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fergyguy

Blocked Morso Squirrel

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I’m guessing I’m not the first to have this problem. Iv been on my boat 19 weeks now she has a Morso with backboiler fitted and if I light a fire it immediately dies. On checking the bowl shape lower cowl is still in place and I’m told this should have been removed when the boiler was fitted. I spent two evenings trying to flick the carbon from behind the boiler using thin sticks etc as space is so damn tight but in total I got almost two ash pans full. Iv used a chain ball and a brush on the flue but I’m convinced the cowl could be solid carbon and was thinking of using some drainage rods with a claw end to lower down flue and try to breakup said carbon. Now my questions are how difficult would it be for me to get the boiler out ( once Iv drained the system)so I can remove all build up and secondly how difficult will it be to then remove the cowl? Any advice would be appreciated.

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You lost me as soon as you stated talking about the bowl shape?

 

Have you swept the flue and do you have a baffle plate at the top of the stove and have you checked that it isn't full of ash and blocking the base of the flue where it meets the stove?

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3 hours ago, blackrose said:

You lost me as soon as you stated talking about the bowl shape?

 

Have you swept the flue and do you have a baffle plate at the top of the stove and have you checked that it isn't full of ash and blocking the base of the flue where it meets the stove?

New squirrels have a half bowl shaped cup screwed under the flue, it is recommended to remove this for use in a boat

  • Greenie 1
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I’m convinced this half bowl shape item is blocked so looks like boiler out job in order to remove it

Black rose. No baffle plate as boiler in stove . It appears the half bowl cowl on bottom of the flue should have been removed when stove was installed on my boat but the original owner left it and then fitted boiler so it’s looking like boiler out task to get to the cowl and remove it

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I'm sure I must be missing something in your description. But how could you clean the flue and end up with the two pans of waste from behind the boiler, which is normal after cleaning the flue, if the fire was so blocked. The fire seems to have had some use, to create that waste. I can only imagine the base of the flue might have some build up of exhaust deposits and could be restricting the flow of air. Secondly; have you quite got the knack of using the fire?

 

I also clean my Morso flue with a chain ball and flail. Not sure what the cowl is that you talk about. My stove is probably about 20 years old. The original heavy back boiler was removed and replaced with a stainless steel one a few winters ago. Should you ever need to remove your back boiler, it can be done; by removing the fire bricks and most of the grate fittings and withdrawing the boiler through the front of the fire. 

 

 

Edited by Higgs
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The ash in the pics definitely what I managed to flick from back of boiler. The cowl which looks like a bowl under the flue and above the tank should not be on the stove when used on a boat Iv now learnt. The cowl is held to roof of stove with 2 10mm bolts which I’m going to try and free tonight and try removal of said cowl. With all the crap Iv pulled out I’m convinced that this bowl shape cowl will be choked up but as the intake opening faces the rear of the stove getting at the build up is impossible other than brush and chain ball but if the crap is compacted the ball and brush is not going to shift it do removal is best course of action for several reasons. Iv had no issues on a day to day basis with the stove other than I did start to notice glass got blacked quicker of late and coals were not burning as well both issues I’m guessing down to a lack of draw on the flue

Treemonkey I can not see the image very clear does it stat what size the holding bolts are on the cowl I need to remove?

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2 minutes ago, fergyguy said:

The ash in the pics definitely what I managed to flick from back of boiler. The cowl which looks like a bowl under the flue and above the tank should not be on the stove when used on a boat Iv now learnt. The cowl is held to roof of stove with 2 10mm bolts which I’m going to try and free tonight and try removal of said cowl. With all the crap Iv pulled out I’m convinced that this bowl shape cowl will be choked up but as the intake opening faces the rear of the stove getting at the build up is impossible other than brush and chain ball but if the crap is compacted the ball and brush is not going to shift it do removal is best course of action for several reasons. Iv had no issues on a day to day basis with the stove other than I did start to notice glass got blacked quicker of late and coals were not burning as well both issues I’m guessing down to a lack of draw on the flue

Treemonkey I can not see the image very clear does it stat what size the holding bolts are on the cowl I need to remove?

Sorry, it's the best image I could find and it does get blurry as I zoom in as well, plenty of manuals on line though.

