Jump to content

Full service bmc


JonT
 Share

Featured Posts

I have recently purchased a Springer with a BMC 1500, So I am planning a later full refurb, but for now I am going to do a full engine service and have a couple of questions and appreciate any advice you guys may have.

 

Engine code first bit of a geek so want to know what and where its from

So my engine code is:- 15p /785a/d ****

The first part is the engine size 15(00) is the p OHV? And 785 is that cylinder bore or capacity? A/D I think is automatic/diesel and then the engine serial number. I found a little info online but thought there would be a guru on here that would know

The block has JAM 1210 BIL I can't find anything about this I am assuming block indent and spec or capacity.

 

So as it has sat for a while I want to do as full service as I can to get it running, strip down later when needed. So my list so far is

Filters :- oil, air, fuel. is there anymore i should think of. And i was looking at the screw on conversion kits available for ease of use. Is there any difference between the cheap ones online or expensive ones from chandlers I see.

 

Oil change see table below, is this still the best option to go with an aged engine. Do I need to do the oil relief valve.

 

Going to drain all the fuel out of the tank and systems and replace with fresh, any tips tricks with this appreciated.

Alternator belt, thermostat and glowplug replace. And coolant flush and replace.

 

Then just check all the cables and electrics.

 

I have restored cars and campers in the past so feel quite confident. Tempted to take the engine out as it would be a lot more space, as I would need to repack the stern gland and drain the gearbox at the same time, just to be safe.

 

The engine is free turning and everything feels quite tight atm so quite happy it should run once all checked and aligned correctly.

 

Sorry for the billion questions but I want to dive right into it and get the engine sorted for peace of mind.

 

TIA

15984417565875762838249789854962.jpg

Link to comment
Share on other sites

You seem to have access to a manual so that's good. Non-synthetic 20W50 or  nowadays 15W40 oil will be fine.

 

Engine number - no idea but it won't matter for service parts. It could be of automotive, industrial or agricultural origin. its not a BMC format I recognise so it might be a marinser's number.

 

You will have to "worry" the glow plugs out unless you are very lucky. When out drill the carbon out of the holes. Check in the manual but I think its a 7/64 bi in a HAND drill. Coat with copper grease when refitting.

 

As you don't know the history of the engine get the injector drive skew gear lubricator jet and strainer out and make sure they are clean. Both are below the back of the exhaust manifold, the manual shoudl show you where.

 

I very much doubt you will be bale to drain all the fuel from the tank so you may have to use a pump. I suspect you will not have an inspection plate on the tank so I suggest that you start pumping from the bottom of the tank using a tube down the filler. Move it about all over the bottom of the tank. keep going until there is no sign of water in the fuel and the fuel being removed is bright red. Diesel is expensive and unlike petrol it deteriorates far less in storage, especially if it FAME (bio) free diesel.

 

Changing the oil filter is easy enough on most boats once you start taking the two bolts out of the block and taking the whole filter assembly off to change the filter.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I would get it running provided the oil etc is OK before you do much more, you may be spending when you don't need to. That way you will know the condition of the drive plate and gearbox too.

Oil pressure release valve is OK if the cone insert is not heavily ribbed..... do not stretch the spring.

 

Take the heater plugs out with the engine warm if you can, rock them backwards and forwards, they break off easily if you are heavy handed.

Send the injectors away for testing and setting, you will need all the washers replaced. Check the top hat injector protectors over with a torch whilst they the injectors are out.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Excellent thank you Tony, that is what I suspected with the engine number and glad to know they are the same, I've seen a few differences as in thermostat temps to open at different temperatures. I will prob contact a direct supplier to give me the correct items for the engine to avoid mistakes.

Worry does that mean with a hammer ? or do you just mean back and forth and ease them out so they dont snap.

 

Ok thanks for the advice on the injector drive skew gear lubricator jet and strainer I will get it done as well.

