Magazines

[Dominic M]

We take Waterways World, NarrowBoat and Canal Boat, and I'm considering dropping WW

 

Richard

 

I must say I'm thoroughly sick of the sycophantic boat reviews in both CB and WW, but WW seems slightly more nauseating

Yeah, there is the extraordinarily sycophantic review that almost amounts to advertorial in the January 2011 issue of WW of a boat on brokerage with ABNB called William which extends over two pages. The brokerage was founded by Andy Burnett, the article informs, but fails to say that he flogged it to his gopher in 2005 and is now nothing to do with it. Those interested in the boat might like to contact a surveyor like Trevor Whitling, who knows a great deal about the steelwork of those particular craft. Or even contact the surveyor, Paul Smith, who is now a part owner of ABNB, requesting that he wears his surveyor's rather than his broker's hat. Of course, the boat may be fantastic.....but the writer fails to add that a full survey would be a good idea, as with any second hand boat.

[ditchcrawler]

Yeah, there is the extraordinarily sycophantic review that almost amounts to advertorial in the January 2011 issue of WW of a boat on brokerage with ABNB called William which extends over two pages. The brokerage was founded by Andy Burnett, the article informs, but fails to say that he flogged it to his gopher in 2005 and is now nothing to do with it. Those interested in the boat might like to contact a surveyor like Trevor Whitling, who knows a great deal about the steelwork of those particular craft. Or even contact the surveyor, Paul Smith, who is now a part owner of ABNB, requesting that he wears his surveyor's rather than his broker's hat. Of course, the boat may be fantastic.....but the writer fails to add that a full survey would be a good idea, as with any second hand boat.

I like the bit "hull, originally in 10/6/4 plate, certainly looks the part of a traditional boat" if it was originally 10/6/4 what is it now and as for that bow looking traditional. (can't do smillies as they have disappeared)

[RLWP]

If I just once read a boat review that said "The Owners decided to add such-and-such a feature and we feel that it hasn't worked out well" I might find some interest again.

 

I suppose I'm fed up with wood-lined coffins fitted out with 200 acre open saloons with two Captain's chairs a tiny flat screen telly and a squirrel stove, a "galley" with curvy granite worksurfaces stuffed full of appliances, four poster beds, and poorly built cupboards stuffed full of electrical control equipment in blue boxes. See one, seen them all

 

Richard

[Dominic M]

If I just once read a boat review that said "The Owners decided to add such-and-such a feature and we feel that it hasn't worked out well" I might find some interest again.

 

I suppose I'm fed up with wood-lined coffins fitted out with 200 acre open saloons with two Captain's chairs a tiny flat screen telly and a squirrel stove, a "galley" with curvy granite worksurfaces stuffed full of appliances, four poster beds, and poorly built cupboards stuffed full of electrical control equipment in blue boxes. See one, seen them all

 

Richard

But those 200 acres can be so useful, Richard. An ash coppice for firewood, some sheep to keep the carpet down and to roast in winter, and an area to keep some poultry. You can also let the remaining 195 acres to a local farmer which will more than cover the cost of the licence and insurance.

[RLWP]

But those 200 acres can be so useful, Richard. An ash coppice for firewood, some sheep to keep the carpet down and to roast in winter, and an area to keep some poultry. You can also let the remaining 195 acres to a local farmer which will more than cover the cost of the licence and insurance.

 

Oh yes, I know. It's all very fashionable.

 

If only that 'normous saloon were used in the multitude of creative ways you have described

 

Richard

[Guest]

Have come a bit late to this party but FWIW I am about to let my subscription to CB lapse.

 

It has become very repetitive and the letters page is actually quite sad- eg

 

I think Steve H is right/wrong about Bow thrusters signed outraged of the Grand Union.

 

- so bloody what....

 

As to Steve's column itself - well Steve is possibly a nice guy but comes across as an opinionated arse.

 

I don't read any of the other mags regularly so can't really comment.

 

Personally I would use the money to buy some decent inland water ways books and read this forum.

 

IMHO you will learn more that way.