 

I removed mine when I fitted the stove and it was easy but that was without a boiler and an unused stove, I can't remember what sort of fitting was used

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5 minutes ago, fergyguy said:

The ash in the pics definitely what I managed to flick from back of boiler. The cowl which looks like a bowl under the flue and above the tank should not be on the stove when used on a boat Iv now learnt. The cowl is held to roof of stove with 2 10mm bolts which I’m going to try and free tonight and try removal of said cowl. With all the crap Iv pulled out I’m convinced that this bowl shape cowl will be choked up but as the intake opening faces the rear of the stove getting at the build up is impossible other than brush and chain ball but if the crap is compacted the ball and brush is not going to shift it do removal is best course of action for several reasons. Iv had no issues on a day to day basis with the stove other than I did start to notice glass got blacked quicker of late and coals were not burning as well both issues I’m guessing down to a lack of draw on the flue

 

This cowling does sound like a pain in the neck. It may be ok in a house setting, where the flue has more height.

 

 

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8 hours ago, fergyguy said:

I’m guessing I’m not the first to have this problem. Iv been on my boat 19 weeks now she has a Morso with backboiler fitted and if I light a fire it immediately dies. On checking the bowl shape lower cowl is still in place and I’m told this should have been removed when the boiler was fitted. I spent two evenings trying to flick the carbon from behind the boiler using thin sticks etc as space is so damn tight but in total I got almost two ash pans full. Iv used a chain ball and a brush on the flue but I’m convinced the cowl could be solid carbon and was thinking of using some drainage rods with a claw end to lower down flue and try to breakup said carbon. Now my questions are how difficult would it be for me to get the boiler out ( once Iv drained the system)so I can remove all build up and secondly how difficult will it be to then remove the cowl? Any advice would be appreciated.

I had exactly this problem on my boats Squirrel. Only I caused it myself by not removing the bowl shaped lower cowl at the base of the flue as is now recommended by Morso for boat installations. That instruction came afterwards. It is a hard thing to remove in situ. The back boiler prevents access. I made a tool out of a bent and flattened bit of copper pipe to remove ash and crud from the top of the cowl. Having a good coolie hat on top of the chimney helps as it prevents rain getting down when the fire is out and turning any ash sitting at the base in to a concrete like substance. Eventually one of the bolts holding it in rusted through and I was able to get the lower cowl out the way of the base of the flue while the flue pipe was removed. 

 

Removing the back boiler should be possible. I never tried this. You will need to remove the fire bricks on each side of the chamber. A good chance you may need to replace these if they break during removal. Then slacken and remove the pipe fittings and back nuts on the back outside and then waggle the back boiler out. The more ash you remove beforehand, the easier it should be.

When trying to remove the bolts holding the cowl on you'll almost certainly just shear the heads off. That is OK as they aren't used for anything else. M5, or M6 from memory, but not sure of size. It will be a horrible job. Wear long gauntlet gloves to keep yourself clean and prevent cutting your arms up trying to get your hands in to convoluted positions inside the stove. 

 

Jen

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1 minute ago, Higgs said:

 

The image is a bit small to make out the detail well. Got one any bigger?

 

 

I haven't no, I'm sure a bit of google could find a better one, as I understand it, it's part of the emission control in some way but because boat flues are limited in height it's recommended to remove them

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3 minutes ago, tree monkey said:

I haven't no, I'm sure a bit of google could find a better one, as I understand it, it's part of the emission control in some way but because boat flues are limited in height it's recommended to remove them

 

Thanks. I'm getting the general picture of this cowl. Luckily, I don't have any such thing on mine. I can, as well, get my hands in and around the top of the back boiler and remove most of the deposits from behind; finishing off with a vacuum. Some smokeless fuels are not particularly clean burning and are worse than others for creating buildup in the flue and acid, when mixed with condensation or rain in the flue. Will eat through your flue in no time. 

 

 

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The installation manual for a Morso 1412 "Squirrel" stove can be downloaded from https://morsoe.com/media/com_hikashop/upload/safe/72146800_-_1400_n-en_uk_-_defra_1826145192.pdf               Page 5 states 

"The smoke hood must not be fitted if the stove is installed on a boat where the flue height is likely to be less than 4.5M."

 

There is also a diagram on Page 5 Item 1 is the smoke hood

image.png.60d1664703826666721f3d4620b92ead.png

 
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There are two M6 hex head machine screws, 10mm AF spanner.

I have come across this before and had to grind the heads off the well seized screws to remove the baffle cowl thing. Its easier than removing the back boiler.

A brave man with a long sharp chisel could cut the screws I suppose.

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