Solid Fuel Stoves

[Ros P]

Does anyone know how steam railway societies manage similar BSI issues? I'm sure there must be some sort of dispensation for a steam loco to run in its original condition rather than having to comply with whatever the current BSI is for modern trains? Might be a useful parallel to quote when making objections/constructive criticism of the draft standards.

 

Ros

[carlt]

is the same old thing again, if we all stick together, stand our ground in some way, make ourselves heard, you dont see the frogs taking crap from officialdom, they retalliate

And then we slag them off, for disrupting our holidays.

[Speedwheel]

I think the owners of historic boats will continue to do what they have always done with rules like this - Ignore them!

[Derek R.]

Clearly this subject will not be 'going away', and although there is little more to add at this stage, there is an HNBOC member on the BSS advisory committee who is keen to keep an eye on proceedings and present the 'historic' view, attempting to making any recommendations NOT retrospective. So far it appears the 'trade' are not considering the proposals appropriate.

 

The BSS secretariat (we're all comrades here?) is suggesting that the BSI code will only look forward. I would hesitate to believe that will exempt historic boats. The head can swivel both ways, and it is claimed the BSS will be the ones who decide whether such recommendations will be retrospective or not. We are in 'committee' land - several of them, and there is only thing committees are good at on this level.

 

"Argiment won't get us there any quicker" said Dad.

"Nor can the perishin 'orse" said Ma.

 

Derek

[Keeping Up]

Clearly this subject will not be 'going away', and although there is little more to add at this stage, there is an HNBOC member on the BSS advisory committee who is keen to keep an eye on proceedings and present the 'historic' view, attempting to making any recommendations NOT retrospective. So far it appears the 'trade' are not considering the proposals appropriate.

 

The BSS secretariat (we're all comrades here?) is suggesting that the BSI code will only look forward. I would hesitate to believe that will exempt historic boats. The head can swivel both ways, and it is claimed the BSS will be the ones who decide whether such recommendations will be retrospective or not. We are in 'committee' land - several of them, and there is only thing committees are good at on this level.

A specific exemption for historic boats would be no use at all to the thousands of existing non-historic boats which may one day be forced to remove their stoves, or will unable to get them repaired or replaced because their positioning doesn't comply, if the rules become in any way retrospective.

[Phoenix_V]

Thanks Mark,

 

It might be of some note, and I quote from the pdf of the draft BS 8511:-

 

"As a code of practice, this British Standard takes the form of guidance and recommendations. It should not be quoted as if it were a specification and particular care should be taken to ensure that claims of compliance are not misleading."

 

The full pdf is

here but if you wish to comment, and propose any changes to the draft, you will need to access the version which allows you to do so on this one.

It takes you to the BSI draft review system site and requires registration. Painless and free, an email will shortly after give you a password to access the draft. It's the same content as the pdf, but comment and proposal text boxes are there to fill in. Once submitted, each individual submission is emailed back to you for a record of your comment and proposal.

 

If you do not do it, BSI will consider you have no objection to the new standard.

 

Despite the quoted line from the standard above in italics, it will inevitably be used by insurance companies and waterways authorities to be the bench mark by which all regulations will be set. Without compliance to regulations set by the authorities, licences may be witheld. Did someone whisper/shout "Blackmail"? I'm sure I heard it.

 

Those who live their lives by the regulation book, will consider such regulations are a benefit to all in that they reduce the numbers of accidents that may take place, and that life, and the world is a safer place to be. I will not make comment on that as it would be little more than one persons opinion, but regulations are frequently drawn up by persons who have little or NO experience in the field they are regulating, perhaps even NO interest.

 

My late Father once said to me while still a small boy:- "Sometimes you need elbows to get to the table. But you can be sure - there's nothing for the dumb!"

 

Speak up boys and girls.

 

Bump

 

The deadline for comment on the BS website is 30 April. I have added some comments, which a little to my surprise got through the moderators but it is disappointing how few comments there are, these ideas will affect new build and ultimately all craft not just historic craft so come on you guys post some appropriate comments on the BS website about their dafter proposals, you never know it may have some influence and far better to try now whilst it is not yet set in stone!

[Derek R.]

Bump

 

The deadline for comment on the BS website is 30 April. I have added some comments, which a little to my surprise got through the moderators but it is disappointing how few comments there are, these ideas will affect new build and ultimately all craft not just historic craft so come on you guys post some appropriate comments on the BS website about their dafter proposals, you never know it may have some influence and far better to try now whilst it is not yet set in stone!

 

A timely reminder. Also bumped elsewhere.

[Smelly]

I thought this was more of a trade thing, but having adequately fitted three stoves, having read the consultation understand otherwise. The proposals are crazy... Factory produced chimneys won't be cheap never mind needing a hearth at least 125mm thick if it's not fastened to "non combustible material" (steel hearth plates in all new builds perchance?)

 

To maintain the clearances suggested would mean leaving a new fire in the middle of the boat.

 

I always thought it was good practice to use fireproof sheet behind the tiles, and what does worry me is that reading the MAIB/BSS stuff so many boats have tiles fastened directly back to the ply/mdf... now at that level is where decent legislation could make life safer, not going completely over the top as is proposed.

 

Please, any potential DIYers read it... it's ridiculous and will make your job so much more difficult and expensive, and needlessly so!

[Phoenix_V]

I thought this was more of a trade thing, but having adequately fitted three stoves, having read the consultation understand otherwise. The proposals are crazy... Factory produced chimneys won't be cheap never mind needing a hearth at least 125mm thick if it's not fastened to "non combustible material" (steel hearth plates in all new builds perchance?)

 

To maintain the clearances suggested would mean leaving a new fire in the middle of the boat.

 

I always thought it was good practice to use fireproof sheet behind the tiles, and what does worry me is that reading the MAIB/BSS stuff so many boats have tiles fastened directly back to the ply/mdf... now at that level is where decent legislation could make life safer, not going completely over the top as is proposed.

 

Please, any potential DIYers read it... it's ridiculous and will make your job so much more difficult and expensive, and needlessly so!

 

 

Dont just read it send them your comments!

[rjasmith]

Well - I've put my comments in now (last night). Hopefully the BS moderators will accept them for consideration.

 

There are some good ones in there now, especially in defence of the traditional back cabin stove. (you can read other peoples comments once the mods have passed them).

 

I've tried to be a bit more general though and criticised the attempt to plagiarise the Building regs and simply mentioning the word "boat" instead of "house" a few times! (Perhaps I exaggerate a little!).

 

Don't get me wrong though - the stuff in it about shielding the stove sides and back is mostly good and will not allow anyone just to stick tiles on plywood in future!

 

Anyone else going to put some comments in? The more the merrier!

 

Register here if you want to read and comment

 

I can send you the full pdf of the draft Code of Practice if you PM me

 

Richard

[rjasmith]

Actually I've just Googled for the BS Code of Practice and found that the full draft is available here as a pdf .

 

It is much easier to read like this than via the BS comment site. Gary Peacock's original link to it seems to have changed and no longer works

 

Richard