[soldthehouse]

.

The daily express.... it wont tell you anything about canals but its a good paper to wipe youre ar.e on after reading it1

Edited December 11, 2010 by soldthehouse

[Athy]

 

As to Steve's column itself - well Steve is possibly a nice guy but comes across as an opinionated arse.

 

Perhaps in giving you that impression he has achieved his column's aim, which is to provoke debate. On the couple of occasions that I've met him he did indeed seem a "nice guy".

Any magazine which reviews anything has a dilemma. On the one hand, to offer the fearless, forthright opinion of the free press, on the other, the need to keep the maker of the product under review happy so that they continue to take out adverts. As a rule of thumb, the sales of a periodical pay for the the print run, the advertising revenue pays for verything else, like wages, rent and profit.

During many years as a music reviewer for various magazines I have been confronted by this situation from time to time. Generally I say exactly what I think about an album or music-related book, but occasionally the editor (probably at the behest of the advertising manager) will whisper in my ear "Be nice, they're taking a full-page advert". On these occasions I don't tell lies but I may soften the truth if the album/ book is crap.

Boat reviews are almost always accompanied by an advert from the boatbuilder, and it's these adverts which help keep the magazine, er, afloat, hence the generally positive nature of most such reviews. Or, of course, it could just be that most of the boats are really rather nice.

Edited December 11, 2010 by Athy

[Québec]

[snip]....Boat reviews are almost always accompanied by an advert from the boatbuilder, and it's these adverts which help keep the magazine, er, afloat, hence the generally positive nature of most such reviews. Or, of course, it could just be that most of the boats are really rather nice.

Why not then stop the pretence and make it easier on everyone and just put 'Advertisement feature' in small print at the top of the page, and charge the advertiser a bit more for the privilege of a nice review of their product?

[Guest]

Perhaps in giving you that impression he has achieved his column's aim, which is to provoke debate.

 

Except because he only pops up once a month it's not really debate, he says something vaguely controversial like - 'do we think bow thrusters might damage canal banks'.

 

Yes they might or they might not....

 

- my real point is I don't need to pay to hear that sort of debate - currently it comes for free here....

[starman]

Boat reviews are almost always accompanied by an advert from the boatbuilder, and it's these adverts which help keep the magazine, er, afloat, hence the generally positive nature of most such reviews. Or, of course, it could just be that most of the boats are really rather nice.

And accompanied by lots of adverts from other boatbuilders, just as car magazines have lots of car adverts, motorcycle mags motorbike ads, fishing mags fishing ads etc. I think you should credit the reviewers of cars, fishing tackle, boats etc with a certain amount of integrity.

When I've chosen boats to review I have looked for ones that have an interesting story - a different layout, alternative power system etc. I wouldn't waste seven precious editorial pages and a substantial chunk of the editorial budget on a dreary, badly built boat. There's plenty of advice elsewhere in the boat mags about how to find a decent boatbuilder.

Yes, there are many - too many - reverse layout semi-trads with granite worktops around but in the course of the last year I've tested a tug with a Kelvin engine and an interior in reclaimed materials, a 32-footer, a 47-footer and (soon to be published) a highly unusual diesel-electric boat.

Edited December 11, 2010 by starman

[Guest]

Yes, there are many - too many - reverse layout semi-trads with granite worktops around

Who says how many are too many??

 

but in the course of the last year I've tested a tug with a Kelvin engine and an interior in reclaimed materials, a 32-footer, a 47-footer and (soon to be published) a highly unusual diesel-electric boat.

 

the implication being these are somehow superior to the majority of boats people actually have built or buy....

[Ally]

I wonder how many people realise that the boatbuilders who are having a boat of theirs reviewed, don't get sight of the article until it is published. We have no say in what is written, are completely uninvolved in any of the process infact, don't get to put any small mistakes right if there are any, and don't request the article either. All we do is hope one day someone will take an interest, look, and hopefully write an article....preferably a nice one! It can be nervewracking tbh!

[muddywaters]

Canal boat.

 

Welcome to the forum!

