Heating questions

[Alan de Enfield]

4 minutes ago, Christine198807 said:

This sounds quite ideal, what is the current bss laws on propane canisters , I could easy store one in the cockpit but assuming ill need to chain it or something ?.

Have a read of this :

 

https://www.boatsafetyscheme.org/media/268789/ecp-private-boats-ed3_rev2_apr2015_public_final.pdf

 

There are specific requirements for storage of gas cylinders (do you not already have gas aboard ?)

 

Section 7.

 

 

[Christine198807]

1 minute ago, Alan de Enfield said:

Have a read of this :

 

https://www.boatsafetyscheme.org/media/268789/ecp-private-boats-ed3_rev2_apr2015_public_final.pdf

 

There are specific requirements for storage of gas cylinders (do you not already have gas aboard ?)

 

Section 7.

 

 

It's our first boat so we decided that we will work on each issue one at a time, which is why I'm watching our budget as we need to resolve cooking as well.

The boat we brought is lovely and with some good old work we can get her up to our standards.

Cooking is less of an issue at the moment as we often eat out a lot(too much) and lived off a hob for over the last 2-3 years.

 

Obviously I'm looking to follow all BSS rules and then reapply for a fresh BSS after.
I will have a professorial install many things , lucky we have good friends that can help here to keep it cheaper end,

[Mad Harold]

Just fitted a Chinese diesel heater to my boat (20ft Norman.It is the "all in one type"with integral fuel tank.

As has already been pointed out you will need longer exhaust and inlet pipes plus a proper insulated exhaust hull outlet (about £45).

Because of lack of space mine is fitted in the cupboard under the sink and initially I fitted a metal grill in the cupboard door for the heat to blow through,but it got too hot so now I simply slide the cupboard door open and it blows directly into the cabin.

I was initially worried about the electricity consumption,but after the start up it uses very little.My boat is powered by a 8hp outboard and so far there has not been a problem with keeping the battery charged.Cruising evey day and leaving the heater on overnight it has been ok.However,I could see a problem if you are stuck for a few days somewhere without running your engine.I do keep mine on the lowest heat setting (1.6hz) though.So far the heater has worked perfectly and even on the lowest heat setting is more than enough for a 20 footer's cabin.Don't know about the BSC as mine is not due for renewal for a few years,but providing there are no fuel leaks,and the exhaust is leak free and a proper hull outlet fitted,I guess it will be up to the individual inspector weather or not to pass it.

[Christine198807]

15 minutes ago, Mad Harold said:

Just fitted a Chinese diesel heater to my boat (20ft Norman.It is the "all in one type"with integral fuel tank.

As has already been pointed out you will need longer exhaust and inlet pipes plus a proper insulated exhaust hull outlet (about £45).

Because of lack of space mine is fitted in the cupboard under the sink and initially I fitted a metal grill in the cupboard door for the heat to blow through,but it got too hot so now I simply slide the cupboard door open and it blows directly into the cabin.

I was initially worried about the electricity consumption,but after the start up it uses very little.My boat is powered by a 8hp outboard and so far there has not been a problem with keeping the battery charged.Cruising evey day and leaving the heater on overnight it has been ok.However,I could see a problem if you are stuck for a few days somewhere without running your engine.I do keep mine on the lowest heat setting (1.6hz) though.So far the heater has worked perfectly and even on the lowest heat setting is more than enough for a 20 footer's cabin.Don't know about the BSC as mine is not due for renewal for a few years,but providing there are no fuel leaks,and the exhaust is leak free and a proper hull outlet fitted,I guess it will be up to the individual inspector weather or not to pass it.

It be wonderful if you could make say a you-tube video or something as not much installed units to look at on you-tube.
Luckily my BSS is not due to 2022 so plenty of time to sort things out, but I'm likely to have it checked after insulation to feel safer.

Are they loud to run ?.

Edited November 27, 2019 by Christine198807

[Alan de Enfield]

13 minutes ago, Christine198807 said:

It be wonderful if you could make say a you-tube video or something as not much installed units to look at on you-tube.
Luckly my BSS is not due to 2022 so plenty of time to sort things out.

