £55 for the weekend.. so that's actually quite good I think (it's actually more for an electric pump that shifts 200 L.. which i find rather odd). I'm going to order one of those.. then with the other 4 electric pumps I already have, we should be able to shift about 1,300 L a minute.. does that sound good? I suppose time will tell.. but if you think another 3 inch petrol pump is needed for another £55.. then that will shift another 900 L a minute.. Thoughts pretty please?

 

I know the buoyancy issue has divided opinion a bit on this thread, and I've done a bit more research.. I found this thread particulary helpful in enabling me to get my head around the whole thing - http://www.theanswerbank.co.uk/Science/Question1025799.html

 

In essence, if you don't have time to read that, it made me realise how complicated and potentially hazardous this could be without the right experience or equipment (echoing CarlT's sentiments i feel). The other interesing nougat from this, is that as you go deeper, the same sized container of air has LESS lifting power. I found that interesting, as my initial hunch was that it would have more.. but on reading the thread it makes sense...

 

Anyway, one of the main reasons why it's risky, is that at the bottom, you obviously need to put in more air, due the pressure, to fill the tank.. but as it rises... it expands and could pop the container... alternatively at any point, the container could come loose, as it fly out into the air.. which could also be a bit hazzardous...

 

So, what I've decided though, is to try using some tanks at the water level (or fractionaly below).. where they will be a bit safer and easier to work with, and just using them on the more sunken side, to help level her a bit... maybe on the other side too if needed.. but really - we'll just have this up our sleeve, as the primary goal is to wrap her in polythene and pump like crazy.

 

Again, if anyone else has any pumps to bring to the party, then that would be epic please!

 

We now have two decent sized boats to go along side her... and other handy thing to bring if you are coming would be decent ropes / straps or winches.. as it would be nice to use the other boats, to keep her steady as she (hopefully) rises... is anyone bringing anythign like this, or would I be best sourcing this stuff elsewhere do you think?

 

That's the main update really... what do you reckon? Thanks again for all your amazing help & support!

 

Sorry, the thread has got to over 300 replies! and twisted & turned quite a bit, I suppose in response to Peter's point, it might be handy to know roughly who's coming & when? Although like i say, I'm already over the moon with your help, and seeing you on the day would simply be the cherry on top. My numnber again is 07879 812 789 if you want to get in touch, or happen to be swinging by at any point..

 

Marcus

x

 

P.S. the location again, is 20 metres from the Boaters Inn - Canbury Gardens, Lower Ham Road, Kingston upon Thames, KT2 5AU. It's only about 10 mins walk from Kingston train station too... Mx

Edited August 11, 2014 by Marcus Warry

[RLWP]

 

P.S. the location again, is 20 metres from the Boaters Inn - Canbury Gardens, Lower Ham Road, Kingston upon Thames, KT2 5AU, 2.5 metres down

 

Richard

[Wanted]

Also, if anyone is coming on the 16th and needs a bed, I can sort something down the road in Brentford.

 

Rob

[Marcuswarry]

Quick question.. Given I've for the wrap up the hull... Again.

 

I've got a more robust tarpaulin now too.. As on the more sunken side, there's quite a big for the polythene to cover, so want tree to be more resistance...

 

Tarp on first or polythene first?

 

I'm thinking tarp... But that's partly because it'll be a million times easier to handle and attach (has eylets)... And then the polythene can be wrapped around and around the boat horizons rely to further keep it all in place?! Mx

[Wanted]

My uneducated guess would say the other way, builders plastic first, so it moulds to the profile and then, if you feel it's necessary you can tarp it.

I'm not sure how handy they'll be but I can bring two electric lift pumps which pump about 110L per min each.

 

I'll sling a couple of life jackets in as well if there is a bit o fresh!

[Marcuswarry]

Thanks!

 

Thing is, if the tarp is on the outside... It's not really doing anything much... The reason for wanting the tarp, is so that the polythene has something more rigid to go against... As along te middle, there aren't any railings... So it would just suck in a probably snap...

 

I've also wondered about making a temporary railing along the middle, between bow and stern railings... Using chicken wire...

 

Again, to support the polythene... Good idea? Shit idea? You decide!!

 

Marcus

[Peter X]

Thanks!

 

Thing is, if the tarp is on the outside... It's not really doing anything much... The reason for wanting the tarp, is so that the polythene has something more rigid to go against... As along te middle, there aren't any railings... So it would just suck in a probably snap...

