Help/advice on boat security

[Robbo]

I am aware of the Mortice/Yale style electric locks (and the zero current drain when not in use) but I can't see how they would work on sliding doors?

 

This may be useful...

 

http://mpc.lockwood.production.assaabloy.com/FileExplorer/fetchfile.aspx?id=714

 

The ABLOY EL648 Motor Lock is for sliding doors.

[Bobbybass]

I don't want to say to much on a public forum but....

 

I've not started work on my boat yet, but I intend it to be 'key-less' using 12v magnetic locks on both sliding side doors and the internal sliding doors to the living area and aft cabin. The power will be supplied via relay to two independent batterys in case of a power failure leaving the boat unlocked.

http://www.tlc-direct.co.uk/Products/EVML250.html

 

The internal key pads will be mounted discreetly out of sight and the external side doors will be hidden in countersunk, flapped boxes.

http://www.tlc-direct.co.uk/Products/EZLOCK.html?source=adwords&kw=&gclid=CPOVl5zBxLoCFbLLtAodXWIAMg

 

A dummy/easy to break in, easy to find safe might be an idea filled with junk jewellery, an old mobile phone, out of date credit cards, old iPod ect?

 

I will install a CCTV and alarm system as I have the luxury of doing this when the boat is in pieces and hiding the sensitive parts and wiring completely out of sight.

 

PIR lighting also convenient for when you return to your boat at night.

 

Chaz

 

I'm not criticising...

This is a 'general' observation..

Do we really want to live like this ?

The idea of moving from a house (for me..so maybe not others) was to leave stuff like this behind.

To lead a simpler life...and forget fancy gadgets and barracading ourselves in...

 

We are locking ourselves into a long metal prison...

 

Question why you want magnetic locks, there not any more secure (I would say they are a lot less secure!). I've seen electric mortice locks that fail locked (so use no power when locked) and can also be used with a key.

 

Edit to add the electric mortice locks I've seen are not on TLC. The locks I've seen the electric part is the lock that goes in the door, not the "release bit"

 

No..they are just fancy not secure...and as I have demonstrated to my mates several times...(to ther shock) .I can get into their 'rolling security code' Merc and BMW's with something I bought for £14 in Wickes !!

[Sierra2]

 

I'm not criticising...

This is a 'general' observation..

Do we really want to live like this ?

The idea of moving from a house (for me..so maybe not others) was to leave stuff like this behind.

To lead a simpler life...and forget fancy gadgets and barracading ourselves in...

 

We are locking ourselves into a long metal prison...

 

Hi Bobbybass

 

I would feel more prisoned returning to my floating home only to unlock a giant padlock (or two) rather than put a key in a door lock. If I can do away with keys altogether and be just as secure, it just makes life easier on my pockets getting holes in them

I've always been security conscience, it is nothing new from bricks and mortar and the only thought I give it is when I move in. I don't live life in fear about the future, life is to short for that.

 

Plan/spend hard, live easy/minimalist would be my ethos for security

 

Chaz

[Robbo]

 

 

No..they are just fancy not secure...and as I have demonstrated to my mates several times...(to ther shock) .I can get into their 'rolling security code' Merc and BMW's with something I bought for £14 in Wickes !!

 

The mortice ones I linked too are just as secure as a mortice lock, but have the advantages of having an electronic key. Useful for work places where you have quite a few people, but not really viable for homes or boats (they do cost). The magnetic door "locks" and the "mortice" type releases on TLC aren't really secure.

[Paul's Nulife4-2]

Isn't it such a shame,such an awful fact of life That we have to lock/barricade our.home/boat in such a way to pursue our chosen lifestyles..it almost would make the boat user feel like they are in prison for the night.

The difference being, you have to pay for that privilege/experience Ofcourse!.

[quote

 

name=Bobbybass" post="1185281" timestamp="1385489619]

I'm not criticising...

This is a 'general' observation..

Do we really want to live like this ?

The idea of moving from a house (for me..so maybe not others) was to leave stuff like this behind.

To lead a simpler life...and forget fancy gadgets and barracading ourselves in...

 

We are locking ourselves into a long metal prison

 

As I suggested earlier ,it makes us the the sad victims of our lifestyle choice.

& I can't believe that some people,actually stick up for,or defend the scumbags (my choice of wording) that make us consider such extremes.

But it seams ime in the minority regarding my thoughts.

I have been very lucky to date,& not experienced a break in thank heavens. Probably because of my chosen cruising / mooring grounds.

 

(I don't know what happens there,it was ment to be 2 previous quotes,Me & Bobbybass)

Edited November 26, 2013 by Paul's Nulife4-2

[Sierra2]

 

The mortice ones I linked too are just as secure as a mortice lock, but have the advantages of having an electronic key. Useful for work places where you have quite a few people, but not really viable for homes or boats (they do cost). The magnetic door "locks" and the "mortice" type releases on TLC aren't really secure.

 

Agreed, if it's a steel sliding door with bars welded over the lips around the edges and nothing to 'pick', I fail to see how it would be overcome without power tools or a sledge hammer.....