 

I was going to get a drill pump or battery pump to drain the tank as much as possible. It's been sat for 5 years in an unknown state so would poss look into staining or using what I could if there is a large amount.

 

Ok so it wouldn't be bad to keep the old oil filter, they look more expensive than the twist on, but life span is probably less so prob not cost effective. I also like the trad look to an engine.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

5 minutes ago, Tracy D'arth said:

I would get it running provided the oil etc is OK before you do much more, you may be spending when you don't need to. That way you will know the condition of the drive plate and gearbox too.

Oil pressure release valve is OK if the cone insert is not heavily ribbed..... do not stretch the spring.

 

Take the heater plugs out with the engine warm if you can, rock them backwards and forwards, they break off easily if you are heavy handed.

Send the injectors away for testing and setting, you will need all the washers replaced. Check the top hat injector protectors over with a torch whilst they the injectors are out.

I will make it run, I love diesels as they are straight forward ish with diagnosis, and the little sundries are worth replacing for the small cost they are worth it. And yes I will do the injectors once it is up running and get it fine tuned back to health. Thanks for the pointers, I thought the glowplug were screw ins?

I may ended up sending the injectors and pump to a fella whose done some refurb for me in the past to get them all tip top.

Thanks for the comments. I will be starting a build thread with my progress when I get started ?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 minute ago, JonT said:

Excellent thank you Tony, that is what I suspected with the engine number and glad to know they are the same, I've seen a few differences as in thermostat temps to open at different temperatures. I will prob contact a direct supplier to give me the correct items for the engine to avoid mistakes.

Worry does that mean with a hammer ? or do you just mean back and forth and ease them out so they dont snap.

 

Ok thanks for the advice on the injector drive skew gear lubricator jet and strainer I will get it done as well.

 

I was going to get a drill pump or battery pump to drain the tank as much as possible. It's been sat for 5 years in an unknown state so would poss look into staining or using what I could if there is a large amount.

 

Ok so it wouldn't be bad to keep the old oil filter, they look more expensive than the twist on, but life span is probably less so prob not cost effective. I also like the trad look to an engine.

 

I have no idea about the cost of the paper/felt oil filter elements nowadays but I would expect it to be broadly assimilate to a spin on.

 

Worry - 1/8 turn clockwise then the same anticlockwise a few times and the turn it a bit further. Yes to stop snapping the pins but with care they can be drilled out in situ if you accept a tip just might embed itself in a piston crown or get trapped under an exhaust valve. I did loads like that on the hire fleet.

 

Calcutt Boats are arguably the best bet for getting the correct parts but for service parts the online filter suppliers shoudl be fine. One you get number then a local motor factors will be fine. The fuel filter is a CAV 296

 

 

2 minutes ago, JonT said:

I will make it run, I love diesels as they are straight forward ish with diagnosis, and the little sundries are worth replacing for the small cost they are worth it. And yes I will do the injectors once it is up running and get it fine tuned back to health. Thanks for the pointers, I thought the glowplug were screw ins?

I may ended up sending the injectors and pump to a fella whose done some refurb for me in the past to get them all tip top.

Thanks for the comments. I will be starting a build thread with my progress when I get started ?

 

They are,  Tracy was describing the same as me.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Excellent that is very helpful thank you to both of you, it's a massive help to get clear info as they can be fiddly buggers, done a few old engines before so ready with my big hammer just in case ??

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I've got a 1.5 diesel in my narrowboat with the engine number 15 JH U/ D 6807. From the parts book for the J2 Commercial vehicle that these engines were fitted to the first prefix indicates the cubic capacity, with the letter J indicating a commercial vehicle. The U indicates Centre gear change gearbox [ an A would indicate automatic. ]  The D indicates diesel. The H after the J I can only comment that it was used for variations of engine type , I don't know what H type was . Not much help to you . I hate to be the one to correct Tony but I think the drill you need to reamer out the carbon in the glow plug hole is 11/64. Lovely old engines and so simple to work on . The canister oil filter is the same as early MGB's so plenty available . Similarly rocker cover gaskets same as MGB. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

