Engine hiccup

[dockgateman]

hi, my boat engine runs really well when i cruise along but after about 3 hours the engine suddenly sounds from a chug to a sound as if losing

power slightly, i have the rev counter on 16 when the boat chugging along, when the change happens the needle on the rev counter drops

intermittentlyfrom 16 to 15,when i stop the enging for a couple hours and start it up again the problem gone for a hour or so then it starts

again, i have recently change the oil and fuel filters..... any idea of what the problem is. Roy

[bottle]

No but................................................mine does the same at any-time, whenever the fridge, freezer, kettle or bread-maker 'cut-in'.

 

When I get my rev counter to 16(00) rpm, very rare, I am not chugging I am flying. (Obviously you may not have the same set up as me)

[Bob18]

Fuel tank not venting properly?

[WotEver]

... i have recently change the oil and fuel filters.....

Did it do it before you changed them?

 

Is there more than one fuel filter?

 

What engine?

 

Tony

[Boatingbiker]

Leaves on the prop ?

[Pretty Funked Up]

Could be many things and doesnt sound like its much to worry about though.

One easy thing to try/rule out is the fuel, treat it to some fuel set. It certainly wont make it worse

[MoominPapa]

No but................................................mine does the same at any-time, whenever the fridge, freezer, kettle or bread-maker 'cut-in'.

Standing on the back steering, I can tell you when the breadmaker has finished by the pattern of changes in the engine note as the load comes and goes.

 

MP.

[Tony Brooks]

Could be many things and doesnt sound like its much to worry about though.

One easy thing to try/rule out is the fuel, treat it to some fuel set. It certainly wont make it worse

 

 

In view of recent information I would not use that or a similar emulsifying product. I now advise a biocide that actively de-emulsifies the water plus the regular draining/pump out of the tank.

[n.b.Goldie]

In view of recent information I would not use that or a similar emulsifying product. I now advise a biocide that actively de-emulsifies the water plus the regular draining/pump out of the tank.

 

Hi Tony.

 

Very interested, as a Fuel Set user, in the recent information, could you provide a link to it? I wonder what the problem is with an emulsifying product.

 

Thanks

Ditchdabbler

[dockgateman]

Did it do it before you changed them?

 

Is there more than one fuel filter?

 

What engine?

 

Tony

 

hi tony

yes there are 2 fuel filters and i change the oil and filters about 2 weeks ago, i then top the fuel tank up with diesel fom the marina (have to say the tank was low) and what i think may have happened is as the tank was getting topped-up with the diesel it has disturb the sediment at the bottom of the tank so the sediments became 'airborne' if you like, i i then set off cruising for a couple hourd then the engine started to sound rough

i stopped for the night, next day i start-up the engine and the problem had gone, i think the filters had done there job but i may have to change the filters again, its a Beta marine engine 3 cylinder 17HP, a thinking i might have to drain and clean out the fuel tank. Roy

[bizzard]

I've been out to many boats over the years that have just refueled and then shortly after dirt in the tank stops the engine.

I recommend again on here to wait 30 mins or so before restarting your engine to let any muck settle in the tank..

Pull or pole your boat away from the pump if its in the way.Relax have tea but wait. bizzard.

[bottle]

Standing on the back steering, I can tell you when the breadmaker has finished by the pattern of changes in the engine note as the load comes and goes.

 

MP.

 

Snap.

[Tony Brooks]

Hi Tony.

 

Very interested, as a Fuel Set user, in the recent information, could you provide a link to it? I wonder what the problem is with an emulsifying product.

 

Thanks

Ditchdabbler

 

 

I will try to explain, although I have already posted it on this forum.

 

It seems bio-fuel plus an emulsifier may be producing an emulsion with too much water in it.

 

First of all let me say that I was great advocator of the emulsifying additives and especially Fuelset but have now changed my mind. I just do not like the idea of using biocides seeing what has happened in hospitals. However the additive manufacturers say resistance can not build up in tanks (What did Christine Keeler say?)but I now feel it is the lesser of the two evils.

 

Whatever the vendor may say I do not see how they can guarantee the diesel will not contain bio, even if it is a result of residue in the delivery tanks, bulk tanks or pipelines so it would be prudent to assume we all have a degree of bio fuel in our tanks. Now Bio-fuel will absorb far more water than mineral diesel.

 

Whatever one thinks of RCR, who I work closely with re training courses, they must see far more breakdowns than anyone else and at the Burton show the MD showed me something that scared me.

 

She showed me a filter (like the ones used on BMC engines) that appeared perfectly clean but with a very slight sheen and very light buff discolouration except the centre parts of the spiral windings had been displaced downwards. This showed that despite looking all but new it was, in fact, blocked. She also showed me some photos of what had been removed from a tank and stated that the fuel polishing equipment at Tooleys had been broken trying to clean a members fuel system. One of the Calcutt engineers has recently told me their equipment suffered in a similar way.

 

It seems that the ability of bio-fuel to absorb water plus the emulsifying agent passing through the fuel system causes a sort of mousse to from between any water in the tank and the fuel and it is this that is causing the problems.

 

She says that the way they sort the problem is to add Fuelset and let the boat stand for 48 hours without running. They then pump the water from the bottom of the tank until no more cloudy fuel is being draw into the pump. They recommend the continued use of Marine 16 or another biocidce with de-emulsifying properties.

