Self pump out toilet

[DeanS]

Hi

 

I've recently bought an older boat, and wanting to put in a pump out style toilet, due to the large number of toilet users we'll have on the boat (wife, myself, 3 kids, and a father in law). We suspect that portapotti types would need emptying far too often, and thus a holding tank is probably best. I know that there are automated pump outs which charge per pump out....but....and I suspect I may be shot for asking this......apparently I can fit my own pump for pumping out.....which then lets me pump it into the Elsan disposal sewage system. (cleanly of course..). Does anyone know if this would be a problem (gongoozlers,fellow boaters may object). Lastly, if I did decide to pay for a pump out...do I need to fit a specific kind of connection to my holding tank?

 

I've been idling on the forum for some time, but as a future liveaboard, the questions are endless

 

Thanks in advance.

Dean

[RLWP]

Hi

 

I've recently bought an older boat, and wanting to put in a pump out style toilet, due to the large number of toilet users we'll have on the boat (wife, myself, 3 kids, and a father in law). We suspect that portapotti types would need emptying far too often, and thus a holding tank is probably best. I know that there are automated pump outs which charge per pump out....but....and I suspect I may be shot for asking this......apparently I can fit my own pump for pumping out.....which then lets me pump it into the Elsan disposal sewage system. (cleanly of course..). Does anyone know if this would be a problem (gongoozlers,fellow boaters may object). Lastly, if I did decide to pay for a pump out...do I need to fit a specific kind of connection to my holding tank?

 

I've been idling on the forum for some time, but as a future liveaboard, the questions are endless

 

Thanks in advance.

Dean

 

 

I'm afraid that the problem lies here:

 

lets me pump it into the Elsan disposal sewage system.

 

Unfortunately it doesn't. It does if the point is designated to accept self pump-out but otherwise you can't because they aren't designed to accept the quantity of material from a pump out in a short time.

 

Richard

 

(pump-out owner)

[Speedwheel]

popcorn at the ready

[DeanS]

I have visions of the automated pump out sucking my entire holding tank into a little cube:) - Will this be ok as a toilet holding tank - http://www.tanks-direct.co.uk/100_litre_water_tanks/125_litre_water_tank_-_flat

 

Someone else mentioned adding a 3/4" copper vent pipe, with a 12V fan , controlled by a pneumatic timer which can be run to air out the holding tank and stop the growth of smelly things.

 

The questions then, are:

 

1. Would a plastic holding tank be ok, or do I really need to weld a metal one together,

2. Does it need a large vent hole, or any vent hole, or should it be completely sealed.

3. Did I mention I am installing it in a storage area under my father in laws bed

 

a question not answered is..

 

4. Do I need to install a certain type of connection hole for the automated pipes.

 

Thanks again..

Dean

[cotswoldsman]

popcorn at the ready

 

Enjoy your popcorn as here I go!!

 

Hi

 

I've recently bought an older boat, and wanting to put in a pump out style toilet, due to the large number of toilet users we'll have on the boat (wife, myself, 3 kids, and a father in law). We suspect that portapotti types would need emptying far too often, and thus a holding tank is probably best. I know that there are automated pump outs which charge per pump out....but....and I suspect I may be shot for asking this......apparently I can fit my own pump for pumping out.....which then lets me pump it into the Elsan disposal sewage system. (cleanly of course..). Does anyone know if this would be a problem (gongoozlers,fellow boaters may object). Lastly, if I did decide to pay for a pump out...do I need to fit a specific kind of connection to my holding tank?

 

I've been idling on the forum for some time, but as a future liveaboard, the questions are endless

 

Thanks in advance.

Dean

 

 

self pumpout is disgusting and if you can't afford a pumpout buy a cassette!!

 

 

[DeanS]

I'm only asking whether the suggestion (do it yourself) I received from another long term liveaboard, was really a viable solution. At this point I'm thinking it's not. Personally I have no problem with casettes, but with 6 people, surely I'll be emptying them every day. Planning on fitting one of these - http://www.mailspeedmarine.com/toilet-systems/jabsco/economy-electric-toilets75.bhtml ...into one of these - http://www.tanks-direct.co.uk/100_litre_water_tanks/125_litre_water_tank_-_flat . Would that work:) Steep learning curve.

[nb Innisfree]

I have visions of the automated pump out sucking my entire holding tank into a little cube:) - Will this be ok as a toilet holding tank - http://www.tanks-direct.co.uk/100_litre_water_tanks/125_litre_water_tank_-_flat

 

Someone else mentioned adding a 3/4" copper vent pipe, with a 12V fan , controlled by a pneumatic timer which can be run to air out the holding tank and stop the growth of smelly things.

