GU Northern Engines

[GUMPY]

About 15 or 20 years ago prior to a National Rally some where down south all the pumps on the northern side of the Chilterns were refurbished and brought back to working order.

Went through Leighton lock today and thought I would have a nose through the windows of the pump house, just two empty rooms, anyone know why and when the pumps were removed?

[LEO]

About 15 or 20 years ago prior to a National Rally some where down south all the pumps on the northern side of the Chilterns were refurbished and brought back to working order.

Went through Leighton lock today and thought I would have a nose through the windows of the pump house, just two empty rooms, anyone know why and when the pumps were removed?

 

Hi,

I think they were restored and brought back into use (some with a back pumping system) below Cowroast Lock, but going north think most were closed and the buildings sold off.

L

 

PS Excuse the italics.

[GUMPY]

June 97 Waterways World had an article about them I thought that was to coincide with restoration

[alan_fincher]

AFAIK they are all still available, but I believe possibly still "people intensive" to use extensively.

A good description by BEngo in this post as to where they all are.....

 

It seems that at Leighton it is not where you were looking for it!.....................

 

At Fenny there is a pump in the cottage/workshop on the towpath side.

At Talbots the pump is in the hip-roofed building across the lock from the cottage.

At Stoke Hammond 3 the pump is in the hip-roofed buildings on the opposite side to the pub

At Leighton the pump is at the tail of the lock on the cottage side

At Grove I don't know

At Church the pump is on the offside in the building there- this may suck from below Grove. There is (was last time I passed) a temporary discharge pipe wandering across the remains of the side ponds

At Slapton I don't know

At Horton the pump is on the offside in the cottage buildings there. It may suck from below Slapton

At Ivinghoe the pump is in the building by the cottage at the top lock on the towpath side

At Nags Head 3 the pump is in the Southern end of the pump house by the middle lock 35 - it draws from below 34

At Peters Two the pump is in the buildings on the Marsworth side of the cottage on the offside.

I still don't know how (or if) the water gets up to the Summit except that Tringford pumps are almost certainly involved - is anyone still in touch with Gavin?

A good clue for tracking the pumps in many places is to look and see where the electric wires go.

Over the years I have seen most if not all of these working but I think they are all locally controlled (so are difficult to manage without a lot of blokes) and are so infrequently needed since Tring Sewage works on was built on the Wendover, that the mud has to be cleared from all the inlets and outlets every time before they will work. Maybe the upgrade will enable them to be run emotely so that a few minutes a week will keep the pipes etc clear.

 

[GUMPY]

Ta for that

Guess I was standing above it whilst looking through the windows.

[LEO]

Ta for that

Guess I was standing above it whilst looking through the windows.

hi,

 

The interesting point here is when does an' engine' become a 'back pump'?. By engine I tend to think of a steam engine housed in an impressive purpose built engine house....

 

These brick built structures are impressive and the size of some of them indicates they may have housed impressive steam engines - a modern electric back pump takes up little space.

 

All the purpose built engine houses seem to have been built to a standard GJCC design and it is amazing to see the condition that some of them are despite receiving no maintenance - the one down from the swing bridge at Pitstone being a good example.

 

So, back pump or engine - both do (or did) the same job, but I would love to have seen the latter in action, the only ones seeing action at the moment seem to be the pumps at Cowroast and Northchurch (AFAIK).

 

L

[GUMPY]

Both Cowroast and Northchurch pump from boreholes, I lament the day they added the backpump to Cowroast the water was great to drink before that on a hot summers day.

[alan_fincher]

Steam originally, electric now, but certainly at some also diesel for a while.....

 

Sickle's original Russell Newbery was apparently for a while the back pump engine at "Talbot's"

[Derek R.]

Steam? That would require a boiler house and chimney, along with permanent stoker/engineer at each pump house. I think a gas engine may have been installed at some, though electric is more likely.

 

Not sure that Cow Roast is a 'back' pump, just a borehole - and superb qaulity it was, but now fitted with a grill which prevents filling a can. It might also be considered that modern electrics and pump gear are so much more compact than the originals as fitted. An 'empty' house might conceal equipment beneath the floor, or off to one side.

[koukouvagia]

There is a back pump at Cowroast, but it's housed in the little brick hut below the lock. It was refurbished recently.

The borehole pump is in the pumphouse next to the lock and is capable of supplying, IIRC, 90 locks of water a week.

BW, as it then was, put a grill over when they discovered local boaters were filling up their drinking cans. Contaminated, it was alleged.

[Derek R.]

I do remember the little brick building below the lock now you come to mention it.

 

The water from the borehole is the same water that is (was?) extracted and bottled as pure Chiltern Water at Tom's Hill Farm just up the hill.

Contaminated - more like fearful of some possible litigation claim from funny tummy.

[GUMPY]

The cover went on about the time the backpump was refurbished as they use the same channel

[alan_fincher]

Steam? That would require a boiler house and chimney, along with permanent stoker/engineer at each pump house. I think a gas engine may have been installed at some, though electric is more likely.

 

 

Like this, then?

 

 

Picture: Chris Reynolds - Creative Commons Licence

 

There wasn't a huge availability of any other form of power than stream when the Northern Engines were first installed in about 1839, was there!

 

Yes steam engines, certainly, needing "engine drivers" and stokers to man then - no doubt accounting for some of these are those that can be found in local censuses from that era.

