The water filler cap on the well deck does not meet up with the water tank

[DandD]

This is our 2nd boat, built by NSM Narrowboats (now out of business) on a Colecraft shell.  Unlike our first boat which had an integral water tank, this has a stainless steel one.  When we filled up, I expected water to overflow through the well deck drain hole when the tank was full.  It didn't, but when we checked, it looked full so we stopped fillling.  A couple of days later we noticed a wet patch on the cabin floor and discovered the cabin bilge was completely full of water.  .  By peering down the filler hole we can see that the top of the water tank is not connected to the fitting on the well deck, so any overflow goes down the side of the tank and into the cabin bilge.  The hole in the tank is not even directly below the well deck fitting.   Has anyone come across this before, and is there a fix other than vigilance when topping up the tank?  We have established that there are no pipe leaks (the water pump does not come on unexpectedly) and there is no leak from the shower pump.  If we are super-careful when taking on water, the cabin bilge stays dry.

[Jen-in-Wellies]

Welcome to the forum.

There should be a length of hose between the well deck fitting and the stainless steel tank. My boat is like this, though a different builder. It also has the tank opening and the well deck opening not being aligned. Unfortunately, you may need to remove some of the lining inside the cabin by the bow doors to access the tank and fit a length of suitable hose, plus jubilee clips. The tank should also have an air vent pipe on it that goes to a higher level air vent. That it doesn't have the filler hose installed makes me worry that the air vent isn't right either.

When installed properly, there shouldn't be a need to fill carefully. Most people stick the hose in, turn on the tap and stop the fill when water comes out of the filler in the deck.

[magnetman]

That's terrible! 

 

Hopefully you can put a connecting pipe of some sort in there. Does the deck fitting have a bit protruding downwards for a flexible hose to be clamped onto? 

 

At least it is summer. There is never a good time to have a cabin bilge full of water but ...

 

 

[DandD]

Thanks Magnetman and Jen-in-wellies.  Sorry I can't see how to reply individually!  Magentman, yes it does have a bit of pipe sticking down.  Jen-in-wellies, we emailed Colecraft to see if they had come across this issue.  Gary called us and said he hadn't, but suggested we would need to remove the lining inside the cabin to have a proper look, as you have.  Sadly the fitters lined the inside of the boat before they fitted the cupboards, so access won't be easy, especially as the decorative bits that conceal the joins appear to have been glued on.  D will need to bring the jigsaw on our next visit.  Thanks for this fabulous welcome to the forum!

PS I did find the air vent, we will check this out too, thanks.

Edited July 10, 2023 by DandD
additional info

[Jen-in-Wellies]

9 hours ago, magnetman said:

Hopefully you can put a connecting pipe of some sort in there. Does the deck fitting have a bit protruding downwards for a flexible hose to be clamped onto? 

The water filler fitting in the well deck should look something like this one

https://www.midlandchandlers.co.uk/products/ag-water-filler-chrome-1-3-8-neck-ad-015-m

With a bit of luck, the bit that the hose clamps on is for the same size hose as the corresponding bit on the water tank. The diameter will need measuring before shopping for a bit of hose, as they aren't all the same.

[matty40s]

We dealt with a boat recently that had one of those in the well deck. Someone had put the hose in it and left it running. A few hours later it was noticed that the back end was low.

The rear cabin was a good 6 inches of water under, which stretched forward to the bathroom.

We started by using the wet room pump in the bathroom, and then using a holesaw managed to cut a hole in the flooring(2 sheets ply plus oak block,)and get a larger pump working. Warm days and a dehumidifier for a week saved the interior.

 

In front of the well deck fitting was a steel raised seat, with a cushion on it. Under the cushion was another of those fittings.....connected to the water tank!!

[Jen-in-Wellies]

22 minutes ago, matty40s said:

We dealt with a boat recently that had one of those in the well deck. Someone had put the hose in it and left it running. A few hours later it was noticed that the back end was low.

The rear cabin was a good 6 inches of water under, which stretched forward to the bathroom.

We started by using the wet room pump in the bathroom, and then using a holesaw managed to cut a hole in the flooring(2 sheets ply plus oak block,)and get a larger pump working. Warm days and a dehumidifier for a week saved the interior.

 

In front of the well deck fitting was a steel raised seat, with a cushion on it. Under the cushion was another of those fittings.....connected to the water tank!!

The boat safety scheme says that unused fuel filler fittings must be sealed so they can only be opened with tools, but nothing about unused water filler fittings!