Yes thats what I was going to recommend, best of the bunch IMO

[Guest]

I wonder how many people realise that the boatbuilders who are having a boat of theirs reviewed, don't get sight of the article until it is published. We have no say in what is written, are completely uninvolved in any of the process infact, don't get to put any small mistakes right if there are any, and don't request the article either. All we do is hope one day someone will take an interest, look, and hopefully write an article....preferably a nice one! It can be nervewracking tbh!

 

Well given the generally favourable reviews they get in the mags (with the odd minor trivial criticism about some dodgy gap in the panel fit or a sticky drawer...) if I was submitting a boat I'd built for review I'd not lose any sleep...

[carlt]

I know my boss booked a double page ad, soon after the boat, we were fitting out, was inspected for a review, instead of his usual half pager.

 

I'm convinced this had no influence, whatsoever, on the result....a glowing review, for a distinctly average boat.

[Ally]

Well given the generally favourable reviews they get in the mags (with the odd minor trivial criticism about some dodgy gap in the panel fit or a sticky drawer...) if I was submitting a boat I'd built for review I'd not lose any sleep...

You missed the point...the boats AREN'T 'submitted for review' or built as such. Certainly ours was a normal build for a customer, which found attention because of the customer and some less usual features.

[Guest]

You missed the point...the boats AREN'T 'submitted for review' or built as such. Certainly ours was a normal build for a customer, which found attention because of the customer and some less usual features.

 

No I didn't miss any point - that is unless the magazine conducted a forced boarding of the vessel they reviewed, other wise the magazine were invited aboard in full knowledge they wouldn't say anything realy realy bad about the boat in question.....

[Ally]

your words: " if I was submitting a boat I had built for review" are an incorrect presumption in at least this case. All I am saying is: we didn't build the boat for review, we didn't submit the boat for review, we had no input or involvement in the review or test, and were not consulted.

Can I be clearer I wonder?

As far as I am aware this is generally the case.

[Guest]

your words: " if I was submitting a boat I had built for review" are an incorrect presumption in at least this case. All I am saying is: we didn't build the boat for review, we didn't submit the boat for review, we had no input or involvement in the review or test, and were not consulted.

Can I be clearer I wonder?

As far as I am aware this is generally the case.

 

and to the point of magazines only generally write positive articles about boats they review (bearing in mind this is the main thrust of the thread) - what difference does this make?

[carlt]

As far as I am aware this is generally the case.

So you never contacted the mags telling them that you are building a boat that they may be interested in featuring?

 

In my experience this is how it works, though the adspace reps will be doing all they can to offer sweeteners, too.

[Ally]

The thread earlier, in one or two comments was implying that reviews were effectively adverts....in some ways I suppose they can be seen as such....but I merely was originally pointing out that the builders aren't party to the reviews. (Of course, I could be the only builder who naively isn't involved, but I very much doubt that)

Therefore the reviews are not pre-biaised by the builders.

In my (and I only speak in MY experience)experience, boat reviews are, admittedly, looking at above average builds, which I (personally) have found many people like to look to for good ideas and designs on which to base parts of their own builds...be it a pro or self build.

Yes, it may be refreshing to have a below average boat reviewed....but there are legal lines that the magazines need to restrict themselves to, to avoid court...and they would be less usefull to those looking for help/ideas for their own boats perhaps?

 

In your words from another thread...(when you also argued a simple clear and sincere post I made for a dog treat recipe (!))..........This is where I bow out.

I'm sure most readers will have understood my point.

Good night!

 

So you never contacted the mags telling them that you are building a boat that they may be interested in featuring?

 

In my experience this is how it works, though the adspace reps will be doing all they can to offer sweeteners, too.

No Carl.

[Guest]

The thread earlier, in one or two comments was implying that reviews were effectively adverts....in some ways I suppose they can be seen as such....

 

at last..

[Ally]

at last..

nice to know you read ALL of that post!

[Guest]

nice to know you read ALL of that post!

 

 

well I certainly read the bit that said you'd 'bowed out' of this thread so a tad surprised TBH that you are still posting in it...