 

I've also wondered about making a temporary railing along the middle, between bow and stern railings... Using chicken wire...

 

Again, to support the polythene... Good idea? Shit idea? You decide!!

 

Marcus

 

I have some chicken wire if it would be useful and someone can collect and transport it in time, and I can see the idea here; it would be good for making a semi-rigid shape of your choice across that gap, with perhaps some wooden frame behind it to give it strength. However you'd have to be careful it didn't have any sharp points sticking outwards to puncture the polythene, so some sort of padding layer between them might be a good idea.

 

As to the tarp question, my guess would be, first you cover up each sizeable hole (doorways, vents, gaps between railings etc.) with ply, chicken wire or something else rigid, and ensure none of that can puncture or tear the plastic. Then you wrap the thin plastic horizontally around the boat, from gunwales to above the water level, not too tightly, in order that it will mould itself to all the little holes when sucked inwards. Then a tarp can be tied over the top to cover any area where there's a worry that the suction might break the thin plastic. I think a tarp on the outside would give protection against this if tied fairly tightly against the boat by its eyelets, because while water can get in under the edges of the tarp, the ropes will stop that becoming a flood, and the strength of the tarp will prevent more water pressing in. But of course all of this is theory from someone who's never raised a sunken boat!

 

Re. "The other interesing nougat from this" from your earlier post (you meant nugget) I had a look at a nougat recipe, never having made it, and thought better of it; looks a bit tricky.

[RLWP]

Thanks!

 

Thing is, if the tarp is on the outside... It's not really doing anything much... The reason for wanting the tarp, is so that the polythene has something more rigid to go against... As along te middle, there aren't any railings... So it would just suck in a probably snap...

 

I've also wondered about making a temporary railing along the middle, between bow and stern railings... Using chicken wire...

 

Again, to support the polythene... Good idea? Shit idea? You decide!!

 

Marcus

 

Good idea - yes. Chicken wire - no

 

Lengths of wood

 

Richard

 

Re. "The other interesing nougat from this" from your earlier post (you meant nugget) I had a look at a nougat recipe, never having made it, and thought better of it; looks a bit tricky.

 

Wuss!

[Sabcat]

Yes I'm rather worried about the rain too...

 

I think my thames work could be a little hairy later this week.... But a fair sea never made a good sailor... As the saying goes... (Or something like that).

 

I have two big boats lined up to go alongside fairstar now... And will try hard to secure bigger pumps! Hss do one that shifts about 1300 L a minute... I think it's about £70 for the weekend...

 

So kind of you to offer to help towards the cost, but I would not feel right at all accepting that! I'm buy some fizz for the hopeful celebrations on Saturday night though!!!

 

Mx

 

With all due respect mate, bollocks to that. If you've not got the cash to hand to rent the pump then I (and others who have already have said so) will chip in. I've not followed this thread for 18 %*$*&£* pages to read that the whole thing failed for the lack of a £70 pump. PM me an email address and I'll Paypal you the cash you need if you use it or if not bank transfer.

[Marcuswarry]

Sabcat, are you a saint, or some kind of angel?! My reason for trying to save money is born out of being frugal too (read 'tight arse'), as well as being skint... But it's not like I'm on my last fiver, I really wouldn't feel right taking any money. I hope you understand? You're a legend for offering It though!!

 

Based on my total lack of experience and the fact that no-one had agreed with me so far... I'm oddly still angling towards tarp first... The polythene... Wrapped tightly around it... So I'm using the tarp, that will be quite taught... As a support for the extended gunwale on the more sunken side, to stop the polythene caving in.. As there's a huge empty space in the middle of the boat...

 

And that method seems quicker than building a wooded rail, or maybe using chicken wire (which might snag the polythene in fact (peter x, good point).

 

You spotted my dyslexia nicely peter! Nougat, nugget... Same thing. Errr... No. Can't believe you don't make Nougat though peter. Disappointed! Haha!

 

Richard, I've left wickes now, without may chicken wire and I'm at the boat... So I'm trying to convince myself now, that it was a terrible idea... But shucks... It's a tough one... Should got flipping chicken wire eh?! Balls...

 

Tarp will work a treat!!

 

Marcus

[RLWP]

I'd go tarp first, plastic on top. The tarp will go over holes nicely but may leak. The plastic won't leak but might burst over holes or sharp bits. So, the tarp supports and protects the plastic, the plastic seals the tarp

 

Richard