Just a word of warning - your BSS is invalidated if you install something 'major' (gas / electricity / fuel) and it is not installed in accordance with the requirements.

 

The cheapest compliant way of adding a gas cylinder to a GRP boat is to have a 'basket' (holder) mounted on the transom. Meets all of the BSS requirements.

 

 

Edited November 27, 2019 by Alan de Enfield

[Jim Riley]

Since we had the Dawncraft 22 we got a 35 ft narrow boat, but it is powered by a Honda 20,which, like the OP, has 12ah output. This is fine for Led lights, radio, etc when cruising, however last year I fitted a 135w flexi solar panel, mppt controller and 450ah batteries. We can now run a waeco/dometic coolbox alongside everything else and a psw inverter for the laptop, hand power tools when I need them etc. I find the leisure batteries run the starter no problem, it's not that big, no need for separate  start and leisure batteries. 

Ps. With my first cruiser gas was in a cage on the back, on the Dawncraft there was room for an inboard stainless box with a low level vent to outside. 

Edited November 27, 2019 by Jim Riley

[Mad Harold]

11 minutes ago, Christine198807 said:

It be wonderful if you could make say a you-tube video or something as not much installed units to look at on you-tube.
Luckly my BSS is not due to 2022 so plenty of time to sort things out.

Been to the boat today to do a few bits and bats.Going tomorrow and although I don't have the tackle to do a video,I will try to take some photos.

[Christine198807]

4 minutes ago, Mad Harold said:

Been to the boat today to do a few bits and bats.Going tomorrow and although I don't have the tackle to do a video,I will try to take some photos.

Most appreciated if you can. x

6 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

Just a word of warning - your BSS is invalidated if you install something 'major' (gas / electricity / fuel) and it is not installed in accordance with the requirements.

 

The cheapest compliant way of adding a gas cylinder to a GRP boat is to have a 'basket' (holder) mounted on the transom. Meets all of the BSS requirements.

 

I know which is why i went back over to edit my post, i would have it checked again for bss after any completed work to be safe .

Any way to secure it to prevent thief's ?.

Edited November 27, 2019 by Christine198807

[Jen-in-Wellies]

Do you have shore electric power available at your usual mooring? Are you not planning to spend much time away from the mooring in winter? If the answer to both of these is yes, then perhaps an electric mains heater, driven from the shore power connection, might be your best option. Will keep you warm when sleeping, or staying on the boat in winter.

Given the small size of the boat and the space required for any sort of diesel, solid fuel, or gas heater, plus their fuel supply and the safety requirements you'd have to meet, then mains electric heating might be the best bet. Compact size. There are safety things to take in to account and corrosion protection to consider for the metal hull fittings, but no risk of explosion, or CO poisoning. When cruising in spring, summer and autumn, just wrap up warm during the day and put a thicker duvet on the bed. Don't cruise with an overnight stop in winter, unless it is very mild.

 

Obviously, none of this will work if you don't have shore power, so in that case ignore!

 

Jen

Edited November 27, 2019 by Jen-in-Wellies

[Mad Harold]

30 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

Just a word of warning - your BSS is invalidated if you install something 'major' (gas / electricity / fuel) and it is not installed in accordance with the requirements.

 

The cheapest compliant way of adding a gas cylinder to a GRP boat is to have a 'basket' (holder) mounted on the transom. Meets all of the BSS requirements.

 

 

Yes,Alan,I am aware that fitting a diesel heater could invalidate the BSC and insurance.

I am going to contact my inspector to have a look at my installation and as I have also altered the fuel system although it passed it's last BSC I was not satisfied with it,I will ask him to do a full BSC inspection.What some inspectors think is OK may well have another throwing their hands up in horror! Can't have it looked at yet because I have to install a spirit cooker.The gas locker is used to store my bottles of Guinness!

Edited November 27, 2019 by Mad Harold

[Christine198807]

3 minutes ago, Jen-in-Wellies said:

Do you have shore electric power available at your usual mooring? Are you not planning to spend much time away from the mooring in winter? If the answer to both of these is yes, then perhaps an electric mains heater, driven from the shore power connection, might be your best option. Will keep you warm when sleeping, or staying on the boat in winter.

