Leaky Pump

[AjW]

Hi there,

 

My sureflow pump is leaking slightly. Here's a pic of where the leak is (blue arrow). Not a massive leak, but it drips and occasionally the pump kicks in to knowck the pressure back up.

 

The pump has a mfg date of 12-02 so I guess it is nearly 15 years old. Time for a replacement?

 

We've also got problems with the hot water flow to the shower. The accumulator delivers to a Palermo heater (6ft) and from there to the shower (6ft). But when the hot water is turned on the pressure drops so low that the gas goes out. We have turn the mixer tap off, wait for the pressure to build up and then turn the tap on again to get the boiler to fire up. The pressure drops after just a few seconds. Here is the gauge attached to the accumulator.

 

 

Red boxes show pressurised (~2 bar) and when water is flowing (~1 bar). Is the pressure too low at 1 bar? How can I adjust it? There are two spring valve things on the accumulator - a big one and a small one (blue arrows).

 

Adam

[Liam]

We have the same, or a very similiar pump to yours and we had the same problem a few weeks back with the pump leaking. Didn't realise until it came above the level of the floor at the rear of the boat

 

We did a botch job on it, as we were on holiday at the time. Actually you have just reminded me to source a new pump for replacement! Thanks..

 

Anyway, the problem is due to having to peices of plastic screwed together, with no sort of gasket. Have you tried tightening the screws up? This may solve the problem, but it didn't for us. I took the pump apart, added some sealant to form a gasket and because the screw was just turning, I replaced this with a small nut and bolt arrangement to hold it together. I can't be sure but I think our problem was exagerated slightly by the fact that only 2 of the 4 screws were not just loose but not screwed in at all. When the pump switched on it was able to jump about and vibrate, causing the failure.

[wonderdust]

Hi if the pump works ok have you thought about repair kits

link

 

 

 

Hi there,

 

My sureflow pump is leaking slightly. Here's a pic of where the leak is (blue arrow). Not a massive leak, but it drips and occasionally the pump kicks in to knowck the pressure back up.

 

The pump has a mfg date of 12-02 so I guess it is nearly 15 years old. Time for a replacement?

 

We've also got problems with the hot water flow to the shower. The accumulator delivers to a Palermo heater (6ft) and from there to the shower (6ft). But when the hot water is turned on the pressure drops so low that the gas goes out. We have turn the mixer tap off, wait for the pressure to build up and then turn the tap on again to get the boiler to fire up. The pressure drops after just a few seconds. Here is the gauge attached to the accumulator.

 

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1156/1360216420_9b5568920b.jpg/img]

 

Red boxes show pressurised (~2 bar) and when water is flowing (~1 bar). Is the pressure too low at 1 bar? How can I adjust it? There are two spring valve things on the accumulator - a big one and a small one (blue arrows).

 

Adam

[Alastair]

I think that the pressure may be too low in your accumulator. Try pumping it up.

[Theo]

Hi there,

 

My sureflow pump is leaking slightly. Here's a pic of where the leak is (blue arrow). Not a massive leak, but it drips and occasionally the pump kicks in to knowck the pressure back up.

 

The pump has a mfg date of 12-02 so I guess it is nearly 15 years old. Time for a replacement?

 

We've also got problems with the hot water flow to the shower. The accumulator delivers to a Palermo heater (6ft) and from there to the shower (6ft). But when the hot water is turned on the pressure drops so low that the gas goes out. We have turn the mixer tap off, wait for the pressure to build up and then turn the tap on again to get the boiler to fire up. The pressure drops after just a few seconds. Here is the gauge attached to the accumulator.

 

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1156/1360216420_9b5568920b.jpg/img]

 

Red boxes show pressurised (~2 bar) and when water is flowing (~1 bar). Is the pressure too low at 1 bar? How can I adjust it? There are two spring valve things on the accumulator - a big one and a small one (blue arrows).

 

Adam

The leak was curable on a boat that we borrowed (Blake). I took the pump apart and treated the mating surfaces to a bead of sealing compound bought from the first boatyard that we passed. I cannot remember the brand of the sealer. It worked very well and, two years later is still working.

 

The shower problem sounds as if the delivery from the pump is too slow. I wonder if there is something more to the pump leak than meets the eye. When you dismantle it you will find the diaphragm(s) have a good look at thtem to check that they are not holed. I imagine that you can get spare ones if you need them.

 

Nick

[Maverick]

Hi there,

 

My sureflow pump is leaking slightly. Here's a pic of where the leak is (blue arrow). Not a massive leak, but it drips and occasionally the pump kicks in to knowck the pressure back up.

 

The pump has a mfg date of 12-02 so I guess it is nearly 15 years old. Time for a replacement?

 

We've also got problems with the hot water flow to the shower. The accumulator delivers to a Palermo heater (6ft) and from there to the shower (6ft). But when the hot water is turned on the pressure drops so low that the gas goes out. We have turn the mixer tap off, wait for the pressure to build up and then turn the tap on again to get the boiler to fire up. The pressure drops after just a few seconds. Here is the gauge attached to the accumulator.

 

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1156/1360216420_9b5568920b.jpg/img]

 

Red boxes show pressurised (~2 bar) and when water is flowing (~1 bar). Is the pressure too low at 1 bar? How can I adjust it? There are two spring valve things on the accumulator - a big one and a small one (blue arrows).