 

The questions then, are:

 

1. Would a plastic holding tank be ok, or do I really need to weld a metal one together,

2. Does it need a large vent hole, or any vent hole, or should it be completely sealed.

3. Did I mention I am installing it in a storage area under my father in laws bed

 

a question not answered is..

 

4. Do I need to install a certain type of connection hole for the automated pipes.

 

Thanks again..

Dean

 

Are you saying you want to pump contents of holding tank into a secondary tank, if so why?

 

if you are referring to the main holding tank then you must realize that with 5 persons on board you will need quite a large tank, two of us have a 700 litre tank which can be filled in as little as 3 weeks but usually lasts 6 weeks or more. Polypropylene is usually the best material, mild steel and stainless steel can corrode from the inside. You need a large vent, 1.5". You say "automated pipes", not sure what you mean by this.

[HouseMartin]

A vacuum toilet will break up solids to maximise cassette use. If you choose a p/o tank, get the largest you can afford to minimise no. of p/o charges.

[DeanS]

Are you saying you want to pump contents of holding tank into a secondary tank, if so why?

 

if you are referring to the main holding tank then you must realize that with 5 persons on board you will need quite a large tank, two of us have a 700 litre tank which can be filled in as little as 3 weeks but usually lasts 6 weeks or more. Polypropylene is usually the best material, mild steel and stainless steel can corrode from the inside. You need a large vent, 1.5". You say "automated pipes", not sure what you mean by this.

 

 

Nope..only 1 tank, but didnt know if a plastic tank would be strong enough to cope with the "vacuum/suction" from the automated machines. I dont mind a weekly pump out. ( The only area I have to put in a tank, is about 50cmx50cmx100cm ,,but will need to search for a tank that fits inside that. (They come pre-sized). By "automated pipes" I was asking whether the Pump Out stations have a specific end fitting of some sort where they connect to the boat to suck out the holding tank...?"

 

Thanks everyone..learning a lot.

[sueb]

Hi

 

I've recently bought an older boat, and wanting to put in a pump out style toilet, due to the large number of toilet users we'll have on the boat (wife, myself, 3 kids, and a father in law). We suspect that portapotti types would need emptying far too often, and thus a holding tank is probably best. I know that there are automated pump outs which charge per pump out....but....and I suspect I may be shot for asking this......apparently I can fit my own pump for pumping out.....which then lets me pump it into the Elsan disposal sewage system. (cleanly of course..). Does anyone know if this would be a problem (gongoozlers,fellow boaters may object). Lastly, if I did decide to pay for a pump out...do I need to fit a specific kind of connection to my holding tank?

 

I've been idling on the forum for some time, but as a future liveaboard, the questions are endless

 

Thanks in advance.

Dean

Ignore those who don't like self pumpouts. We have been using a self pump out for 20yrs. Lee Sanitation can provide all your needs and they have a web site. Yes the tank does need to be vented and a fitting to take the self pumpout pipe.

Good luck and have fun

[DeanS]

Ignore those who don't like self pumpouts. We have been using a self pump out for 20yrs. Lee Sanitation can provide all your needs and they have a web site. Yes the tank does need to be vented and a fitting to take the self pumpout pipe.

Good luck and have fun

 

THANKS:))) 20yrs....good for you. !

[ditchcrawler]

Hi

 

I've recently bought an older boat, and wanting to put in a pump out style toilet, due to the large number of toilet users we'll have on the boat (wife, myself, 3 kids, and a father in law). We suspect that portapotti types would need emptying far too often, and thus a holding tank is probably best. I know that there are automated pump outs which charge per pump out....but....and I suspect I may be shot for asking this......apparently I can fit my own pump for pumping out.....which then lets me pump it into the Elsan disposal sewage system. (cleanly of course..). Does anyone know if this would be a problem (gongoozlers,fellow boaters may object). Lastly, if I did decide to pay for a pump out...do I need to fit a specific kind of connection to my holding tank?

 

I've been idling on the forum for some time, but as a future liveaboard, the questions are endless

 

Thanks in advance.

Dean

Some elsan disposal points indicate they are suitable for self pump outs, Braunston GU and Cropredy are two that I know of,some are marked as not suitable, Bottom of Atherstone locks and Braunston turn.

The tank outlets are now mostly standard and if you go to some like Midland Chandlers and order a deck pumpout fitting most pumpout setups will fit it.

 

Enjoy your popcorn as here I go!!

 

 

 

 

self pumpout is disgusting and if you can't afford a pumpout buy a cassette!!

No more gisgusting than tipping up a cassette over a hole while looking the other way and having it splash every where. Yes some boaters do that.

[steve hayes]

No more gisgusting than tipping up a cassette over a hole while looking the other way and having it splash every where. Yes some boaters do that.

