Aire & Calder gets a new 'big-boat'

[Alan de Enfield]

Welcome return to commercial use of Aire and Calder Navigation to link Hull and Leeds (msn.com)

 

 

The 500-tonne capacity barge MMS Off-Roader has started using the historic Aire and Calder Navigation to transport marine aggregate from the city’s Albert Dock to Leeds. It follows significant investment from Hull maritime firm MMS Workboats, AC Marine Aggregates and the Canal and River Trust, and extensive trials.

Each trip is welcome news for those using the strategic road network too, eliminating up to 25 heavy goods vehicles from the A62 and M62. It is hoped more companies will follow the lead.

 

Regular commercial traffic has not used the route for more than a decade. The trip starts its journey at the port, using the Humber to head inland, with the vessel locking into the canal at Goole before heading to Knostrop, to the south of Leeds. From there the aggregates are distributed by land across the local building industry.

David Lowe, of the Commercial Boat Operators Association, said: “Commercial traffic is returning to the Aire and Calder Canal after a lot of hard work by a lot of people. Britain’s waterways are an underused part of the transport network, with an ability to deliver heavy goods in a quiet but efficient way that helps keep heavy lorries off the roads. The run of MMS Off-Roader is something to celebrate and is the largest vessel to reach central Leeds for 30 years.”

 

 

 

Largest vessel ever welcomed to the Humber as near 20-year record sunk

333-metre Maran Lupus calls at Immingham Oil Terminal to deliver crude for refining

 

Largest vessel ever welcomed to the Humber as near 20-year record sunk - Business Live (business-live.co.uk)

 

The largest vessel to ever grace the Humber has been welcomed.

Maran Lupus, a 333m long oil tanker, moored at Immingham Oil Terminal this week. The crude carrier, sailing under the Greek flag, arrived on Monday morning, and is wider than the length of many vessels using the estuary, with a breadth of 60m.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Continue reading

 

[Guest]

Great news!

 

I wonder what the latest is with complaints by the fisherpeople.

 

Were there not some claims these big boats were killing fish??

[PD1964]

2 hours ago, M_JG said:

Great news!

 

I wonder what the latest is with complaints by the fisherpeople.

 

Were there not some claims these big boats were killing fish??

You know there was, here’s the Post.

It’s the old Humber Princess, Lets see if it’s financially viable as last time I talked to the the tanker crew they said CaRT had put a lot of restrictions on them with regards to load and running hours.

 

Edited March 4, 2023 by PD1964

[Guest]

Paging @fanshaft

 

Somebody who will know what they are talking about.

[PD1964]

4 minutes ago, M_JG said:

Paging @fanshaft

 

Somebody who will know what they are talking about.

Well you don’t, your querying the fish topic that you’ve put posts on.🎣🎣

Edited March 4, 2023 by PD1964

[Guest]

Meanwhile  - for those who enjoy the sight of a big boat on the A&CN.

 

Obviously not the boat in question!

 

Old footage from 10 years ago and in her old colours and under her old name.

 

 

 

And some gravel being shifted.

 

 

 

Edited March 4, 2023 by M_JG

[Orwellian]

32 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

Largest vessel ever welcomed to the Humber as near 20-year record sunk

Rather unfortunate wording don't you think?

[Alway Swilby]

2 hours ago, PD1964 said:

You know there was, here’s the Post.

It’s the old Humber Pride, Lets see if it’s financially viable as last time I talked to the the tanker crew they said CaRT had put a lot of restrictions on them with regards to load and running hours.

 

The Humber Pride is now called Exol Pride and carries oil products from Hull to Rotherham. It doesn't carry gravel to Leeds.

Edited to add: Unless things have changed in the last 6 months and Exol Pride has been converted into a gravel carrier.

Edited March 4, 2023 by Alway Swilby
Edited in case I got the facts wrong.

[PD1964]

27 minutes ago, Alway Swilby said:

The Humber Pride is now called Exol Pride and carries oil products from Hull to Rotherham. It doesn't carry gravel to Leeds.

 Yes sorry it ‘s the old Humber Princess which has been converted to gravel. Post amended 😂 

   I know I pass the Pride quite often, as I say last time I chatted to them they were saying CaRT are really messing them about with running hours/ timings and withdrawn manning the locks out of their working hours, so will be interesting to see if CaRT give their full support to this venture.

Edited March 4, 2023 by PD1964

[Guest]

8 minutes ago, Alway Swilby said:

Edited to add: Unless things have changed in the last 6 months and Exol Pride has been converted into a gravel carrier.

 

There appears to be some confusion here.

 

Exol Pride and MMS Off-Roader (the subject of the article) are two completely different vessels.

[PD1964]

@Alway Swilby seams both of us are thinking Princess but typing Pride.

  Pride still carrying oil as far as I’m aware and last I seen was Sept/Oct.

 

Edited March 4, 2023 by PD1964

[enigmatic]

Hope they've dredged it. Farndale supposedly had trouble with scraping cills too, and this looks like it's drawing a fair bit more.