Edited November 26, 2013 by Sierra2

[Rob@BSSOffice]

 

.. It never occurred to me before to do this, so I can just use the bow door for entering and leaving the boat when moored up, very helpful lesson learned. This also gives me the advantage of being able to get out the rear quickly from the inside if need be,

 

Just to repeat beaker's advice from post #4 - it is absolutely vital that you can escape from any designated point in seconds. Any door or hatch you plan to use in an emergency should have clear internal access and be capable of being opened from the inside with ease while in a confused state in the middle of the night as the boat fills with thick smoke and hot toxic fumes.

 

Fit smoke and carbon monoxide alarms. These are critical parts of your safety and security. They will give you vital extra seconds to escape.

 

Grills on windows may also prevent people from rescuing you, if you are trapped inside. Take note of the boater who was rescued from his burning boat on the Regent's Canal earlier this year.

[Phil Ambrose]

To be honest im not sure i would be happy with grilles over my windows and doors. Its supposed to be home not a prison.

I have all 11" portholes, all steel doors front and rear and bars over the 2 Houdini hatches. Some would say the bars are a no-no but in all honesty neither of us would be able to haul our fat @rses up there to get out. Oh and don't tell SWMBO about the fat bit.

Phil

[Robbo]

I have all 11" portholes, all steel doors front and rear and bars over the 2 Houdini hatches. Some would say the bars are a no-no but in all honesty neither of us would be able to haul our fat @rses up there to get out. Oh and don't tell SWMBO about the fat bit.

Phil

I have bars on my roof hatches as well, there part if the window so can be opened. I presume it's for safety incase the window breaks, you don't fall threw.

[Phil Ambrose]

I have bars on my roof hatches as well, there part if the window so can be opened. I presume it's for safety incase the window breaks, you don't fall threw.

Our hatches do indeed have bars across them but the bars I spoke of are additional and fixed across the internal frame so remain in place even when the hatch is open

 

Phil

Edited November 27, 2013 by Phil Ambrose

[mark99]

Here's a good one.

 

Don't put up an avatar showing your clearly identifyable boat then continue posting where you moor and how long you will be away from your boat for (sometimes a week).

 

It happens in here.

Edited November 27, 2013 by mark99

[Naughty Cal]

We have one token gesture of a "lock" on the sliding cabin door which we often dont use.. Diaries have better security, yet it is all that the boat needs and has never been a problem. NC has clamp shut port lights which can only be opened from the in side but not for security reasons, they are clamp shut to stop waves pushing them open.

 

I dont get why some of you are so obsessive with security. If someone wants to get into your boat then they will regardless of how many locks or bars you fit.

[Robbo]

Here's a good one.

 

Don't put up an avatar showing your clearly identifyable boat then continue posting where you moor and how long you will be away from your boat for (sometimes a week).

 

It happens in here.

Could be a honeypot!

[pquinn]

We have one token gesture of a "lock" on the sliding cabin door which we often dont use.. Diaries have better security, yet it is all that the boat needs and has never been a problem. NC has clamp shut port lights which can only be opened from the in side but not for security reasons, they are clamp shut to stop waves pushing them open.

 

I dont get why some of you are so obsessive with security. If someone wants to get into your boat then they will regardless of how many locks or bars you fit.

probably human nature these days.but why make it easy for them.

[Naughty Cal]

probably human nature these days.but why make it easy for them.

Why make it so they cause hundreds of pounds worth of damage when they do break in?

[Paul's Nulife4-2]

Why make it so they cause hundreds of pounds worth of damage when they do break in?

I think its a bit of a balance,if you've got a boat worth a few hundred pound,with nothing of value on board then leave it open & take your chances .

If you've got a boat worth a few thousand pound,with some Navionics & other useful stuff left on board for convenience, Then I would imagine you would want to cover the Windows *& fit a good lock or 2.

Now if your talking about your home,worth possibley tens of thousands or more, With personal items aboard collectively worth thousands,& its a requirement of your insurance that Adequate security measures be taken..

I think you just have to do what you can,in the realms of being reasonable & practical. So its all relative I think.

 

After all, Would you leave you house (if you have one Ofcourse)when you go on your 2014 Big adventure cruise with nothing more than a token garden shed type padlock & clap securing the front door ?.

Edited November 27, 2013 by Paul's Nulife4-2

[Naughty Cal]

I think its a bit of a balance,if you've got a boat worth a few hundred pound,with nothing of value on board then leave it open & take your chances .

If you've got a boat worth a few thousand pound,with some Navionics & other useful stuff left on board for convenience, Then I would imagine you would want to cover the Windows *& fit a good lock or 2.

Now if your talking about your home,worth possibley tens of thousands or more, With personal items aboard collectively worth thousands,& its a requirement of your insurance that Adequate security measures be taken..

I think you just have to do what you can,in the realms of being reasonable & practical. So its all relative I think.

 

After all, Would you leave you house when you go on your 2014 cruise with nothing more than a token garden shed thou padlock & clap securing the front door ?.