Given the small size of the boat and the space required for any sort of diesel, solid fuel, or gas heater, plus their fuel supply and the safety requirements you'd have to meet, then mains electric heating might be the best bet. Compact size. There are safety things to take in to account and corrosion protection to consider for the metal hull fittings. When cruising in spring, summer and autumn, just wrap up warm during the day and put a thicker duvet on the bed. Don't cruise with an overnight stop in winter, unless it is very mild.

 

Obviously, none of this will work if you don't have shore power, so in that case ignore!

 

Jen

 

We plan to travel from London to Norfolk and back again a lot so we are looking for something that works on the go, so we will have a professional install what ever we chose, then a bss check again straight away.  It is most of importance to me to pass the bss which is why i ask about the diesel heaters as their not copper fittings etc.

[Jen-in-Wellies]

2 minutes ago, Christine198807 said:

 

We plan to travel from London to Norfolk and back again a lot so we are looking for something that works on the go, so we will have a professional install what ever we chose, then a bss check again straight away.  It is most of importance to me to pass the bss which is why i ask about the diesel heaters as their not copper fittings etc.

Is this travel going to be by sea round the coast, or by inland waterways? Whereabouts in Norfolk? Just trying to understand how the boat is going to be used.

[Christine198807]

12 minutes ago, Jen-in-Wellies said:

Is this travel going to be by sea round the coast, or by inland waterways? Whereabouts in Norfolk? Just trying to understand how the boat is going to be used.

Inland water, mostly a mixture of the ea and rct rivers/canals.

 

[Christine198807]

So far I'm looking at ether this https://www.ebay.co.uk/i/283301440009?chn=ps or a diesel heater as they could be installed in the cockpit.

Storing wood could be a nightmare itself ins keeping it dry,storing it and having to cut it to size could be tiresome over time,

[Alan de Enfield]

7 minutes ago, Christine198807 said:

So far I'm looking at ether this https://www.ebay.co.uk/i/283301440009?chn=ps

That example is not safe for fitting in boats it is an automotive kit.

 

"Now you can enjoy the luxury of central heating in your Van or Bus, whether you’re parked up or on the move – and it’s independent of your engine".

[Christine198807]

1 minute ago, Alan de Enfield said:

That example is not safe for fitting in boats it is an automotive kit.

 

"Now you can enjoy the luxury of central heating in your Van or Bus, whether you’re parked up or on the move – and it’s independent of your engine".

Could you point me to the marine version please if you don't mind, i thought they might be the same if they had the copper fittings.

[ditchcrawler]

Have you got the boat moved home to Thetford to do this work then?

[Christine198807]

10 minutes ago, ditchcrawler said:

Have you got the boat moved home to Thetford to do this work then?

Not yet as I ran into a license issue , long story short basically I need the river canal trust gold license to cover both rct and ea waterways however these licences always start at the beginning of the year and end of December no matter when you buy them, and they said that means I would need to pay for the whole of this year just for one month. So i told them I rather wait until the start of the year in Norfolk boards as my licences is until April then move the boat, but found a guy who knows the waterways(may be going to brandon or wissy instead of thetford) and will help us then. It is a real pain in the backside but saves us around £700. For now shoreline power and a convert heater will do.

Edited November 27, 2019 by Christine198807

[Alan de Enfield]

23 minutes ago, Christine198807 said:

Could you point me to the marine version please if you don't mind, i thought they might be the same if they had the copper fittings.

 Nothing to do with copper fittings - you need to get the flue gases OUT of the boat and not just dumped under the floor as they are in a vehicle.

 

Only the marine fitting kits (designed for boats) are supplied with the important bulkhead mounting bracket and propex through hull fitting.

 

I posted a link to the manufacturer in Post #22

If you speak with them they can give you the kit part number that you need.

You can then buy it from an authorised dealer or ebay as you decide.