 

Adam

 

If it has a MGF date of 12-02 isnt this December 2002 making it almost 5 yrs old? cud be wrong

[RLWP]

We have two pumps like that, and one leaked in exactly the place shown by the blue arrow. Annoyingly it leaked only when it was switched off! As ours is a weekend boat rather than a liveaboard that's its normal state. Lots of water in the bilge and a list to port.

 

We fixed it with a reconditioning kit and it has been fine ever since. Quite easy to do as well, apart from bleeding the inlet pipes. These pumps are great at moving water, rubbish at pumping air!

 

Richard

 

edited to put in missing words and remove an errant apostrophe caused by dyslexic keyboard.

Edited September 11, 2007 by RLWP

[John Orentas]

Hi Adam.

 

I have a similar set up to yours, after a few years of 'sodding about' with thermostatic and even ordinary mixing taps I came to the conclusion that Paloma's don't like such things fitted to the water output. I have ended up with a very reliable and simple arrangement with the hot water output piped directly to the shower head which has a very basic on/off ball valve.

 

I simply set the shower water temperature on the controls of the Paloma, been like that for years now never a problem. By the way the type of Paloma unit supplied for installation on boats should detect the flow of water not the pressure.

Edited September 11, 2007 by John Orentas

[DHutch]

Where only on our second surflo in 15 years (first one did about 10 years then the presure switch failed and was replaced like-for-like in a hurry).

- Its hard to know, but there are a lot of storys of shurflos failing, and the johnson pumps range is very good if you are buying new.

- Ofcause, there are more sureflos about than anyothers, which many be part of the reason there are more of them failing i know.

 

 

Daniel

[smileypete]

Hi there,

 

My sureflow pump is leaking slightly. Here's a pic of where the leak is (blue arrow). Not a massive leak, but it drips and occasionally the pump kicks in to knowck the pressure back up.

 

The pump has a mfg date of 12-02 so I guess it is nearly 15 years old. Time for a replacement?

 

We've also got problems with the hot water flow to the shower. The accumulator delivers to a Palermo heater (6ft) and from there to the shower (6ft). But when the hot water is turned on the pressure drops so low that the gas goes out. We have turn the mixer tap off, wait for the pressure to build up and then turn the tap on again to get the boiler to fire up. The pressure drops after just a few seconds. Here is the gauge attached to the accumulator.

 

 

Red boxes show pressurised (~2 bar) and when water is flowing (~1 bar). Is the pressure too low at 1 bar? How can I adjust it? There are two spring valve things on the accumulator - a big one and a small one (blue arrows).

 

Adam

 

Hi,

 

How is the pump switched on and off? Is it connected via the thing on top of the accumulator marked by the blue arrows? Are there then only two wires going to the pump itself?

 

If so maybe the cut in and cut out pressure is adjusted by these screws, and the cut-in pressure is set too low, so that the water heater cuts out before the pump cuts back in.

 

The leak can usually be sorted by removing the six screws around the pump head and putting a little leak sealer (eg Fernox LS-X) on the 'lip' around the edge of the membrane. I would then do up the screws loosely and give the sealer a few hours to set before finally tightening the screws.

 

cheers,

Pete.

[Alistair]

I have a similar set up to yours, after a few years of 'sodding about' with thermostatic and even ordinary mixing taps I came to the conclusion that Paloma's don't like such things fitted to the water output. I have ended up with a very reliable and simple arrangement with the hot water output piped directly to the shower head which has a very basic on/off ball valve.

 

I simply set the shower water temperature on the controls of the Paloma, been like that for years now never a problem.

 

Likewise. The temperature setting on the Paloma is simple and reliable - so why mix hot and cold (from the same supply) to attempt the same thing yourself?

[smileypete]

We have two pumps like that, and one leaked in exactly the place shown by the blue arrow. Annoyingly it leaked only when it was switched off!

 

Good point, reminds me that if resealing the edges of the diaphragm it needs doing on both edges, it can leak from the high pressure 'pumped' side or the low pressure tank fed side.

 

Sods law says if only one side is done it will leak on the other, so best do both at once...

 

cheers,

Pete.

[AjW]

Hey, cheers for the replies!

 

We bought the boat as is - mixer taps and all - usually we just set the boiler to hottish and keep the mixer tap in the hot position, but lately because the pressure and flow have been cutting in and out that's not been possible - too warm and the flow drops too quickly and the boiler goes off, too hot and well... the boiler goes off after a longer period (slower flow) but it's ermmm hot!

 

I gave the two bolts on the top a twist and have managed to lower the 2.1 bar down to 1.9 bar - now the pump doesn't leak so much; but I can't get the cut-in pressure to change. I'll have a play at the weekend.

 

Also looks like the pump is coming apart too (yes - mfg 2002! And yeah, it doesn't leak when pumping, but for a very short period after (back pressure?).

 

I shall let you know what wonders I find......

[RobinJ]

Also looks like the pump is coming apart too (yes - mfg 2002! And yeah, it doesn't leak when pumping, but for a very short period after (back pressure?).

A service kit will be cheaper than a new head which will be cheaper than a new pump.

Normally this sort of thing is caused by water freezing in the pump during the winter, so long as the casing is not cracked or deformed, it should be serviceable, and sometimes cleaning and re-seating is all that is required (about six bolts if I remember correctly).

Looking at the picture, the pressure swicth seems to be mounted on the accumulator rather than the pump, but as said, the switching pressure should be adjustable.

You may want to consider checking and possibly cleaning the whole system, there might be a clogged filter somewhere?