dmr

The Tunnel leading up to Tuel Lane Deep Lock (Sowerby Bridge, Rochdale Canal) had some sort of comms system so the Lock keepers could signal to waiting boats (as boats should not enter the tunnel while the lock is emptying). It broke. Now the lock keepers have a whistle, they bend down towards the tunnel and blow the whistle and the sound travels through the tunnel quite well.

I think this might be a good year for the Rochdale, we have been seeing a boat most days recently. The rumours that the Rochdale is about to close (from this forum?). have possibly inspired a few boats to do it while they can 😀. We are down in Tod for a week or two (cheap beer Tuesday at the Lion) and I suspect there are a few more boat movements here than the summit suggesting that some boats turn rather than risking Manchester. Of the boats that I have spoken to at the summit most said that the Manchester 18 was hard work and unpleasant, but few have said it was a nightmare, so maybe things are improving.

I suspect boating is changing and there are more boats not moving much and less boats moving a lot. I also suspect that hire boating has seen a sharp decline in the last couple of years, bad weather and too many "boating season" stoppages have likely put people off, plus its an expensive holiday compared with cheap overseas stuff. However I suspect that out of season hire boating has probably increased. Except for the main runs into central Birmingham I think the BCN is not popular. If you want busy then the North Oxford and Braunston area, plus much of the South Oxford, Trent and Mersey through Stone, Llangollen etc. will please you 😀

But thats the problem and thats why our government is copping out on their carbon neutral plans, claiming that the UK makes only a tiny contribution to the worlds CO2 total. The world is in big boi trouble and we all need to do our bit to help. Just maybe if Europe makes a big effort then China and the USA just might feel pressured to fall in line, though China is actually doing pretty well in some ways. Like us, you already lead a fairly low impact lifestyle, but if you make just a little improvement and tell somebody else about you might just nudge them into action.....go on, buy that extra solar panel 😀

I suspect that there are two main sources of opposition to HVO 1, many boaters are tight fisted and resent paying an extra 20p/litre to save the planet (though rather more if forced to use 100% white HVO), and rather than admit to this like to find some other excuse. 2 The eco warrior purists/electric advocates who will accept nothing less than 100% electrification and 100% abolition of all liquid fuels. Its a liitle bit Like CAMRA who maintain 100% opposition to any keg/pressure dispensed beer and so have totally missed out on the revolution in excellent quality "craft" keg beers that is happening all around us.

Has anybody actually said HVO is carbon neutral? Most www sites that I have looked say it reduces CO2 by up to 90% (I think). I suspect 90% is still optimistic as I believe the production process is quite energy intensive, and I really don't know if all the transport "costs" are also factored in. To me there seams little point in producing HVO by cutting down the rainforest as this must give an actual increase in CO2, but then everyday I watch a diesel hauled train go past full of wood pulp that I believe has come from Canada and this counts as green energy. 😀

and I read somewhere that every wind turbine has a little diesel generator inside it, plus they get maintained by people driving diesel LandRovers and even Helicopters, lets get rid of them and go back to good old Britixh Coal 😀. There appears to be an argument "HVO is not perfect so I will just stick with dinodiesel". As a boater I am pretty much stuck with hydrocarbon fuels, but I reckon I have more than halved our boating carbon footprint over the last couple of years.

The main/only source of HVO in the UK is Crown who state their stuff is from 100% renewable/sustainable sources. Most of our food could be produced by slave labour in rain forest clearings but that doesn't mean that it actually is. HVO is only ever going to be available in small quantities for Niche markets, I just hope that boating is one of those markets. As long as it is from a good source then its much better the dinodiesel even though its still far from perfect. Electric cars are also not carbon neutral because they run on electricty made from gas. Yes, the .gov site does say that private electricity generation can use red diesel, its a bit confused/ambiguous about boating but essentially says its ok for boats as long as we don't go to Northern Ireland.

I will do a bit more Googling. I was trying to get HVO and at the time red HVO in drums was more than white at the petrol station, but I suspect the cost differential between HVO and diesel does vary a bit.

I thought this was the case too, but I spent a quick few mins on the www and could find no mention of it. Do you have a link? A 1000litre IBC is an alternative to 205l drums but both work out MUCH more expensive than bulk delivery, and unless you have a forklift on site there are significant unloading and handling challenges, though you can maybe invent a way to handle the drums. Some companies might be able to deliver with a tail lift truck....but might charge extra for this.

Its all interesting, in a frustrating sort of way. If I am correct that red can't be used for generation then boats must be an exception because we can use red for everything as long as we pay the extra duty for propulsion. I wonder what the situation would be if we put red in a separate generator out on the towpath rather than using the main engine? It is because we often only have one tank that this whoe 60:40 propulsion thing was invented. The ideal outcome would be to let boats use red HVO for everything, including propulsion, without any extra duty. I will keep my fingers crossed.

That would be a very interesting court case, but as you say, I think you would loose.

I think I was wrong, www says red can no longer be used in a generator, I had got confused between generation and non commercial heating. I think that currently HVO can not be used for heating so this pretty much prevents using any red HVO in a boat. This all relates to various subsidies on HVO which were devised without any consideratiion to boating. There are people working hard to get this changed as HVO makes a lot of sense on the Inland waterways, but paying full duty for propulsion, battery charging and heating is not attractive even if it was legal. Red diesel is currently pretty much limited to farming, forestry and boat heating. (and I think domestic heating though this is normally done with kerosine/ heating oil). A possible loophole is to get a trading licence so that your boat becomes a commercial boat......but this has more costs 😀

If you want to go to HVO then this project maybe makes a little bit more sense, but you still have the diffcultities are delivering to a boat. There are currently technical/legal issues with boats and HVO but some of us hope these will be resolved soon. Red HVO will cost significantly more than red diesel but still less than DERV. An advantage of a tank is that you can fill it up when the fuel price is good. Lots of second hand heating oil tanks on eBay for a good price but usually collection only and usually not bunded. A new installation must be bunded, and will also need an approved concrete base. Plastic is probably better than steel. I suspect the EA thing is more a formality rather than big issue. I think a new diesel tank installation needs to suck the fuel from the top of the tank with a pump rather than having a tap at the bootom like a heating oil tank, you need to find out how strict this is. You could maybe get a standby generator to justify buying in the red but this might be on the edge of legality. A nice old Lister might look good in the garden 😀. I do not know if an oil company will deliver to a bowser, and taking the bowser to a boatyard might or might not work, and as I said will negate the cost saving. Also you can't get red HVO this way.

Bowsers are expensive, that one is well over £1000 second hand, so not just a £few hundred. With this approach the OP will pay full marina price so looses the cost saving which was likely the driving factor. The marina might offer a small discount, but also might likely refuse to have anything to do with this. And he will have to park this ugly thing in his front garden. Any fuel tank installation is going to cost £1000, and more likely well over £2000. If this saves 20p/litre thats at least a 5000 litre payback. It takes quite serious boating to get through 1000 litres in a year so the payback time for this project is many many years.