[PD1964]

1 hour ago, enigmatic said:

Hope they've dredged it. Farndale supposedly had trouble with scraping cills too, and this looks like it's drawing a fair bit more.

Land & Water did extensive dredging last summer around the Knottingly area, I don’t know how effective it will be now?

Edited March 4, 2023 by PD1964

[Mike Todd]

19 hours ago, enigmatic said:

Hope they've dredged it. Farndale supposedly had trouble with scraping cills too, and this looks like it's drawing a fair bit more.

How does dredging affect scraping cills?

[enigmatic]

4 minutes ago, Mike Todd said:

How does dredging affect scraping cills?

It doesn't. 

[fanshaft]

On 04/03/2023 at 12:27, M_JG said:

Great news!

 

I wonder what the latest is with complaints by the fisherpeople.

 

Were there not some claims these big boats were killing fish??

There were such complaints.  Dredging of the affected section was carried out to provide a much greater cross section of the canal to enable fish and barges to co-exist.  It was thought to be a winter problem as fish had migrated to the sheltered waters.  The most recent barge movements have not apparently resulted in any fish mortality.

On 04/03/2023 at 14:38, PD1964 said:

 Yes sorry it ‘s the old Humber Princess which has been converted to gravel. Post amended 😂 

   I know I pass the Pride quite often, as I say last time I chatted to them they were saying CaRT are really messing them about with running hours/ timings and withdrawn manning the locks out of their working hours, so will be interesting to see if CaRT give their full support to this venture.

The Trust's Regional Operations Manager is very supportive and has agreed with CBOA to a number of initiatives to enable much less restriction on operating hours.  Amongst these, obviously, is recruiting and training more volunteer lock keepers., and also removing the unwritten restriction on self penning by barge crews.

20 hours ago, enigmatic said:

Hope they've dredged it. Farndale supposedly had trouble with scraping cills too, and this looks like it's drawing a fair bit more.

There has been no change to the lock cills.  The shallowest will allow a vessel draft of 2.5 metres plus a small margin - that is the maximum permitted/legal draft on the waterways to Leeds and Rotherham.  Dredging has been carried out at various points, including some more ploughing recently below Lemonroyd.  Dredging of the Wakefield branch is taking place in readiness for the new traffic from Birkwood quarry.

20 hours ago, enigmatic said:

Hope they've dredged it. Farndale supposedly had trouble with scraping cills too, and this looks like it's drawing a fair bit more.

The maximum draft of MMS Off Roader up the Aire & Calder is the same as Farndale or

any other vessel - 2.5 metres.  I think that's a payload of about 550 tonnes.

On 04/03/2023 at 14:32, Alway Swilby said:

The Humber Pride is now called Exol Pride and carries oil products from Hull to Rotherham. It doesn't carry gravel to Leeds.

Edited to add: Unless things have changed in the last 6 months and Exol Pride has been converted into a gravel carrier.

The load restriction up the SYN is because the last part of the route is along the first part of the unmodernised section of the waterway beyond the AMA (formerly BW) Depot.  British waterways did try dredging but bit's solid, and explosives were ruled out (I believe).  I was told the level can only be raised slightly when Exol Pride is due as it would otherwise cause flood damage.  I also understand that Pride takes a payload which suits the customer.

[Orwellian]

2 hours ago, fanshaft said:

also removing the unwritten restriction on self penning by barge crews.

This was always a ridiculous practice. So it's ok for a newbie leisure boater to use the big automated locks on the A&C but not a crew member on a commercial vessel. 

[PD1964]

2 hours ago, Orwellian said:

This was always a ridiculous practice. So it's ok for a newbie leisure boater to use the big automated locks on the A&C but not a crew member on a commercial vessel. 

CaRT need to be more flexible with the running of the carriers, both the oil and the gravel, they must be allowed to run when they can and need/want to. Extending their hours in the lighter Summer months if needed and taking the tide times into consideration for the tanker. Hopefully it can be a financial success for the carriers and hopefully everyone involved can work together with a sensible approach to make it so.

Edited March 5, 2023 by PD1964

[fanshaft]

3 hours ago, Orwellian said:

This was always a ridiculous practice. So it's ok for a newbie leisure boater to use the big automated locks on the A&C but not a crew member on a commercial vessel. 

I think the issue is that at most of the locks there are no designated lock landings for the large vessels for crew to safely get on and off although in reality anyone making the complete passage this way would have a crew member going ahead in a vehicle as I have done in the past.  But this is not a preference obviously. Pollington lock long chamber cannot be operated from the pedestals.

1 hour ago, PD1964 said:

CaRT need to be more flexible with the running of the carriers, both the oil and the gravel, they must be allowed to run when they can and need/want to. Extending their hours in the lighter Summer months if needed and taking the tide times into consideration for the tanker. Hopefully it can be a financial success for the carriers and hopefully everyone involved can work together with a sensible approach to make it so.

Well that is the intention, but the Trust needs reasonable notice to get the lock keepers organised and it does need to be when the traffic demand warrants.  Lighter evenings have no relevance at all as craft can and will operate all hours but tide times obviously do have a bearing. 