 

Installation

The HS2000 is are supplied with a complete fitting kit to suit either vehicle or marine applications. In vehicles and caravans the unit is usually mounted in a bed-box or cupboard, flued downwards through the floor and out to the side of the vehicle using flexible stainless ducting. The 22mm i.d. ducts are supplied as standard in lengths of 750mm for vehicles and 1 metre for boats. The ends are finished with neat stainless steel end-caps which comply with EN624. The heat is ducted to one or more outlets through tough highly flexible 60mm or 76mm ducting. In the case of multi-outlet installations, the first outlet is an open outlet with directional control and the rest are closable and are used in conjunction with the appropriate sized plastic Y-branches. Marine applications feature an attractive polished stainless steel through hull fitting which accepts the stainless steel pipes for the flue outlet and the combustion air inlet. Extra ducting and stainless steel bulkhead mounting brackets are also part of the marine fitting kits.

The marine installation kit with 1 outlet is an additional £100, with 2-outlets £139

One supplier 
 

https://www.jonesboatchandlery.co.uk/propex

Edited November 27, 2019 by Alan de Enfield

[Christine198807]

31 minutes ago, Alan de Enfield said:

 Nothing to do with copper fittings - you need to get the flue gases OUT of the boat and not just dumped under the floor as they are in a vehicle.

 

Only the marine fitting kits (designed for boats) are supplied with the important bulkhead mounting bracket and propex through hull fitting.

 

I posted a link to the manufacturer in Post #22

If you speak with them they can give you the kit part number that you need.

You can then buy it from an authorised dealer or ebay as you decide.

 

Installation

The HS2000 is are supplied with a complete fitting kit to suit either vehicle or marine applications. In vehicles and caravans the unit is usually mounted in a bed-box or cupboard, flued downwards through the floor and out to the side of the vehicle using flexible stainless ducting. The 22mm i.d. ducts are supplied as standard in lengths of 750mm for vehicles and 1 metre for boats. The ends are finished with neat stainless steel end-caps which comply with EN624. The heat is ducted to one or more outlets through tough highly flexible 60mm or 76mm ducting. In the case of multi-outlet installations, the first outlet is an open outlet with directional control and the rest are closable and are used in conjunction with the appropriate sized plastic Y-branches. Marine applications feature an attractive polished stainless steel through hull fitting which accepts the stainless steel pipes for the flue outlet and the combustion air inlet. Extra ducting and stainless steel bulkhead mounting brackets are also part of the marine fitting kits.

The marine installation kit with 1 outlet is an additional £100, with 2-outlets £139

One supplier 
 

https://www.jonesboatchandlery.co.uk/propex

The second link is perfect thank you, I'll pass this information to my husband and see if any of our friends are qualified to install one or find someone.
Hoping I can get this sorted asap.

[Alan de Enfield]

1 minute ago, Christine198807 said:

The second link is perfect thank you, I'll pass this information to my husband and see if any of our friends are qualified to install one or find someone.
Hoping I can get this sorted asap.

Good Luck.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Next item on the agenda ?

[Christine198807]

1 minute ago, Alan de Enfield said:

Good Luck.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Next item on the agenda ?

Thank you It would be cooking, 2 hobs is enough for us as we currently lived on for the last 2-3 years.

[Momac]

2 hours ago, Christine198807 said:

This sounds quite ideal, what is the current bss laws on propane canisters , I could easy store one in the cockpit but assuming ill need to chain it or something ?.

Does the boat not already have a gas locker?

[Bod]

1 hour ago, Christine198807 said:

 

We plan to travel from London to Norfolk and back again a lot so we are looking for something that works on the go, so we will have a professional install what ever we chose, then a bss check again straight away.  It is most of importance to me to pass the bss which is why i ask about the diesel heaters as their not copper fittings etc.

http://www.jim-shead.com/waterways/mwp.php?LMCL=XzdCSW&wpage=Inland-Waterways-of-England.htm

This may help in planing your route.

 

Bod

[Christine198807]

1 minute ago, Bod said:

http://www.jim-shead.com/waterways/mwp.php?LMCL=XzdCSW&wpage=Inland-Waterways-of-England.htm

This may help in planing your route.

 

Bod

Many thanks but already brought some canal maps for when the times come.