 

Alan Faulkner says in his book "The Grand Junction Canal"that the Northern Engines were progressively electrified between 1946 and 1964, but does not mention diesel pumps. However if "Sickle's" RN was pressed into service at "Talbot's", it was not actually removed from Sickle until 1957, I think, indicating some "new" diesel pumps must have been going in even whilst electrification was going on elsewhere.

So, back pump or engine - both do (or did) the same job, but I would love to have seen the latter in action, the only ones seeing action at the moment seem to be the pumps at Cowroast and Northchurch (AFAIK).

 

 

Definitely not true, last season when we had the water shortage scare. At least some of the "Northern Engine" pumps were certainly in very active use.

 

And "yes", Northern Engine because that's what they all once were - the name has stuck, even though the "engines" are no more.

[LEO]

I do remember the little brick building below the lock now you come to mention it.

 

The water from the borehole is the same water that is (was?) extracted and bottled as pure Chiltern Water at Tom's Hill Farm just up the hill.

Contaminated - more like fearful of some possible litigation claim from funny tummy.

 

Hi,

 

I thought the trough was uncovered, the back pumps are not used at the moment and all the water I see is very clear (should be as it's from a bore hole).

 

This pumping of spring water (and a good frost helps) leads to an annual 'event' when the water above the lock becomes crystal clear for a fair way up the canal to the marina entrance.

 

L.

[LEO]

 

Like this, then?

 

 

Picture: Chris Reynolds - Creative Commons Licence

 

There wasn't a huge availability of any other form of power than stream when the Northern Engines were first installed in about 1839, was there!

 

Yes steam engines, certainly, needing "engine drivers" and stokers to man then - no doubt accounting for some of these are those that can be found in local censuses from that era.

 

Alan Faulkner says in his book "The Grand Junction Canal"that the Northern Engines were progressively electrified between 1946 and 1964, but does not mention diesel pumps. However if "Sickle's" RN was pressed into service at "Talbot's", it was not actually removed from Sickle until 1957, I think, indicating some "new" diesel pumps must have been going in even whilst electrification was going on elsewhere.

 

Definitely not true, last season when we had the water shortage scare. At least some of the "Northern Engine" pumps were certainly in very active use.

 

And "yes", Northern Engine because that's what they all once were - the name has stuck, even though the "engines" are no more.

 

Hi Alan,

The only pumps seeing action 'at the moment' are the those mentioned - the system north of the Cowroast are not running but may (or may not) work in the event of a water shortage. Let's hope they are not needed.

 

Brilliant picture of the old pumphouse, similar design to that at Tringford, must have pumped water for miles.

 

Any idea what the brickwork 'chimney' is for - situated in a field behind the lock cottage at Peter's Two. May be connected to pumping operations.

 

Mike

[Tuscan]

If you get the chance to go around and down the Tringford pumping station on the Wendover arm I would recommend.fascinating. Used to be a must do at every Wendover festival.

[Derek R.]

Ah memories! I can recall crystal clear water above Cow Roast lock too, and tying up for a night outside the Tringford pumphouse - that was before the galvy fence went up.

 

 

Edited to add:

 

Been scratching about:

 

In commenting on the probable lack of steam engines to back pump, I was thinking of those situated South of Cow Roast, and though memory is poor, I believe have dates on them of 1947ish?

 

Alan Faulkener’s book ‘The Grand Junction Canal’ has a complete chapter on reservoirs and water supply, and the ‘Northern Engines’ are indeed listed. By 1841 nine pumps were installed to pass water around seventeen locks. They were at; Fenny Stratford, Stoke Hammond, Soulbury, Leighton Buzzard, Church, Horton, Ivinghoe, Seabrook, and Marsworth. All engine houses were of brick with slate roofs and powered by steam engines. They not only pumped water ‘back’ it seems, as they also pumped from streams in the area.

 

The chimney behind Peter’s Two may have been a remnant from the Marsworth engine, but I am uncertain of this. It seems strange to be set back that far from the canal, though if it was, then it might have been so to connect into the Northern Railway feeder, which subsequently fed Marsworth reservoir. From what I can remember, was it not of circular concrete construction? However, if you look at the area in Google Maps you can see a direct line to the chimney base to a ground fixture just above lock 38 indicating a possible subterranean line. In Faulkener’s chapter on reservoirs and water supplies, mention is made of a modification to the original plan, as the feeder was found to be inadequate for the flow, making a feed into the canal above 38 necessary. From there it could be run into Marsworth Reservoir. This is probably that feeder.

 

A little aside:

Just come across a website that show much history of canals, and from which there are many fine images I have not seen before.Appendix II in chapter V is relevant to water supply: HERE. (Scroll down past the personalities).

- and some nice images in Chapter IX HERE.

Edited September 20, 2013 by Derek R.

[1-Cylinder Wonder]

I have been in Tringford and seen the pumps running. Whilst it is easy to think of "electric" pumps as something small and whizzy these are large, old and rather beautiful electric motors. I think open frame if I remember correctly.

 

Tringford was previously powered by Mirlees Blast Injection diesel engines. I don't know if this was the case for the other Northern Engines as Mirlees were not small so for some sites may have been too big. Of course before that steam. I also have a feeling that some of the pump houses are not the original buildings. Some being rebuilt after the steam plant was disposed of but I might be wrong on this. There are pictures of the engines around. I can't remember where though. A quick call to Gloucester would probably yield good results. Museums enjoy being given a research job. It's makes a change from school parties and supervising volunteers!

 

John