 

Once anyone embarks on this procedure it is important to institute REGULAR tank draining by whatever means is applicable, at least once a year.

 

As soon as my current pot of Fuelset is use up I will change over to tank draining and Marine 16 (or Grotamar or one other I can not remember the name of). I think WWW published a thing about this recently.

[WotEver]

hi tony

yes there are 2 fuel filters and i change the oil and filters about 2 weeks ago, i then top the fuel tank up with diesel fom the marina (have to say the tank was low) and what i think may have happened is as the tank was getting topped-up with the diesel it has disturb the sediment at the bottom of the tank so the sediments became 'airborne' if you like, i i then set off cruising for a couple hourd then the engine started to sound rough

i stopped for the night, next day i start-up the engine and the problem had gone, i think the filters had done there job but i may have to change the filters again, its a Beta marine engine 3 cylinder 17HP, a thinking i might have to drain and clean out the fuel tank. Roy

Yup, sounds likely. New filters probably required

 

Tony

[Smelly]

Tony... (ETA) Brooks

 

I read my Marine 16 bottle before donating it to a worthy cause and I think that the action is more by way of a chemical poison, a la cyanide rather than a biological agent ala penicillin so I'd think their advice about a lack of risk of resistance may well be credible.

 

I remember a big long organic SI name rather than an antibiotic appellation.

Edited September 12, 2011 by Smelly

[MoominPapa]

Tony... (ETA) Brooks

 

I read my Marine 16 bottle before donating it to a worthy cause and I think that the action is more by way of a chemical poison, a la cyanide rather than a biological agent ala penicillin so I'd think their advice about a lack of risk of resistance may well be credible.

 

I remember a big long organic SI name rather than an antibiotic appellation.

Yes, killing bugs is easy if you don't have to worry about killing the host too. No bacteria is every going to evolve resistance to concentrated bleach, for instance. The problem with antibiotics is that they have to be a bit subtle and kill the bugs without killing the person taking them. They can't be poisonous to all life, and have to exploit some unique feature of the bug's biology. That gives the bug the chance to evolve resistance by tweaking that feature a bit.

 

MP.

[Swallowman]

Tony... (ETA) Brooks

 

I read my Marine 16 bottle before donating it to a worthy cause and I think that the action is more by way of a chemical poison, a la cyanide rather than a biological agent ala penicillin so I'd think their advice about a lack of risk of resistance may well be credible.

 

I remember a big long organic SI name rather than an antibiotic appellation.

 

Marine 16 is GrotaMar71 (manufactured by Schulke & Mayr) and repacked into smaller containers by the good folk in Swansea and is an isothiazalinone biocide, not an antibiotic like penicillin. In fact, diesel bug is a cocktail of bugs including moulds, yeasts and other nasties. The problem is not so much the bugs themselves but the excreta produced by the bugs. Marine 16 kills off the bugs in exactly the same way as other biocides of this type that are commonly used in household products, shampoos, etc. I had the problem in my vintage bus (see the Avatar!); Marine 16 cured the problem in no time flat after cleaning the felt cloth fuel filter.

Fuelset is not a biocide and will not kill the bugs that case the problem, it is basically a fuel conditioner that improves the burn of the fuel and therefore the efficiency of the engine.

I use Fuelset in my road car to improve fuel consumption and Marine 16 in the boat to ward off diesel bug.

Edited September 12, 2011 by Swallowman

[n.b.Goldie]

Marine 16 is GrotaMar71 (manufactured by Schulke & Mayr) and repacked into smaller containers by the good folk in Swansea and is an isothiazalinone biocide, not an antibiotic like penicillin. In fact, diesel bug is a cocktail of bugs including moulds, yeasts and other nasties. The problem is not so much the bugs themselves but the excreta produced by the bugs. Marine 16 kills off the bugs in exactly the same way as other biocides of this type that are commonly used in household products, shampoos. I had the problem in my vintage bus; Marine 16 cured the problem in no time flat after cleaning the felt cloth fuel filter.

Fuelset is not a biocide and will not kill the bugs that case the problem, it is basically a fuel conditioner that improves the burn of the fuel and therefore the efficiency of the engine.

I use Fuelset in my road car to improve fuel consumption and Marine 16 in the boat to ward off diesel bug.

 

Is it possible/advisable to use both Fuel Set to condition the fuel and Marine16 to kill the bugs? Are the products compatible?

 

Regards

Ditchdabbler

[Swallowman]

[/i][/b]

 

Is it possible/advisable to use both Fuel Set to condition the fuel and Marine16 to kill the bugs? Are the products compatible?

 

Regards

Ditchdabbler

 

Yes, they are if used correctly. Swallow is a shared ownership boat and the management company recommends Fuelset at every refuelling. I take my own bottle of Marine 16 and add a teaspoonfull or so each time I am on board.

[Tony Brooks]

[/i][/b]

 

Is it possible/advisable to use both Fuel Set to condition the fuel and Marine16 to kill the bugs? Are the products compatible?

 

Regards

Ditchdabbler

 

 

My understanding of the RCR research is that one function of Marine16 is to de-emulsify any water in the fuel (Including that in the bio content) so If that is correct I do not see how mixing will work.