 

Quite right, I know our tank gets a bit fresh in the summer, but thats nowt compared to the smells emitted from some elsan stations in summer

 

Also I know you pay for a pumpout, but normally that means someone else does it

 

I just wish our SaniMarine loo was a bit better sucker of stuff

[DeanS]

Quite right, I know our tank gets a bit fresh in the summer, but thats nowt compared to the smells emitted from some elsan stations in summer

 

Also I know you pay for a pumpout, but normally that means someone else does it

 

I just wish our SaniMarine loo was a bit better sucker of stuff

 

 

 

erm....what do you mean your tank gets fresh in the summer. I'm fitting it under the father in laws bed..(honest)...don't want him moaning down the line....someone suggested a computer van, and a pneumatic switch, and a 3/4" extra vent to keep oxygen in it....does it work to pour loads of chemicals down the toilet to keep it smelling lovely.?

 

[Keeping Up]

You don't need a fan or a switch, and you won't get a smell around the tank itself as long as you use the correct grade of hose etc.. You must have enough ventilation for the tank - ideally two similar-sized hoses should go to the outside, one for the pump-out fitting and one for the ventilation. People often fall into the trap of making the vent smaller, and that is when it will smell. The vent can be in the side of the boat below the gunwale so that it doesn't let rainwater fill the tank, and it's best not to position it any closer to a window than necessary because you can get some smell from the open vent.

 

The "Blue" chemical IMHO smells worse than the odour that it tries to mask, Use one of the other options - for example I buy a biological digester that is designed for farmers to use in their septic tanks, it's usually supplied to them in large quantities but the supplier makes me up a litre at a time (enough for a year's worth of living aboard) for about £25. Even though I've got an old-fashioned dump-through toilet, there is no smell.

[nb Innisfree]

Nope..only 1 tank, but didnt know if a plastic tank would be strong enough to cope with the "vacuum/suction" from the automated machines. I dont mind a weekly pump out. ( The only area I have to put in a tank, is about 50cmx50cmx100cm ,,but will need to search for a tank that fits inside that. (They come pre-sized). By "automated pipes" I was asking whether the Pump Out stations have a specific end fitting of some sort where they connect to the boat to suck out the holding tank...?"

 

Thanks everyone..learning a lot.

 

Polypropelene tanks are strong enough if installed properly, make sure it is well supported and well ventilated, the vent should always be open, not closable or else you could collapse your tank when pumping out we have a separate 1.5" closable rinse out in addition to a permanently open 1.5" vent + a pump out, better to be safe than sorry! they are roof mounted but some boats have them in the gunwale. You can have poly tanks made to measure, Stanza Fabrications did ours. You size tank will hold 250 litres.

 

Pump out stations have a standard fitting to fit a standard p/o boat fitting.

Edited October 3, 2010 by nb Innisfree

[DeanS]

You don't need a fan or a switch, and you won't get a smell around the tank itself as long as you use the correct grade of hose etc.. You must have enough ventilation for the tank - ideally two similar-sized hoses should go to the outside, one for the pump-out fitting and one for the ventilation. People often fall into the trap of making the vent smaller, and that is when it will smell. The vent can be in the side of the boat below the gunwale so that it doesn't let rainwater fill the tank, and it's best not to position it any closer to a window than necessary because you can get some smell from the open vent.

 

The "Blue" chemical IMHO smells worse than the odour that it tries to mask, Use one of the other options - for example I buy a biological digester that is designed for farmers to use in their septic tanks, it's usually supplied to them in large quantities but the supplier makes me up a litre at a time (enough for a year's worth of living aboard) for about £25. Even though I've got an old-fashioned dump-through toilet, there is no smell.

 

 

Great thanks...I'll try without the fan...make sure it's vented properly, and if Pops says something is smelling , I'll look at the sky and whistle ,,,and blame it on one of the kids flatulence.

[RLWP]

Polypropelene tanks are strong enough if installed properly, make sure it is well supported and well ventilated, the vent should always be open, not closable or else you could collapse your tank when pumping out we have a separate 1.5" closable rinse out in addition to a permanently open 1.5" vent + a pump out, better to be safe than sorry! they are roof mounted but some boats have them in the gunwale. You can have poly tanks made to measure, Stanza Fabrications did ours. You size tank will hold 250 litres.

 

Pump out stations have a standard fitting to fit a standard p/o boat fitting.

 

It would be advantageous to have a tank made to be sure that the top of the tank is stiff enough to support the weight of the - er - user.

 

Don't forget all the other things you'll need to do. Our tanks are sunk into the floor to put the seat at the right height. They also pass through a bulkhead so that the seat is in the bathroom and the tank is under a bed or bench. These things are relatively easy to do, but it's surprising how much of the boat you have to take apart to do them

 

Richard

[DeanS]

It would be advantageous to have a tank made to be sure that the top of the tank is stiff enough to support the weight of the - er - user.