[Tonka]

20 minutes ago, Jen-in-Wellies said:

The boat safety scheme says that unused fuel filler fittings must be sealed so they can only be opened with tools, but nothing about unused water filler fittings!

But is a hexagonal key classed as a tool?

[Jen-in-Wellies]

3 minutes ago, Tonka said:

But is a hexagonal key classed as a tool?

You'd need to ask the BSS people. I have an unused diesel tank to supply a heater. The filler cap has medium grip thread lock on it and the whole thing is painted over. It isn't coming out without some work, so resistant to accidental use.

[dmr]

The tank needs connecting properly.

This might sound drastic but cutting a big square hole in the deck might actually be quicker and less destructive than removing the cabin lining.

 

Experienced welders think nothing of cutting a hole to get access and welding up afterwards. The painting will be the most tedious bit.

This will leave a visible weld (unless you do a really good job) but this is what rubber mats are made for 😀

[Tonka]

4 minutes ago, Jen-in-Wellies said:

You'd need to ask the BSS people. I have an unused diesel tank to supply a heater. The filler cap has medium grip thread lock on it and the whole thing is painted over. It isn't coming out without some work, so resistant to accidental use.

If it unused then surely the label saying what it is used for should be removed

[Jen-in-Wellies]

Just now, Tonka said:

If it unused then surely the label saying what it is used for should be removed

Better tell the BSS that! I'm not grinding out the Diesel in the brass cap unless I have to.

[Drayke]

12 hours ago, DandD said:

This is our 2nd boat, built by NSM Narrowboats (now out of business) on a Colecraft shell.  Unlike our first boat which had an integral water tank, this has a stainless steel one.  When we filled up, I expected water to overflow through the well deck drain hole when the tank was full.  It didn't, but when we checked, it looked full so we stopped fillling.  A couple of days later we noticed a wet patch on the cabin floor and discovered the cabin bilge was completely full of water.  .  By peering down the filler hole we can see that the top of the water tank is not connected to the fitting on the well deck, so any overflow goes down the side of the tank and into the cabin bilge.  The hole in the tank is not even directly below the well deck fitting.   Has anyone come across this before, and is there a fix other than vigilance when topping up the tank?  We have established that there are no pipe leaks (the water pump does not come on unexpectedly) and there is no leak from the shower pump.  If we are super-careful when taking on water, the cabin bilge stays dry.

Can you pull out the front steps and go in behind them and get to the water tank, that way you maybe able connect a length of pipe to fill fitting and tank.

[pearley]

When our boat was delivered we were getting water draining down to the rear of the boat. Originally thought it was the shower drain as it could be turned in the tray. Aintrees came and resealed that but the water still came. 

 

Immediately after filling the tank the level visible in the filler could be seen to drop a few inches. I took the steps out and the panel below the front doors and using a torch could see that the water was leaking from one of the pipe fittings look leading to the vent. The only way to access it was to remove the drawers on the bedside cupboard and cut an access hole through the side of the drawer unit and then the bulkhead. Whoever fitted it had managed to lose the O rings from the fitting.

[matty40s]

6 hours ago, pearley said:

When our boat was delivered we were getting water draining down to the rear of the boat. Originally thought it was the shower drain as it could be turned in the tray. Aintrees came and resealed that but the water still came. 

 

Immediately after filling the tank the level visible in the filler could be seen to drop a few inches. I took the steps out and the panel below the front doors and using a torch could see that the water was leaking from one of the pipe fittings look leading to the vent. The only way to access it was to remove the drawers on the bedside cupboard and cut an access hole through the side of the drawer unit and then the bulkhead. Whoever fitted it had managed to lose the O rings from the fitting.

We dealt with an Aintree that filled its diesel tank from the canal. It wasnt welded at the top of the rudder stock tube, and every time the tiller was swung, water entered the tank. The owner had quite a few issues, one breakdown in Blisworth tunnel, and was at their wits end.

 

Lord knows how Aintree managed to pressure test the diesel tank succesfully, we managed to blow bubbles in the canal when connecting an air supply to the diesel filler.

[DandD]

What a lot of horror stories!  We are considering how to remove the panel at the end of the saloon - sadly the panel behind the steps only has a small opening to enable the water stop cock to be turned off, and the tank insulation prevents us seeing further.  We have also spotted an air vent on the outside of the bulkhead, close to the filler cap and behind the stove.  We will try removing this to see if we can see more, which is unlikely, but are going to take our time deciding what to do - if we can do it ourselves without getting a boatyard involved, then we will.  Thanks Magnetman for the warning about hose measurements.