Pretty much. They have to get passed the guard dogs (nosy neighbours) first

 

And our nav gear is fixed to the dashboard in full view. Very little you can do about it with the boat design and open cockpit (well under canvas but you know what I mean!)

[Barry]

Having had long discussions with the police following my recent break in at home I have come to some conclusions about burglers and home security that can be extended to boats I think.

 

First - there are two types of burgler:- the determined thief and the opportunist thief

 

The determined thief cases the joint, knows the victim's routines, probably does not work alone, comes tooled up, with a van, and will strip your house of anything sellable, large and small. There is not much you can do about them without turning your house into fort knox. What you can do, though, is to secretly mark your valuables using more than one method. Then put signs up in your windows saying so. That can put even a determined thief off somewhat since they don't want to risk being caught with identifiable goods

 

The opportunist thief can be countered because they want to be in and out quickly and will only take stuff that can be hidden about their person as they walk or cycle away. It is about imagining what they may be thinking and persuading them that, given the choice, they will be better off trying their luck elsewhere because there are easier targets

 

Up until my break in my house was the same as many in my street. Access to the back where it is quiet and secluded was easy(my garden is surrounded by six foot fences). Ordinary door and window locks. Now I have fitted an alarm system which is visible on approach and put in six foot gates to make access to, and egress from, the back garden much more difficult. If they do decide to go for it my alarm system will make life very unpleasant because it is extremely loud so as they enter the sheer noise will encourage them change their minds and run for it.

 

Extending those principles to boats. Not being close to where a vehicled thief can park up will be good. External alarms will be useless because they are too easily disabled on a boat. Very loud internal alarms will be good. Marking valuables and advertising the fact will be good. Functioning door and window security will be good. Not cheap padlocks attached to the boat with brackets that can be quickly hacksawed or levered off. Having good neighbours will be useful. For example once I became aware how vulnerable my house was, when I went away for the weekend my next door neighbours came in to my house to close curtains and turn lights on at dusk, turn lights off at bed time, and open the curtains in the morning.

 

It would be wrong to assume that nothing can be done to deter burglaries and it would be wrong to think that well thought out deterrents are a waste of time

[Paul's Nulife4-2]

We'll to be fair Nauti cal to date,it seams your security arrangement has worked for you,

& my security arrangement ,though @ the opposite end of the scale has to date,worked for me.

& long may our different approaches to this horrible problem be affective for both.

I hope the OP has similar success,in what ever they do.

Edited November 27, 2013 by Paul's Nulife4-2

[Naughty Cal]

We'll to be fair Nauti cal to date,it seams your security arrangement has worked for you,

& my security arrangement ,though @ the opposite end of the scale has to date,worked for me.

& long may our different approaches to this horrible problem be affective for both.

I hope the OP has similar success,in what ever they do.

Naughty

[Phil Ambrose]

Naughty

But nice (giggle)

Phil

[Sierra2]

I dont get why some of you are so obsessive with security. If someone wants to get into your boat then they will regardless of how many locks or bars you fit.

 

I'm sorry but that is such a lazy view/approach to something that is your responsibility. I don't obsess about security other than give it a thought when I change my environment. For example I don't ruin my holiday by worrying about getting robbed every min of the day. If I check in to a hotel I'll look at the matter and plan as best I can before getting on with the business of necking beers , getting burnt like a lobster an enjoying myself. As I said, in the case of a new house or a boat I'll spend sufficient time planning and paying to put reasonable measures in place before getting on and enjoying life. If I get burgled, it's my responsibility, not the Police and Insurers. Do you believe it is the fire brigades responsibility to prevent fire on your boat?

 

I am a sports bike rider and that is one area where you might be forgiven for saying "If they want it, the'll get it..." Bikes are light enough with four guys and two short scaffolding poles through the wheel spokes to lift into the back of a waiting van. 95% of chains and locks on the market that are sold as insurance approved can be cropped by hand in seconds. Consequently everyone went and bought Almax chains at vast expense only for the thieves to remove the wheel that was chained to a lamp post and leave it and the chain behind. Alarms don't matter as the vans are sound proofed for the few seconds they are wailing leaving only Trackers to get the bike back (hopefully) if they are not found and removed from the bike. There is no easy answer. In any case I digress....

 

You can (if you want to) make the reward of breaking in far less reasonable than the time and effort it will take to achieve it to these scumbags. I hate the victim mentality...

 

Chaz

[Naughty Cal]

Why is it lazy to not be uptight about being burgled?

[pquinn]

Why is it lazy to not be uptight about being burgled?

i dont think its fair to say people are being up tight.they are being security conscious of possessions that may have been hard earned and are important to them personally.

 

is it possible that your possessions were not as hard earned for you, so you are less security conscious?

[Naughty Cal]

i dont think its fair to say people are being up tight.they are being security conscious of possessions that may have been hard earned and are important to them personally.

 

is it possible that your possessions were not as hard earned for you, so you are less security conscious?

No.