[BoatinglifeupNorth]

On 04/03/2023 at 12:24, Alan de Enfield said:

The 500-tonne capacity barge MMS Off-Roader has started using the historic Aire and Calder Navigation to transport marine aggregate

Seams that this has changed, I hear all the Leeds/Aire and Calder routes have now been scrapped and plans for a new aggregate wharf near Rotherham could be in the pipeline.  Today was a test run for the MMS Off-Roader from Goole-Rotherham the vessel was not carrying any load and followed the Exol Pride up this morning. Also word has it that the aggregate operation will be headed by Travis Perkins, which would make sense. Maybe @fanshaft may know a little more without revealing too much.

 

 

 

Edited November 8, 2023 by BoatinglifeupNorth

[Jen-in-Wellies]

31 minutes ago, BoatinglifeupNorth said:

Today was a test run for the MMS Off-Roader from Goole-Rotherham the vessel was not carrying any load and followed the Exol Pride up this morning.

Will they be made to share locks to conserve water? 😀

Lovely autumn colours in your picture.

[BoatinglifeupNorth]

@Jen-in-Wellies Rumour has it that all the electric wide locks will be widened to accommodate both boats and all trips will be on the same day to save on CaRT staffing, the cost for widening the locks will be funded through cycling and dog walker towpath tolls every mile👍
 Today for the trial run I heard that there was supposed to be 10 minutes to half an hour time frame between the boats moving, all the locks were manned by CaRT staff and volunteers, they both stayed overnight at Sykehouse Lock, by the time they got to Mexborough Lock there was over an hour and a half between them.
 The lock staffing seams to be an issue with both boats running on the same day with close timings. I imagine if anything comes of it they will have to travel different days. But it’s two separate freight companies so I imagine CaRT will have a say to when they can run?

Edited November 9, 2023 by BoatinglifeupNorth

[Jen-in-Wellies]

11 hours ago, BoatinglifeupNorth said:

@Jen-in-Wellies Rumour has it that all the electric wide locks will be widened to accommodate both boats and all trips will be on the same day to save on CaRT staffing, the cost for widening the locks will be funded through cycling and dog walker towpath tolls every mile👍

A sensible solution to the problem. 😀

Will there be a per-dog charge as well as for the walker? Will a chihuahua be charged the same as a great dane? Will a fat walker, or dog be charged extra for being a wide beam? I presume the S&SYN towpath counts as a broad one, but will the towpaths in the midlands have narrow gates on them to restrict them to thinner people?

 

[fanshaft]

14 hours ago, BoatinglifeupNorth said:

Seams that this has changed, I hear all the Leeds/Aire and Calder routes have now been scrapped and plans for a new aggregate wharf near Rotherham could be in the pipeline.  Today was a test run for the MMS Off-Roader from Goole-Rotherham the vessel was not carrying any load and followed the Exol Pride up this morning. Also word has it that the aggregate operation will be headed by Travis Perkins, which would make sense. Maybe @fanshaft may know a little more without revealing too much.

 

 

 

 

This is, of course, a welcome development and the enterprise of Rob and his team at MMS is to be applauded. In terms of aggregate distribution Travis Perkins is relatively small scale - just a part of their retail offer as builders merchants with a wide range of building materials.  TP took over JH Walker in York and when I visited they showed no interest in retaining or re-starting barge deliveries of bulk material as their aggregate was all sourced in bags rather than loose.  Likewise the TP canal side depot in Wakefield had not received supplies by barge for very many years.  TP are not established in Rotherham so that could be an opportunity if they can find a waterside site but the market for large scale movement of aggregate isn't to builders' merchants but to ready mix plants and the like.  In terms of Leeds (Stourton) this is an entirely separate development supported by the West Yorkshire Combined Authority (so clearly not a player in South Yorkshire!)  - the markets are quite distinct so there would be no reason to pursue an opportunity in Rotherham and not in Leeds.

6 minutes ago, fanshaft said:

This is, of course, a welcome development and the enterprise of Rob and his team at MMS is to be applauded. In terms of aggregate distribution Travis Perkins is relatively small scale - just a part of their retail offer as builders merchants with a wide range of building materials.  TP took over JH Walker in York and when I visited they showed no interest in retaining or re-starting barge deliveries of bulk material as their aggregate was all sourced in bags rather than loose.  Likewise the TP canal side depot in Wakefield had not received supplies by barge for very many years.  TP are not established in Rotherham* so that could be an opportunity if they can find a waterside site but the market for large scale movement of aggregate isn't to builders' merchants but to ready mix plants and the like.  In terms of Leeds (Stourton) this is an entirely separate development supported by the West Yorkshire Combined Authority (so clearly not a player in South Yorkshire!)  - the markets are quite distinct so there would be no reason to pursue an opportunity in Rotherham and not in Leeds.

*I should have said 'in central Rotherham'

D.

[Orwellian]

19 hours ago, BoatinglifeupNorth said:

I hear all the Leeds/Aire and Calder routes have now been scrapped

I notice Fanshaft didn't explicitly deny this statement. Is it true or false?