6 minutes ago, Troyboy said:

I've got a 1.5 diesel in my narrowboat with the engine number 15 JH U/ D 6807. From the parts book for the J2 Commercial vehicle that these engines were fitted to the first prefix indicates the cubic capacity, with the letter J indicating a commercial vehicle. The U indicates Centre gear change gearbox [ an A would indicate automatic. ]  The D indicates diesel. The H after the J I can only comment that it was used for variations of engine type , I don't know what H type was . Not much help to you . I hate to be the one to correct Tony but I think the drill you need to reamer out the carbon in the glow plug hole is 11/64. Lovely old engines and so simple to work on . The canister oil filter is the same as early MGB's so plenty available . Similarly rocker cover gaskets same as MGB. 

Lots of MGB parts are common with the BMC  B block diesels 1.5D and 1.8D

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Troyboy said:

I've got a 1.5 diesel in my narrowboat with the engine number 15 JH U/ D 6807. From the parts book for the J2 Commercial vehicle that these engines were fitted to the first prefix indicates the cubic capacity, with the letter J indicating a commercial vehicle. The U indicates Centre gear change gearbox [ an A would indicate automatic. ]  The D indicates diesel. The H after the J I can only comment that it was used for variations of engine type , I don't know what H type was . Not much help to you . I hate to be the one to correct Tony but I think the drill you need to reamer out the carbon in the glow plug hole is 11/64. Lovely old engines and so simple to work on . The canister oil filter is the same as early MGB's so plenty available . Similarly rocker cover gaskets same as MGB. 

Thanks, that is why I said "I think" and "check the manual". Its one thing I shoudl remember but know I can't for some reason

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Hi guys i am just looking at the gearbox to check which oil i should use. As i see it, it looks like it needs high quality ATF mineral based, like in the pic

 

Screenshot_20200901-085924_eBay.jpg

 

Screenshot_20200901-085924_eBay.jpg

Edited by JonT
Needed extra pic for gearbox type
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 minute ago, Tracy D'arth said:

And the gearbox is? Or have I missed the vital bit of info?   Hurth and small mechanical PRM boxes up to PRM120 use ATF.

Its a hurth, sorry i am computer illiterate and can't work out how to put the picture of it on. Right yes so mine will be atf ?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 26/08/2020 at 14:45, Troyboy said:

I've got a 1.5 diesel in my narrowboat with the engine number 15 JH U/ D 6807. From the parts book for the J2 Commercial vehicle that these engines were fitted to the first prefix indicates the cubic capacity, with the letter J indicating a commercial vehicle. The U indicates Centre gear change gearbox [ an A would indicate automatic. ]  The D indicates diesel. The H after the J I can only comment that it was used for variations of engine type , I don't know what H type was . Not much help to you . I hate to be the one to correct Tony but I think the drill you need to reamer out the carbon in the glow plug hole is 11/64. Lovely old engines and so simple to work on . The canister oil filter is the same as early MGB's so plenty available . Similarly rocker cover gaskets same as MGB. 

The J2 vans were horrid things. The 1489cc B series petrol engine was much prefered. The 1500 diesel very slow and sluggish. The floor gearchange was opposite to normal, 1st and 2nd gear towards you, 3rd and top away from you. The column change was also opposite from normal. Away from you for 1st and second, toward you for 3rd and top, reverse was there if you could find it. You couldn't get the wheels off from under the very low wheel arches unless the vehicle was well jacked up with the suspension totally relaxed. Back breaking working on the brakes under the very low wheel arches. Wicked heavy steering.  Most were sold off cheap in fleets to the likes of GPO, gas boards ect. The J4 was quite an improvement but again the petrol engine was the favorite.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

7 hours ago, bizzard said:

The much prefered van of that era was the Ford Thames 400E 10-12,15 CWT. Reasonably easy to work on. Much faster and more comfortable to drive than others. Fast, powerful 1703cc Consul petrol engine, no diesels in them.