 

Don't forget all the other things you'll need to do. Our tanks are sunk into the floor to put the seat at the right height. They also pass through a bulkhead so that the seat is in the bathroom and the tank is under a bed or bench. These things are relatively easy to do, but it's surprising how much of the boat you have to take apart to do them

 

Richard

 

 

Good point:) I'm hoping to buy something like this - http://www.mailspeedmarine.com/toilet-systems/jabsco/economy-electric-toilets75.bhtml and put the holding tank on the other side of the back wall...which is a storage area at the moment. Any idea if there is a problem for a toilet to take waste out at floor level, and send it up into the top of the holding tank......sorry..I know you might not know the answer, but maybe someone else does... I dont have room to put the tank under the toilet....the tank needs to sit on the same floor level the toilet sits on......

 

 

HELP:)

[RLWP]

Good point:) I'm hoping to buy something like this - http://www.mailspeedmarine.com/toilet-systems/jabsco/economy-electric-toilets75.bhtml and put the holding tank on the other side of the back wall...which is a storage area at the moment. Any idea if there is a problem for a toilet to take waste out at floor level, and send it up into the top of the holding tank......sorry..I know you might not know the answer, but maybe someone else does... I dont have room to put the tank under the toilet....the tank needs to sit on the same floor level the toilet sits on......

 

 

HELP:)

 

Ah! I see, an electric mascerator toilet.

 

I've no idea about those, except they make a lot of noise macerating things in the middle of the night, need electric and get blocked up.

 

Good luck, I'm bailing out

 

Richard

 

(very satisfied dump-through pump-out owner)

[Keeping Up]

(very satisfied dump-through pump-out owner)

I suppose that's better than a pump-through dump-out

 

 

[Bobbybass]

I fitted the whole kit and kaboodle pump out from Lee San using a 60 gallon under bed tank. After a year...there was a nasty sharp sort of smell that came from the flexible white hose that they provided. I tried many ways to hide this...but eventually gave up...went back to Lee San....had an argument that their ' flexible pipe was fine....it must be me'...and then I bought solid solvent weld pipe.

This is wonderful...I no longer have the slightest smell from this...and would recommend people to fit it rather than the flexible. The flexible isn't that flexible either..its like wrestling a python !. I used Lee San..gentle sweeping bends to avoid blockage.

Bob

[DeanS]

Ah! I see, an electric mascerator toilet.

 

I've no idea about those, except they make a lot of noise macerating things in the middle of the night, need electric and get blocked up.

 

Good luck, I'm bailing out

 

Richard

 

(very satisfied dump-through pump-out owner)

 

 

When you say "dump through".....does the flush just whisk everything as is, into a holding tank. Can that holding tank me next to it, rather than under it. I was also looking at the cheaper manual toilets without the elec. Undecided. So far I've concluded I definately need a holding tank, with a closed vent (for rinsing), an open vent (for odours), a big inlet from the toilet, and a big outlet for pump out. At the moment I'm stuck on how to get the toliet to flush into the holding tank....if toilet and tank are on the same floor level, and want the ..erm...goods....to enter the holding tank from the top...obviously.

 

Would be thankful for anyone with advice on how to "move" the goods from bottom of toilet to top of holding tank effectively.

[Keeping Up]

A dump-through just sits on top of the tank (not ideal if the tank is under someone's bed!). That's why they don't need electrics and they are pretty reliable.

 

You don't have to have a separate vent for rinsing, you can put the rinse hose in the pump-out hole (after removing the pump nozzle of course) or with a dump-through you can rinse through from the toilet itself (which is what I do).

 

You seem to suggest a size difference between the vent and the pumping outlet. I suggest you make them the same size.

[ditchcrawler]

You don't need a fan or a switch, and you won't get a smell around the tank itself as long as you use the correct grade of hose etc.. You must have enough ventilation for the tank - ideally two similar-sized hoses should go to the outside, one for the pump-out fitting and one for the ventilation. People often fall into the trap of making the vent smaller, and that is when it will smell. The vent can be in the side of the boat below the gunwale so that it doesn't let rainwater fill the tank, and it's best not to position it any closer to a window than necessary because you can get some smell from the open vent.

 

The "Blue" chemical IMHO smells worse than the odour that it tries to mask, Use one of the other options - for example I buy a biological digester that is designed for farmers to use in their septic tanks, it's usually supplied to them in large quantities but the supplier makes me up a litre at a time (enough for a year's worth of living aboard) for about £25. Even though I've got an old-fashioned dump-through toilet, there is no smell.

I am a bit bothered about the tank you are planning to use, Smell is a problem if joints, pipes fittings including lids and tank material is not of the correct spec. so take great care if selecting a tank not made for the job(ie)