Actually you  could get them with Perkins 499s in them. 55 mph flat out but cheap to run. I ran one for years until it rotted out and then marinised the engine for a launch. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

38 minutes ago, JonT said:

 

That looks horribly like a Polar exhaust manifold. The reason I say horribly is because the Polar rubber end caps are expensive and not of the best quality (Polar are defunct). If your boat is definitely tank cooled with a dry exhaust then in the long term consider getting the ends of the manifold where the caps are closed  off wit welded aluminium plate.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

11 minutes ago, Tony Brooks said:

 

That looks horribly like a Polar exhaust manifold. The reason I say horribly is because the Polar rubber end caps are expensive and not of the best quality (Polar are defunct). If your boat is definitely tank cooled with a dry exhaust then in the long term consider getting the ends of the manifold where the caps are closed  off wit welded aluminium plate.

Ah ok i will strip the wrapping off it and have a look. I was in the future going tp custom make a stainless exhaust to give it a long life. Steel just dies too quick especially around water. So the rubber caps are there for flex and movement? Or are theyfor something else

Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 hours ago, JonT said:

Ah ok i will strip the wrapping off it and have a look. I was in the future going tp custom make a stainless exhaust to give it a long life. Steel just dies too quick especially around water. So the rubber caps are there for flex and movement? Or are theyfor something else

If the manifold is steel then its a Fred in a shed job. There are/were two main suppliers of exhaust manifolds for 1.5s, Polar and Bowman. Both used cast aluminium bodies and they are not that prone to serious corrosion. The rubber end caps and the heat exchanger core, if fitted, are different for each maker. You may or may not have the core inside the manifold if its a tank cooled boat but if you do its not doing anything. I can't see a second hose clip around the rear rubber so I suspect you have no core in there.

 

I am talking about the EXHAUST MANIFOLD - not the exhaust pipe, there is no wrapping on the manifold.

 

You may well find your exhaust pipe is made from 1.5" water pipe, not the flimsy stuff used on car exhausts. If so they last for very many years, especially since we have swapped to low sulphur diesel. There may be a flexible section in it and they do fail eventually but making that from solid stainless is more likely to result in damage rather than an extended life.

Edited by Tony Brooks
  • Greenie 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

20 hours ago, Tracy D'arth said:

The end caps have 2 diameters, the larger seals onto the exhaust/header tank, the inner seals onto the internal heat exchanger matrix if fitted for raw water cooling.

Ah ok thanks, i will have a look probably tomorrow will be starting on the engine.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

17 hours ago, Tony Brooks said:

If the manifold is steel then its a Fred in a shed job. There are/were two main suppliers of exhaust manifolds for 1.5s, Polar and Bowman. Both used cast aluminium bodies and they are not that prone to serious corrosion. The rubber end caps and the heat exchanger core, if fitted, are different for each maker. You may or may not have the core inside the manifold if its a tank cooled boat but if you do its not doing anything. I can't see a second hose clip around the rear rubber so I suspect you have no core in there.

 

I am talking about the EXHAUST MANIFOLD - not the exhaust pipe, there is no wrapping on the manifold.

 

You may well find your exhaust pipe is made from 1.5" water pipe, not the flimsy stuff used on car exhausts. If so they last for very many years, especially since we have swapped to low sulphur diesel. There may be a flexible section in it and they do fail eventually but making that from solid stainless is more likely to result in damage rather than an extended life.

Ah yes sorry i miss read i was exhausted its been non stop. No pun intended ?

 

 i will strip it down and see what kind of condition its in. That says to me that i could possibly use brass or get some custom made rubber maybe.

 

Ah ok i might just clean it up if its in good condition 

Freds me dad btw ??

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
 Share

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

We have placed cookies on your device to help make this website better. You can adjust your cookie settings, otherwise we'll assume you're okay to continue.